Tyson's V2 Venuette DIY Build

Tyson · « **Reply #120 on:** 2 Oct 2010, 03:30 am »

I find the break in process fascinating - yesterday my V2's were sounding so muffled that it seemed like I had literally put a blanket over them. Today, they were back to a bit spitty sounding. Right now I still have the Sonicap I only in the crossover, but on Monday I will have the Platinum bypass caps for the tweeter and the Gen II bypass cap for the midrange, per Danny's rec. Obviously it will take a while to get these newer caps broken in as well. Plus I plan to build a line level low frequency filter for my tube amp that's driving the mids/highs, so that it takes some of the strain off of it (and the midrange driver) from trying to reproduce the bass frequencies.

Based on using the SET amp today, it seems as though the V2 is an efficient speaker, but not an easy load due to the midrange being driven full range in the bass region. I'm willing to bet that filtering the signal a bit will really open it up and make it more SET friendly. The other thing we noticed is that it's slightly dynamically restrained when music "explodes". Not so much in the bass, which really hit that intensity very nicely. But, in the mids, they just seemed to not quite reach those most intense peaks with as much force as we're used to.

Danny Richie · « **Reply #121 on:** 2 Oct 2010, 10:49 pm »

Actually the coaxial driver is REALLY easy to drive. The whole thing is a smooth 8 ohm impedance and the impedance at Fs is really high so there is no current demands at all on the amp.

Some type of Fmod module or small value cap in line with the RCA input to the amp will also really lighten the load on the amp keeping it from seeing any program material below the Fs of the driver.

Tyson · « **Reply #122 on:** 2 Oct 2010, 11:54 pm »

Yep, already ordered a 0.047 uF cap and rca connectors to make a line level bass filter. I'll have to try the SET amp again once I have it installed. I think this particular amp just "really" doesn't like to see a bass signal.

Pez · « **Reply #123 on:** 3 Oct 2010, 05:58 am »

The other big problem we had was gain matching. Seemed like my amp has too much gain and we could never match it appropriately to the woofers the way Tyson's system is currently setup.

Tyson · « **Reply #124 on:** 6 Oct 2010, 02:51 am »

Agreed. Even with the speaker level connections, it was hard to get the subs dialed in perfectly.

I ordered and received some Sonicap Bypass caps for the crossover, per Danny's recommendation. I got a pair of .022uF Platinums per speaker to bypass the 2 caps in the tweeter circuit, and one 0.1uF Sonicap Gen II per speaker to bypass the midrange cap.

The crossovers come stock with the Sonicap Gen 1 cap, and they are pretty good, but the bypass with Platinums and Gen 2's clearly improve them. They are still breaking in but already there's more coherence between the mids/highs and more resolution and better smoothness. Very nice improvement, for not a lot of cash. Thanks Danny!

My only question - why use the Gen 2 on the mids and not just go with another Platinum in that spot? Cost? Or some other reason?

corndog71 · « **Reply #125 on:** 6 Oct 2010, 02:00 pm »

If you can afford more platinums then go for it!

Danny Richie · « **Reply #126 on:** 6 Oct 2010, 02:43 pm »

Those by-pass caps kind of do two things.

They lower the dissipation rate of the bundle or the other cap that they are with so that there is less stored energy.

It also allows the highest frequency range to pass through (around 20kHz and above) so the cap being by-passed can tend to take on some of the resolution offered by the by-pass cap.

On a shunt cap in the woofer circuit it is really only doing the first thing that I mentioned as the rest of the network prevents the passing of high frequency.

Tyson · « **Reply #127 on:** 6 Oct 2010, 10:22 pm »

Thanks for the explanation Danny, I'll stick with what I have in that case!

BTW, I discovered a very nice tweak for the coax drivers today, it's actually a very, very nice improvement to the upper mids and highs. I think it's good enough that I'll post a separate thread about it.

Wind Chaser · « **Reply #128 on:** 10 Oct 2010, 08:57 am »

Now that you've had these for a while and they've had some hours to open up, how would you say they compare to the Geddess speakers in general terms of similarities and differences?

