[Wind Chaser]

Bottom line, the sale of a new car benefit every department except the new car department. 
The manufacturer is the big winner financially.

That really depends on whether or not they can sell enough vehicles. GM and Chrysler can hardly be considered big winners. 

[Bob in St. Louis]

Every king must die, so give credit where credit is due. GM, Ford, and Chrysler ruled the land for a century dude. Toyota has been #1 for what, two years now? They only got 98 more to go.

Personally, for my money, I'll stick with GM.

Bob

[macrojack]

Insert Quote
If memory serves, this is the first time I've ever agreed 100% with Macro. Hmm.. 

Cheer up, Bobbo. You agree with me because I'm right. Perfect motive. And don't be too hard on yourself about this situation. Worse things have happened to better people.

Now I suppose you're going to want me to prove this wasn't a fluke.

[Bob in St. Louis]

HA HA, No dude, it's all good. 

And on a lighter note, has anyone seen the offer Hyundai now has, > shown here <?
Not suitable for work.  But SO appropriate for the industry at this time.

Bob

[TheChairGuy]

And on a lighter note, has anyone seen the offer Hyundai now has, > shown here <?

Bob...I think Hyundai has had that program for many months now.  It's kept their sales pretty strong thru the past year relative to most of the rest. 

I think Subaru is the only other make that did relatively well in sales for 2009 (not sure why other than their largest vehicle is fairly small by most standards...tho not necessarily fuel efficient as they are all 4-wheel drive at Subey)

John

[jackman]

Bob...I think Hyundai has had that program for many months now.  It's kept their sales pretty strong thru the past year relative to most of the rest. 

Hyundai has had that program in place?  Are you sure you watched the video.   Funny stuff.

[TheChairGuy]

Ha - didn't know it was a spoof as an Assurance Program does exist at Hyundai since January 2009:

http://www.hyundaiusa.com/about-hyundai/news/corporate_assuarance_2010-20091229.aspx

Hyundai will extend the vehicle return option through 2010, continuing the unique program that permits Hyundai customers to return their new vehicle if they unexpectedly lose their income

John

[jqp]

Do they even know what is really happening with the acceleration issue?

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/us/2010/02/14/vosot.rouge.wave.cnn?hpt=C2

[mshan]

The company built its reputation on quality – certainly on being higher-fidelity than U.S. carmakers. Through the 1980s and 1990s, Toyota's executives ran the company on the principle of kaizen, or "continuous improvement." It's a method of building in total quality management while making employees more effective.

But in 1999 Toyota listed its shares on the New York Stock Exchange and made growth an imperative. In the 2000s, Toyota found itself in a race to become the biggest automaker on earth. Toyota made 4.8 million cars and trucks in 1999, and nearly twice as many -- 8.5 million -- in 2008. The company set a goal of making the Camry the best-selling car in the U.S. – a title it won in 2003 and has held since. In 2008, Toyota passed General Motors to become the world's biggest automaker. GM had held the ranking for 77 years.

Toyota, built on fidelity, drove to become the ubiquitous, superconvenient carmaker. To get there, Toyota expanded manufacturing, spreading it all over the world. Along the way, Toyota officials recognized the danger to its own brand. It knew that fidelity could be harmed. "Toyota is so big now," Teruo Suzuki, a Toyota general manager told Fortune in 2005. "We make so many cars in so many different places with so many people. Our greatest fear is that as we keep growing, our ability to maintain the discipline of kaizen will be lost."

http://www.dailyfinance.com/story/company-news/the-trade-off-how-toyota-made-the-same-mistake-as-starbucks/19354955/

[geezer]

CEOs and politicians have never understood how to deal with problems. I drive a Toyota product (not on any recall list) and expected to stay with Toyota in future, but I'm not so sure now. If they had owned up to the problems and notified the public  early on, I probably would feel more confident about their products than I now do.

[Wind Chaser]

If they had owned up to the problems and notified the public  early on, I probably would feel more confident about their products than I now do.

Sometimes it takes a while to recognize there is a problem.  A trend is different from an anomaly.  Until a pattern of consistency emerges and is identified, it is impossible to own up to it.

I still cannot imagine owning anything but a Toyota - well maybe a Honda - but I still prefer Toyota to anything else. 

[jackman]

Sometimes it takes a while to recognize there is a problem.  A trend is different from an anomaly.  Until a pattern of consistency emerges and is identified, it is impossible to own up to it.

