[TheChairGuy]

Bill Berndt - if you're still checking in on this topic...no go on Thursday, May 28 for me.

Big doin's at my company taking precedent

How 'bout week of June 1....say Thursday June 4 some time late morning till whenever?

Sonny/Tuan expressed interest in being there and there's another fella' nearby (I talked to him yesterday) interested in coming by as his office is closeby.  He's slowly catching the vinyl fever and I think he's ready for a full-scale infection now

John

[Berndt]

John, sounds good.
Lets PM?
I got the rb300 mounted up and swinging
Look forward to you hearing what YOU started me on a few years ago.
Vinyl fever?
Ironic how sick it is...
I think I am only in the first stages.

[BobM]

John, I've found the following method worked very well for me when I first got my new tonearm.

Get some male RCA's from Rat Shack - they don't have to be of any quality. Then get some solid core wire from Home Dopey. Solder the wire to the RCA jacks and put the free end into the cartridge clips (unsoldered) of the tonearm. Then plug the RCA jacks into your CD player. Plug the tonearm interconnect into a non-phono input on your preamp.

In effect you just created an interconnect that runs through your tonearm. Now burn baby, burn for 100 hours. You will run more signal through those wires in 100 hours than you would playing records for 100 years. True burn in of all that dielectric.

Enjoy,
Bob

[twitch54]

I have the bearing/motor at maybe 30 hours now and I do sense a subtle betterment with 'timing' or speed accuracy.  So, it's pretty good at 20 hours...but seems to benefit from more time spun.

totally agreed, when I intially put the 'super platter' on my Aries III I though I had taken a step backwards, faith was restored in 10-20 hrs.

So, my earlier jab that unipivots might have weak bass may be nuthin' more than blather.  It may well take time for the dielectric to break in.

I'm a believer that it's the dielectric that takes the break-in time...not the wire itself.  I've heard it countless times with every kind of wire imaginable. Teflon (which is probably what VPI uses) is the longest and plastic/poly, cotton and other materials are rather fast to nearly no time at all.

I did not notice this as an issue...perceived or otherwise, perhaps since my 10.5i has the Nordost wiring this was minimized ??

[TheChairGuy]

Get some male RCA's from Rat Shack - they don't have to be of any quality. Then get some solid core wire from Home Dopey. Solder the wire to the RCA jacks and put the free end into the cartridge clips (unsoldered) of the tonearm. Then plug the RCA jacks into your CD player. Plug the tonearm interconnect into a non-phono input on your preamp.

Enjoy,
Bob

I'd love to...but, can I fly you out 2800 miles to solder those wires for me?

I don't solder, or at least when I did decades ago, I did it rather poorly so I'm not apt to try again for a while - if ever. I've got a few skills, use them the best that I can muster, but soldering is just not my balliwick.

John

[BobM]

John,

That soldering does not have to be perfect. It is just a temporary rig to help with burn in of the tonearm wires. It can be sloppy and gross, as long as a signal is getting through. Hell, you could probably use some kind of clip, if you can rig it up.

Just a thought and technique that I fould useful to help get those wires in prime shape so you can get on with listening to music.

Bob

[TheChairGuy]

Thx Bob - another 100 hours and it'll sound fine tho I think.  It's not that hard to listen to right now

Well, I am listening to John Lennon's 'Imagine' now....which has a constant piano thoughout.  Normally, this is where I find un-regulated belt drives fail relative to direct drive decks.

Well, guess what, no discernable pitch wavering so far as I can tell next to direct drive!  I now understand why Harry Pearson of VPI say that the Classic does not benefit as measurably from the SDS unit as his other decks do. 

The speed accuracy, to my less-than-perfect pitch sensitive ears, sounds pretty dang good to me.  I think any wavering in the presentation might have been the 'phasiness' inherent in the wire/dielectric of the tonearm wiring. It is now sounding a bit larger/bolder/more distinct as it breaks in (the motor and or bearing could be benefitting from the 40 hours spin time / 15 hours actual playback, too)

I might even be hearing the bass lines a bit more distinctly than before.

