[Laundrew]

A hypothetical question…

“What if Bryston moved all production to China, would you still purchase Bryston audio equipment?”

My reply to this question would be "no."

A simple but interesting question, well not really when you use those "two words" in conjunction with each other - they have the ability to haunt you for the rest of your life.

My road to Bryston was almost a year's journey and was paved by countless auditioning sessions, and please remember that I never knew the existence of Bryston audio equipment before this - I even lived in the Peterborough area at one time. Not one day goes by without me enjoying (immensely) the performance of my Bryston preamplifier and mono blocks. At times, I even catch myself smiling at this equipment when it is stone cold and no little green LEDs are illuminated. I strongly believe that when it comes to audio equipment aesthetics, less is most certainly more.

I have a great deal of confidence in Bryston with respect to performance, service and corporate pride. I could not say this if all production was transferred to China - personally and in my most humble opinion, it would no longer be the same company.

Speculation ensues...

I do not believe that the same quality would be present and I can not help but thinking that the new warranty would only be three years - if that long or would it degrade to "throw-away equipment?" A hypocritical management would also come to mind with the new manufacturing location. How many times have you heard CEOs spewing forth their dribble of commitment for the environment and global warming only to find out that they are manufacturing in China, one of the world's most polluted countries. Is there any such thing as a blue sky in China anymore?

Greed would certainly come to mind. Manufacturers would be paying employees slave labour rates and charging North American consumers "as manufactured in North American" prices. Would you really want to spend thousands or dare I say, tens of thousands of dollars for any audio equipment manufactured in China?

Be well...

[werd]

No of course not. the build and quality control would crap out. Not only that, China is a communist dictatorial country. why are we even selling or buying crap from them anyways. Its like we are a big landfill for their disposable junk.

[1ZIP]

....absolutely NOT!!

[Mad Mr H]

"NO"

But for good reason............

MANY firms I have worked with started long this route, witout question only 1 in 5 are still here.

A VERY steep learning curve.

What seems to happen is the change to increase profit margins by 400%+ takes hold.

Then the product arrives, sales increase with lower final retail prices, THEN it hits...................


Items start to fail, returns start to arrive, replacements ship, replacements fail! slowly the number of items on the returns shelf exceed those on the sold shelf..........

I have seen this from a number of companies, What seems to be the issue is with the greatly reduced build costs ALSO comes little or no batch testing, cheap components that fail, poor solder.........

SO - IF bryston were to OWN a factory and run it the same as they do now I would give them a chance, But that would make Bryston a different company.

ONE company I know have been able to make this work, But there is still a HIGH failure rate, and some of these failures are simple build issues. When they started along this route I was first to test an item. 10 DSP units brought into the UK (UK Company)  First fail within 2 weeks, next fail, next fail, ALL NEW items....... This range was scrapped! but a lot was learnt.

WHAT I HATE and is why I will do my best NOT to support some products is that it appears that backward engineered - COPYS of others products, Seems to be allowed and copyrigh, trademarks etc mean nothing.........I find that plain simple theft and its wrong. Period.


Andy steps off his soap box!

[bummrush]

also you wound have to make sure they are not slipping in inferior parts when nobody is looking,that's well known they try that move at times,imagine Bryston's rep after that kind of thing happens,

[Sasha]

I judge the equipment by performance and not country of origin, so if the criteria are met the answer is yes.

[Waker]

I agree Laundrew--the corporate trend of exporting manufacturing jobs overseas has all but ruined the US.  I'm not sure about what has happened to Canadian jobs, but it is all but impossible to find a garment or a shoe made in the US anymore.  In this world of mass-consumer electronics, including phones, computers, TVs, and home-theater plastic junk of all kinds, I like the thought of Asians having to look West for non-disposable, high-end audio from such companies as Bryston and Audio Research. 
The most important part of choosing a career these days is not the pay, but the certainty that your job cannot be exported by a greedy board of directors.  While a company's founder may have had the vision and took all the risks, it is the loyal workers who made him or her really successful.  And while the workers made good livings, they also had incomes to buy the products they made, so it really is a partnership of owners and workers that make a good economy and country.  The North American dream may have seen its best years in this global race to the bottom.             

[timind]

What seems to happen is the change to increase profit margins by 400%+ takes hold.

Then the product arrives, sales increase with lower final retail prices, THEN it hits...................


Items start to fail, returns start to arrive, replacements ship, replacements fail! slowly the number of items on the returns shelf exceed those on the sold shelf..........

I have seen this from a number of companies, What seems to be the issue is with the greatly reduced build costs ALSO comes little or no batch testing, cheap components that fail, poor solder.........

As a service technician (non audio related) I can back this up with practical experience. It's a shame when an item known for it's dependability goes south, or east I guess. I tell my customers, "let me get you a used one, made in Sweden, it'll never break."