I still cannot imagine owning anything but a Toyota - well maybe a Honda - but I still prefer Toyota to anything else.

Trust me, after reading your comments on this thread, your statement goes without saying.  This thread started out with Toyo Fan-boys and girls belly-aching about how Toyota got a raw deal, how this whole recall thing was a product of the US Gov and the media, and how they would never own anything but Toyota...blah, blah, blah.  Some people said it was overblown because not enough people have been killed, or something to that effect. 

I read earlier today that 31 people have died as a result of Toyota's product defects and that they may have known about this a long time before they actually gave any warning or alerted their loyal consumers to the potential dangers of driving certain Toyotas.  What is it going to take before the Toyota-Fan club on this site starts to see things clearly?   How many people have to die and what type of evidence will have to be uncovered before people in the fan-club start to see the light?  Toyota is paying a massive price for what appears to be the largest and most potentially damaging recall in modern auto history.  Unfortunately, it appears they have earned everything they are getting. 


Cheers and drive safely!

Jman

[jackman]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100223/ap_on_bi_ge/toyota_recall

Now Toyota says the recall won't totally fix the accelerator issues?  

In separate news, Toyota under investigation by the US Gov. regarding allegations they knew there was a problem but decided not to fix it in order to save $$$???

Toyota president admits and will testify to congress "We grew too big, too fast in the US..."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100223/ap_on_bi_ge/toyota_recall_president_2

Where are the Toyo Fan-boys?   Anybody want to change your answers?  I hope your silence is not crash related.  Cheers.

[JLM]

Sorry for posting without reading the thread, but I've owned several Toyota cars (have a 09 Corolla now).  My buying criteria:  1. Reliable; 2. Dealership; 3. Design.

Toyota has the best dealership in my area, period.  And until this episode, rock solid reliability.  Their designs (except for some of the Lexus models) have been universally dull.  Now, as a brand, they have been shown to be one trick ponies (reliability).  Without that they have very cards left to play.

Now I believe the safety recalls is way out of proportion overshadowing their overall record for reliability, but the media and politicians will have their heyday.  Why can't "reasonably intelligent" drivers simply shift into neutral and pull over?  I had a Saab in 1980 that did the same thing, so I just down shifted and it returned to normal function, never to bother again.

[macrojack]

Wouldn't be nice to see our powers go after Goldman-Sachs, AIG, B. of A., etc., the way they are going after Toyota?

[Bob in St. Louis]

Why can't "reasonably intelligent" drivers simply shift into neutral and pull over?

Sitting here in the trenches listening to these folks, I can tell you the vast majority of the population requires someone else to be held liable for such things. They may be "reasonably intelligent" as you say, but they're too used to the cars wrapping them in living room comfort, poking at the touch screen satellite navigation and chatting on the Bluetooth to pay attention to driving the machine. How dare you add 'piloting' and resposibility to the list of multitasking they're already performing? Car nowadays are designed to do our jobs for us.

[jackman]

Wouldn't be nice to see our powers go after Goldman-Sachs, AIG, B. of A., etc., the way they are going after Toyota?

How many people have died directly as a result of GS, AIG and B of A products?   

Toyota made reliable cars for a long time and they cut corners, possibly because, as their chairman put it "they grew too fast, too soon".  Now they are being called on the carpet as a result of their bad actions.  This is how it works.  If you make products that kill people and cover it up, you have to answer for your bad decisions. 

If the Japanese allowed American cars to be sold in their country (oh wait, they don't because our cars are inferior, right? ) what do you think would happen if our cars were responsible for people getting killed and there were indications American auto execs knew about the problem and chose not to act in order to max profit?  I guess we'll never know because their market will always be closed to American cars (for the mostpart). 

[lonewolfny42]

Car nowadays are designed to do our jobs for us.

Bet they don't do windows....

[jackman]

Their designs (except for some of the Lexus models) have been universally dull. 

Nothing dull about a car that suffers from sudden acceleration careening down a mountain road (see Camry).   The only thing more exciting is a car with a severe brake malfunction (see Prius).  Or maybe a car with a severe steering malfunction/design flaw (see Corola).  No brakes, sudden acceleration and bad steering.  At least they don't burst into flames when rear ended (see Pinto). 

Cheers,

J

[srb]

At least they don't burst into flames when rear ended (see Pinto).

Or roll over (see Ford Explorer - 203 deaths + 700 injuries).
 
Steve