So far, quite an achievement here for $2500 with arm

John

[Scottdazzle]

John,

Thanks for the update.  I am very sensitive to pitch fluctuation, too and have been concerned about this.  I can't wait for mine to get here!     I am table-less now that I sold my beloved Thorens TD-125 and SME.   

Scott

[TheChairGuy]

Never, never be table-less, Scott.

The alternatives to vinyl aren't good enough

John

[mountaineagle]

Pity about the currency fluctuation for us poor Brits! Been quoted ?2470 for the Classic, arm & VPI's fitted Dynavector DV20X.

Admittedly, that does not include the shipping I would pay if I bought from the USA but still seems a bit of a difference.

Would be interested to know if anyone thinks this is an ok price here in the UK or whether there is a reputable dealer I can buy from in the USA as I note the deck is $2500 ( without a cartridge ) on USA internet dealer sites.

John,

Maybe you may say that as it runs in it is, in your opinion, worth it irrespective of the differential?

Greg

[TheChairGuy]

Pity about the currency fluctuation for us poor Brits! Been quoted ?2470 for the Classic, arm & VPI's fitted Dynavector DV20X.

Admittedly, that does not include the shipping I would pay if I bought from the USA but still seems a bit of a difference.

Would be interested to know if anyone thinks this is an ok price here in the UK or whether there is a reputable dealer I can buy from in the USA as I note the deck is $2500 ( without a cartridge ) on USA internet dealer sites.

Actually Greg, it doesn't seem too bad a price

Here in US, the VPI Classic is $2500 and the Dynavector DV-20x is $680 = USD$3180. At today's exchange rate that's 1,997.15 GBP.  The premium you are paying is 19.5% (before shipping costs added in....and its a whopper at 64lbs/~28kg)

I assume you'd then get hit with 15% VAT upon entry into the UK?  If so, your premium is 34.5%.

Consider the screwing we in the US get if we want to buy, say, a similarly top-notch deck here in the Rega P-9.  It costs USD$4995.00 here from dealers - that's 3,136.42 GBP.

However, to buy that same deck in the UK (of course one would have to find one with the right pulley and 115v motor) it's 2542 GBP, or USD$4,046.86 or a premium of 19%.

Seems similar until you factor in one grand statistic...that of VAT.  As non-Brits, we shouldn't have to pay VAT of 15%.  So, the real price for us non-Brits for the Rega P-9 bought out of the UK (again, assuming we can find it with the right pulley and 115v motor) is 2160.70GBP; or, USD$3,439.94. 

So, as it turns out, we are getting screwed to the tune of 31.2% premium over here for a Rega P-9.  Reasonably comparable to the screwing you are getting at 34.5% after importation with VAT.

Of course, you do have to factor in shipping to your equation, which may be another 60GBP for such a heavy table by US Postal Service (if they even ship this way - likely the cheapest option to the UK).

How you may like the sound of the VPI Classic, or any table, is a subjective decision.  But, how much do you pay in the UK there for a 29kg table complete with 10.5" arm? 

An SME arm alone in that size is likely to be 1500 GBP (just taking a swipe at it) or fully 40% of what the VPI Classic, arm and quality (fitted) cartridge would be.

By almost any perspective, the table sounds at least, quite good. As well, your screwing is no worse than ours in buying Brit tables of similar ilk.

I love spending someone else's money but, if you have it to spend it and need / want a new table.....you seem to be making a sound decision of a VPI Classic + Dynavector DV-20x for your hardearned cash on both and absolute and comparitive scale

John (Business major, if you hadn't known previously )

[mountaineagle]

Thanks, again, John for your advice 

Its a compelling argument and I will be listening to the Classic when it is received at the Dealers here in the UK, shortly.

