[vinyl_guy]

+1!  Not bad analysis for a Mizzou fan.....

 

I do think the perceived value of LPs in some antique malls has gone through the roof, as dealers try to capitalize on the new-found popularity.  I've seen $10 (or more) LPs that were totally trashed.

I agree that the price of used records can be way out of proportion to the condition.

[vinyl_guy]

I think it depends on the label as to whether they are remastered or not. I'm pretty sure all of the MoFi's are remastered.

I don't think demand is an issue. Presses are running 24/7 and they can't keep up. RTI plans to press more than 4 million records in 2016. Jack White (Third Man Records) couldn't find used presses for his pressing plant in Detroit so he is having new ones made from scratch. IMO, the majors have very little influence on today's vinyl resurgence.

[SteveRB]

Jack White is everything that's horrible with music, records, and whatever else he's touched in the past decade.

[ACHiPo]

Jack White is everything that's horrible with music, records, and whatever else he's touched in the past decade.

Oh I don't know--that duet with Loretta Lynn (I think?) was pretty cool.

[SteveRB]

Oh I don't know--that duet with Loretta Lynn (I think?) was pretty cool.

He took all the credibility he built up and turned it into gimmicks and became a parody of rock n roll, and all things nostalgic; finally commodified it for profit. Really, Jack?! give us another 'authentic' Blues riff to put a dance beat under and sell as background music...

[tube-vds]

i have both.

i can listen to vinyl many hours without listening fatigue - with digital that's not the case. 

[Scottdazzle]

I don't think the bolded portion is true at all. In fact, I don't think buying vinyl for reasons other than format preference has any influence on the price. I also don't think the price of new LPs is inflated. I think the price correctly reflects the cost of mastering for vinyl, cutting the lacquers, plating and pressing a limited number of copies. With respect to reissues, consider the care and detail Chad goes through when he does a reissue--180 or 200 g virgin vinyl, remastering and the cost of obtaining the original master tapes all figures into the costs. Add amortization of the cost to purchase, rebuild and maintain the presses plus a profit. A $3.98 album in 1968, adjusted for inflation, would be $27.56 today.

+1
In inflation-adjusted dollars, records cost about what they used to.

[GentleBender]

With HD Audio prices between $15-$30 per album, I feel vinyl prices are good. Why are digital files so expensive? There are no manufacturing or distribution costs involved. They do have network bandwidth, electricity and conversion cost that I would think would be much cheaper than pressing vinyl or CD/DVD/SACD over time. I will wait for prices to come down and technologies to mature to the point of me being comfortable with spending my money on it.

I do thank the early adopters for helping speed up the development of technology and methods needed to get us there affordably.

[Early B.]

i have both.

i can listen to vinyl many hours without listening fatigue - with digital that's not the case. 

If you get listening fatigue with digital, something is definitely wrong with your system.

[tube-vds]

no it's a ear - brain thing. my system is pretty ok.

[FullRangeMan]

With HD Audio prices between $15-$30 per album, I feel vinyl prices are good. Why are digital files so expensive? There are no manufacturing or distribution costs involved. They do have network bandwidth, electricity and conversion cost that I would think would be much cheaper than pressing vinyl or CD/DVD/SACD over time. I will wait for prices to come down and technologies to mature to the point of me being comfortable with spending my money on it.

I do thank the early adopters for helping speed up the development of technology and methods needed to get us there affordably.

Also there no shiping cost or customs duties.

[griffithds]

Tube-vds,

   I agree with you.  It is not the system but it 'is' digital.  There is something irritating going on that's hard to describe.  For a few hours, no problem but after awhile, I just have to turn it off.  This never happens with analog.  It's biggest problem is forcing myself to not dig out another record to listen to 'just one more'!
Regards,

[geowak]

Tube-vds,

   I agree with you.  It is not the system but it 'is' digital.  There is something irritating going on that's hard to describe.  For a few hours, no problem but after awhile, I just have to turn it off.  This never happens with analog.  It's biggest problem is forcing myself to not dig out another record to listen to 'just one more'!
Regards,

That is interesting and I think, at least for me, we are getting to another important set of questions. I had a turntable a while back. It was a Thorens TD320. I can get much enjoyment from digital without the pops, clicks and mediocre sound from the turntable. So at what price point does one need to get to hear that "wow factor' with analolg? At what level quality of turntable, tonearm, cartridge, phono-preamp doe one need to get?

Belt drive? DD? Does the turntable need to be big or heavy? My Thorens was not... and kind finicky to set up. Does one need to get a newly designed turntable? Can one get an old Garrard 301 transcription to get that great sound? Do you need to get a Well Tempered?

Maybe some of you analog guys who have had experience can jump in. I tend to think, one must spend in the 3K to 5K range to get a good sounding rig.

[G Georgopoulos]

I can get much enjoyment from digital without the pops, clicks and mediocre sound from the turntable. So at what price point does one need to get to hear that "wow factor' with analolg? At what level quality of turntable, tonearm, cartridge, phono-preamp doe one need to get?

good records dont have pops and clicks or much hiss,i dont agree about mediocre sound btw.in my experience is the record quality that makes the difference...