[Daniel Datchev]

Hi
I agree with Laundrew and Andy statements.
Although I have some staffs in my home made in China, I would appreciate products made by Bryston in Canada and PMC in UK. Such a company takes care of any detail and in every aspect of the products. I personally prefer paying once a big amount in long term, than frequent payment of less amount. That is just me. My previous mobile phone served me for a seven a half years and cost me 150$. Why should I pay thousands of dollars for audio system to serve me shorter?
Just my two cents.
Daniel

[95Dyna]

A recent review in a well know publication compared the Bryston 7BSST2 to one of its direct competitors in the marketplace.  The review did not mention the country of manufacture of this competitor:  China.  Now back to my    and hopefully my reference was oblique enough to keep me out of trouble with our newly annointed moderator .

[Robert D]

The Price list would drop by 50%
The warranty by another 19 years !

Robert

[Robert D]

It’s easy you pay for the Quality of life style you want to live.

That goes for as well my ears want to hear.

Robert

[1ZIP]

Not disagreeing with much of what has been said, but just a couple of points:

1. China may be producing some "junk" at this point in time.  But for those of us pretty long in the tooth we can remember a time when Japan produced "junk"! Now look at them, can you say "Honda & Toyota", etc., etc.. 

2. We buy more and more low cost chinese goods to help their economy so we can borrow billions from them to keep our economy afloat.  Thereby allowing us to spend $$'s we don't have on things we can't afford.

3. We as a nation pioneered the "disposable" society.  You get what you sow!

4.  The "North American dream" may in fact be vanishing as we continue to slide to the lowest common denominator.

[95Dyna]

Not disagreeing with much of what has been said, but just a couple of points:

1. China may be producing some "junk" at this point in time.  But for those of us pretty long in the tooth we can remember a time when Japan produced "junk"! Now look at them, can you say "Honda & Toyota", etc., etc.. 

2. We buy more and more low cost chinese goods to help their economy so we can borrow billions from them to keep our economy afloat.  Thereby allowing us to spend $$'s we don't have on things we can't afford.

3. We as a nation pioneered the "disposable" society.  You get what you sow!

4.  The "North American dream" may in fact be vanishing as we continue to slide to the lowest common denominator.

Touche IZIP.  You don't list your age in your profile but you sure sound alot like me at age 59.  Just ask my wife and daughter

[James Tanner]

I have the same fear guys - I grew up 'expecting' to have a better lifestyle than my parents. My two sons do not.

james

[wrathchild]

 When Drummer introduced me to Bryston (before I knew all the reasons  Bryston products are GREAT, sonically, build quality, etc), what interested me was that they were made in Canada.I mean really, actually Made in Canada, the whole piece!
  If they were made in China, I would not have given them a second look, regardless of any reason or any review anyone could have given me. The thought of this highly respected company moving any part of its operations to China turns my stomach. 
 I have the greatest respect for Bryston staying in Canada as it is probably financially challenging.
 Some items are disposable, my Bryston are not. Sorry, touchy subject.

 James, close your eyes... Guys, how much would it be worth to NOT have Bryston made in China? Seriously, after having the best what would you do.

[1ZIP]

...I've always been fond of McIntosh!

[alexone]

please stay in Canada, Bryston.

al.

[Phoenix]

Bryston and China? No way!

People have to realize that the only benefit of making products in China is that people who are responsible for the current financial crises only get even more money into their pockets.

Of course, some products are cheaper when made in China - and we're so happy of buying that cheap stuff.
But one day we will pay for it - with our jobs!

[nikon]

From an article in June/July 2008 issue of The Absolute Sound regarding Prima Luna manufacturing products in China ...

'PrimaLuna’s secret is audiophile design in The Netherlands (by Goldmund’s former head designer) coupled with highvolume manufacturing in China. PrimaLuna, a Dutch company founded by high-end audio distributor Herman van den Dungen, contracts with five of China’s larger electronics factories to build the gear ...

The PrimaLuna story isn’t all rosy, however. A Western company can’t just turn over a schematic and a prototype to a Chinese factory and expect these results. PrimaLuna’s high quality and solid reliability are achieved only by constant vigilance and a strict set of rules. Van den Dungen learned early on that the factories he dealt with could try to substitute the specified parts with cheaper (or counterfeit) parts and pocket the cost difference. Consequently, he developed processes that would assure his products’ quality. One technique that has been especially effective is the requirement that the factory shut down all other production, remove components for other products from the shop floor, and start fresh building only PrimaLuna products for the duration of the production run. In effect, the factory is temporarily turned into an exclusively PrimaLuna factory. In addition, van den Dungen inspects the factory as a production run is about to begin, as well as the components that will go into the products. He spends weeks at a time in China each time the factory makes a PrimaLuna run, and even owns a house near one of the factories. After catching a factory trying to substitute counterfeit Solen capacitors, van den Dungen began rigorous parts inspection, including X-raying parts. In some cases, van den Dungen buys the genuine parts himself and has them delivered to the factory ...

It’s a constant cat-andmouse game; one factory was caught sanding the labels off inferior semiconductor chips and silk-screening on the brand name and part number of the more expensive specified device. A provision of van den Dungen’s contract with the factory imposes fines for substituting any part, down to the chassis screws ... '