Tyson · « **Reply #129 on:** 10 Oct 2010, 09:20 am »

You know, if you'd asked me 6 hours ago, my answer would be different. I heard a muffled presentation in the lower mids that was disconcerting, to say the least. After doing the tweaks and moving the speakers around, I thought I was stuck with it. I originally thought it was just break in. But it did not go away. In a fit of desperation, I brought out all the tubes I have that would fit into the Scott Nixon Tubedac 2.2 I recently purchased. Switching from a 12bh7 to a Sylvania 5965 completely resolved the issue of muffled mids and bright highs and gave me a much more coherent sound.

Next up, veneer the V2's with Bird's Eye Maple and cut out + install the Baltic Birch side panels (and put a walnut stain on them). Hopefully they will look as good as they sound

Wind Chaser · « **Reply #130 on:** 10 Oct 2010, 09:33 am »

I really don't have the room for something this big, but I don't seem to have any other option. As for amplification, I'm pretty confident that my little SS wonder amp is up to the task.

Wind Chaser · « **Reply #131 on:** 11 Oct 2010, 12:06 am »

Quote from: Tyson on 10 Oct 2010, 09:20 am

Next up, veneer the V2's with Bird's Eye Maple and cut out + install the Baltic Birch side panels (and put a walnut stain on them). Hopefully they will look as good as they sound

Please post some pictures.... before and after S.V.P.

Outofthewoods · « **Reply #132 on:** 21 Oct 2010, 04:45 am »

Quote from: poseidonsvoice on 17 Sep 2010, 11:54 pm

In fact, Mike Galusha now uses sealed servo subs from Danny built beautifully by the wonderful Ruben.

Thanks Anand!

Ruben

Outofthewoods · « **Reply #133 on:** 21 Oct 2010, 04:49 am »

Quote from: Wind Chaser on 11 Oct 2010, 12:06 am

Please post some pictures.... before and after S.V.P.

+1

Glad to see that it's all worked out well for you Tyson.

I may have to bug you for a listen one of these days.

Ruben

Tyson · « **Reply #134 on:** 22 Oct 2010, 03:25 am »

Got some crazy side panels in the works - 1.5" thick baltic birch!! I've got the rough cuts done today, and will do the final cuts and shaping tomorrow. I'll try a couple of different stains and finishing techniques this weekend before final assemble. I'll post pics in the next couple of days.

Tyson · « **Reply #135 on:** 28 Oct 2010, 07:36 am »

Updated pics on the first post of the latest progress.

Tyson · « **Reply #136 on:** 28 Oct 2010, 08:09 am »

Also, I did try out various stains on some of my scrap pieces of the baltic birch. They all ended up looking terrible, so I've scrapped the staining idea and ordered some quarter sawn Walnut veneer to put on the side panels instead.

Tyson · « **Reply #137 on:** 28 Oct 2010, 08:17 am »

I also bypassed the Sonicap Gen I caps in the crossovers with Sonicap Platinum (teflon) caps. After a bit of burn in, I liked them so much that I got some more Platinums to use as bypasses for the output caps in my tube amps. After burning them in for a bit, I liked them so much that I replaced the Sonicap Gen II caps in the input stage of my tube amps with Platinum caps. My system has never sounded better.

To top it off, when I attached the side panels to my speakers, the bass got a lot better (of course!), but more surprisingly, the lower mids also started sounding much better and more prominent. So much so, that I removed 30% of the reticulated foam from my tweeter waveguide, so I could get the sound balanced again. But, that wasn't quite enough. I removed another 20% and that finally gave me a good tonal balance again. The net result was still a very nice, smooth tonal balance, but much greater clarity and transparency over all.

Tyson · « **Reply #138 on:** 28 Oct 2010, 08:25 am »

Looking over my last post, I don't think I quite convey how these speakers sound. They are clear, detailed, dynamic, and potent (in the bass) with very little over hang. But, above all, they sound BEAUTIFUL. I listen for hours and hours and hours on end. I'm just hoping I can finish them in a way that they finally end up looking as beautiful as they sound.

dvenardos · « **Reply #139 on:** 28 Oct 2010, 03:14 pm »

Did you pretreat before staining? I am told that shellac cut with mineral spirits makes an excellent pretreatment before staining birch.

Quote from: Tyson on 28 Oct 2010, 08:09 am

Also, I did try out various stains on some of my scrap pieces of the baltic birch. They all ended up looking terrible, so I've scrapped the staining idea and ordered some quarter sawn Walnut veneer to put on the side panels instead.