In the meantime, I will await further updates, from you, as the deck runs in and you satisfy yourself with both the sound and the set-up as a whole.

Looking forward, after many years, to rejoining the real world of vinyl. 

Greg

[TheChairGuy]

In the meantime, I will await further updates, from you, as the deck runs in and you satisfy yourself with both the sound and the set-up as a whole.

Greg

The set-up is nearly as easy as can be, actually - little to no issues there.

The finger lift on the headshell is long and thin....easy to use and lift the arm with one finger and no slipping (a good many arm makers screw this up bad)

The arm detaches instantaneously - allowing you to switch cartridge as easily as any non-P mount.  Far easier than removing a retaining nut and assemble on, say, any Rega, Origin Live, SME or other tonearm.

There is no suspension to fiddle with and the feet are luxuriously built to withstand feedback - so set up is a breeze

About my only nit-pik about it is that the arm counterweight is not threaded to the arm, making fine adjustments for downforce a LOT easier.  Outside of the mass-produced Japanese makes, this is not found in the specialist turntable world.  Pity, as it makes adjusting for downforce/VTF much easier and removes one burden from cartridge/turntable setup.

Greg, setup is not the issue here - it's very well thought thru.  It's sound quality, your budget and or if there is another way for you to step back into vinyl in a less expensive way.

I have been brilliantly happy with playback from JVC direct drives bought for $50, $100 and $450 the past 3+ years on my return to vinyl.  It remains to be seen if I like the VPI Classic more than my JVC QL-Y66F ($450.00).

Right now, it does seem to be playing bigger/bolder/more effortlessly as the motor, bearing and tonearm wiring/dielectric wear-in.

Last night playing John Lennon was the first time in a week of ownership that something sounded essentially 'right' with the deck   I can't always accurately describe why it sounds right....but it's moving in a very positive direction as of last night (~15 hours playback and ~40 hours spinning the motor/bearing)

It is already quite a bit more speed accurate than the non-SDS HW-19 Mk. III.  That in itself, to me, is a big plus in it's favor many belt drive decks at any similar price.

John

[BobRex]

About my only nit-pik about it is that the arm counterweight is not threaded to the arm, making fine adjustments for downforce a LOT easier.  Outside of the mass-produced Japanese makes, this is not found in the specialist turntable world.  Pity, as it makes adjusting for downforce/VTF much easier and removes one burden from cartridge/turntable setup.

John, the counterweight isn't threaded to the arm because the weight is offset.  If you tried rotating the weight is would muck up azimuth big time.  I thought the 10 had the weight adjustment at the end of the stub.  Isn't there a hex screw at the back?  This can be threaded in and out to fine adjust the tracking weight.

The only arm I can think of with a "threaded" offest weight is the SME, all other arms (Basis, Schroeder, Mitchell techno weight, ...) use a sliding weight and rely on friction or a set screw to hold the weight in place.

[TheChairGuy]

John, the counterweight isn't threaded to the arm because the weight is offset.  If you tried rotating the weight is would muck up azimuth big time.  I thought the 10 had the weight adjustment at the end of the stub.  Isn't there a hex screw at the back?  This can be threaded in and out to fine adjust the tracking weight.

Bingo, Bob!  Hadn't thought of that - thanks

Indeed, on a fiddly unipivot the azimuth would be mighty screwed up with a threaded counterweight.

Yup, it's got a lockdown hex screw that you use to secure the counterweight 

John

[mountaineagle]

Further to what has been mentioned previously I have been looking to buy an end of record tonearm pickup device like "The Lift" which is no longer available.

Apart from checking our ebay has anyone any suggestions where you can buy one and, for a novice like me, will it be difficult to fit so it does not mess up the arm?

Greg 

[orthobiz]

Pity about the currency fluctuation for us poor Brits! Been quoted ?2470 for the Classic, arm & VPI's fitted Dynavector DV20X.