[jimdgoulding]

I am able to compare about 30 recordings in both digital and analog with the selector switch on my pre at the same time.  Now, I know that my phono cart has a character but it's one that I like.  It's warmer and lusher than the more strictly neutral CD player I'm using, an older Denon.  The difference could be cause of the designer's preference who I've read was a big fan of western classical music.  I have an original Koetsu Black which yields slightly better midrange palpability and tonal richness than my CDP that I suspect is the result of a shelving down in the top two octaves.  The Denon does add greater excitement in general, but the purity and presence of the Koetsu is hard to beat.  Both stage very well, but images are a hair rounder with the cartridge.  I suspect the cd player is slightly quicker and therefore more exciting on some material.

[undertow]

Yeah it all comes down to how good the quality of the recording is in the first place being vinyl or digital so without that none of it matters.

The worst vinyl pressings on the planet in my opinion all came out in the 1990's and early 2000's for the most part, so guess what all those bands from the 90's suffer on the original vinyl's in general, but are excellent on CD or digital. I have sold many original 90's pressings for a small fortune because I could care less everybody wants them due to being rare. I am not saying there were not a few Gem's out there on original 90's pressings, but take any of the popular stuff for the most part and they are garbage. So CD normally crushed this ERA of pressings. Even some of the newer Re-masters of those albums suck on Vinyl as well.

However, many new re-master Vinyl pressings in the last 5 years have finally started capturing the best sounding analog even from some of those 90's albums now.

The argument is many are digital tracks being pressed on vinyl, however I have found a few that just now make the CD sound like MP3 no matter what you do. Is it the way the artist intended?

I don't give a Sh*t if it sounds way better it sounds way better and makes you want to actually listen to it more!

[Freo-1]

I am able to compare about 30 recordings in both digital and analog with the selector switch on my pre at the same time.  Now, I know that my phono cart has a character but it's one that I like.  It's warmer and lusher than the more strictly neutral CD player I'm using, an older Denon.  The difference could be cause of the designer's preference who I've read was a big fan of western classical music.  I have an original Koetsu Black which yields slightly better midrange palpability and tonal richness than my CDP that I suspect is the result of a shelving down in the top two octaves.  The Denon does add greater excitement yet on vocals, the purity and presence of the Koetsu is hard to beat.  Both stage very well, but images are a hair rounder with the cartridge.  I suspect the cd player is slightly quicker and therefore more exciting on some material.

I would submit that a recent player such as Modwright Oppo 95/105 would provide a marked improvement over a older Denon (I had a 5910 player).  Now, comparing a hi res digital classical symphonic recording against any vinyl rig, and the hi-res digital will provide better overall performance.  Take Tchaikovsky's 6th, or Debussy's La Mer, or any Mahler symphony, compare a hi res digital to vinyl, and there is no way the vinyl can compare.  As my tastes shifted towards classical, my tolerance for vinyl went steadily downhill.  I do not agree that vinyl is quiet with classical recordings at all.

If your tastes run towards popular music, then I can see where audiophiles would really enjoy vinyl (I sure did). 

[G Georgopoulos]

I would submit that a recent player such as Modwright Oppo 95/105 would provide a marked improvement over a older Denon (I had a 5910 player).  Now, comparing a hi res digital classical symphonic recording against any vinyl rig, and the hi-res digital will provide better overall performance.  Take Tchaikovsky's 6th, or Debussy's La Mer, or any Mahler symphony, compare a hi res digital to vinyl, and there is no way the vinyl can compare.  As my tastes shifted towards classical, my tolerance for vinyl went steadily downhill.  I do not agree that vinyl is quiet with classical recordings at all.

If your tastes run towards popular music, then I can see where audiophiles would really enjoy vinyl (I sure did).

where you are wrong!,i'll show you!,it doesnt have to do with hires-digital ,cd-digital is as good,what my point is..you have never experienced good vinyl with classical ...

[tube-vds]

Tube-vds,

   I agree with you.  It is not the system but it 'is' digital.  There is something irritating going on that's hard to describe.  For a few hours, no problem but after awhile, I just have to turn it off.  This never happens with analog.  It's biggest problem is forcing myself to not dig out another record to listen to 'just one more'!
Regards,

[jsaliga]

If you get listening fatigue with digital, something is definitely wrong with your system.

Or something is definitely wrong with the digital sources that are producing the fatigue, such as dynamic range compression.

To me it is not about formats but how the content itself was recorded and then subsequently mixed and mastered.  I have a considerable investment in both vinyl and digital, but I rarely buy CDs because compression runs rampant on CD music, which is a deal breaker for me.  Most of the digital music I buy is classical from High Definition Tape Transfers, and is usually 24bit/192KHz PCM, DSD128, or DSD256.  They typically do a great job and I am very rarely disappointed.

In today's music production climate you to have to pay more for content that is properly mastered for the intended media.  It is getting more and more difficult to trust major labels with that critical task.  There are some audiophile labels that are doing a great job, such as Music Matters, Speakers Corner, and Analogue Productions to name a few, and they are my highly trusted sources of high quality vinyl pressings.

Caveat emptor with any music purchase.  It pays to know what you are buying.

--Jerome