Admittedly, that does not include the shipping I would pay if I bought from the USA but still seems a bit of a difference.

Would be interested to know if anyone thinks this is an ok price here in the UK or whether there is a reputable dealer I can buy from in the USA as I note the deck is $2500 ( without a cartridge ) on USA internet dealer sites.

Actually Greg, it doesn't seem too bad a price

Here in US, the VPI Classic is $2500 and the Dynavector DV-20x is $680 = USD$3180. At today's exchange rate that's 1,997.15 GBP.  The premium you are paying is 19.5% (before shipping costs added in....and its a whopper at 64lbs/~28kg)

I assume you'd then get hit with 15% VAT upon entry into the UK?  If so, your premium is 34.5%.

Consider the screwing we in the US get if we want to buy, say, a similarly top-notch deck here in the Rega P-9.  It costs USD$4995.00 here from dealers - that's 3,136.42 GBP.

However, to buy that same deck in the UK (of course one would have to find one with the right pulley and 115v motor) it's 2542 GBP, or USD$4,046.86 or a premium of 19%.

Seems similar until you factor in one grand statistic...that of VAT.  As non-Brits, we shouldn't have to pay VAT of 15%.  So, the real price for us non-Brits for the Rega P-9 bought out of the UK (again, assuming we can find it with the right pulley and 115v motor) is 2160.70GBP; or, USD$3,439.94. 

So, as it turns out, we are getting screwed to the tune of 31.2% premium over here for a Rega P-9.  Reasonably comparable to the screwing you are getting at 34.5% after importation with VAT.

Of course, you do have to factor in shipping to your equation, which may be another 60GBP for such a heavy table by US Postal Service (if they even ship this way - likely the cheapest option to the UK).

How you may like the sound of the VPI Classic, or any table, is a subjective decision.  But, how much do you pay in the UK there for a 29kg table complete with 10.5" arm? 

An SME arm alone in that size is likely to be 1500 GBP (just taking a swipe at it) or fully 40% of what the VPI Classic, arm and quality (fitted) cartridge would be.

By almost any perspective, the table sounds at least, quite good. As well, your screwing is no worse than ours in buying Brit tables of similar ilk.

I love spending someone else's money but, if you have it to spend it and need / want a new table.....you seem to be making a sound decision of a VPI Classic + Dynavector DV-20x for your hardearned cash on both and absolute and comparitive scale

John (Business major, if you hadn't known previously )

I am dizzy,,,,,,,need to lay down and absorb all the infooooormatiionnnn

[doug s.]

Further to what has been mentioned previously I have been looking to buy an end of record tonearm pickup device like "The Lift" which is no longer available.

Apart from checking our ebay has anyone any suggestions where you can buy one and, for a novice like me, will it be difficult to fit so it does not mess up the arm?

Greg

greg, aside from ebay, i would do a websearch for this, as well as for the audio technica iteration, and the thorens q-up.  i do not know anywhere that you can get these off-the-shelf.  i have set up all three iterations, the a-t and the thorens were the easiest, imo; the "lifter" was a bit tricky.  but i cannot imagine damaging anything unless you have ten thumbs.     and, once set up, they all work great.  one thing that needs to be checked is if you have thick (180g) winyl, you need to be sure the lift setting is high enough for those, as well as the standard 120g albums.

doug s.

[mountaineagle]

Thanks, Doug.

I may try and get a dealer to do it for me as ,embarrassingly, I am jumping from no vinyl to a decent deck and I wont know what I am doing! 

Learning though by listening to you lot 

Greg   

[TheChairGuy]

I am dizzy,,,,,,,need to lay down and absorb all the infooooormatiionnnn

Hell, that was Kindergarten stuff for me.

Don't quite your day job, Doc

If it's any solace, I scream and faint like a girl at the sight of blood oftentimes

btw, your periphery ring went out to you on Tuesday...

John