[Rclark]

either confirmation bias or earwax IMO 

[Rclark]

Let's be honest, the TBI is an extremely cheaply built little amp with small power output. I wouldn't pay more than $100 for one.

It's just a couple little domino sized circuit boards thrown in a box. Now that's "hype"

[cab]

The TBI is sooo last flavor of the month....

[Rclark]

The TBI is sooo last flavor of the month....

I noticed this too. We're on to the next.

[wushuliu]

Here we go again

[Rclark]

Oh, by all means, carry on. Believe whatever you want. You guys are ripe for the picking.

I heard both amps. Better midrange? At 32 watts peak? More like clip clip clip

You must all run speakers made of stationary paper.

[roscoeiii]

But the TBI is a great sounding amp with appropriate speakers. With a power hungry speaker like a Maggie, not a great choice.

[DaveC113]

Yup, I think the mass of the cones on my single drivers is around 2 grams. It sounds like an electrostat, but better because it's a point source. On my speakers the TBI sounded good. But from my memory the Crown is a good bit better.

[Freo-1]

Oh, by all means, carry on. Believe whatever you want. You guys are ripe for the picking.

I heard both amps. Better midrange? At 32 watts peak? More like clip clip clip

You must all run speakers made of stationary paper.

Go find a Yamaha MX-D1 and compare.  You may be surprised. Then, go listen to a high powered tube rig.  That will be a ear opening experience.


There are many ways to achieve audio nirvana. 

[cab]

Go find a Yamaha MX-D1 and compare.  You may be surprised. Then, go listen to a high powered tube rig.  That will be a ear opening experience.

Wow, vintage class d!

That design is what, 10 years old? I have to think the state of the art has advanced a bit...

Weren't you pumped up on '80's or '90's Japanese receivers not too long ago?

Whatever floats your boat.

[a.wayne]

It's important that listening impressions are taken in context.  It's already been posted that the amp sounds different (better) when the volume knobs on the amp are at 9 o'clock.  That means that the efficiency of the speakers, along with the input, needs to be understood to evaluate.  If speakers are say, 85 to 87 db/w, and a source of 2 volts is connected, listening impressions could be very different, as the amp may not achieve full power configured like this.  The input volume knobs may need to be at 2 to 3 o'clock to achieve full power.

This could be due to a few reason , impedance matching and or amp noise floor  level. Increasing the gain changes both , wideopen lets you hear more into the noise floor of the amplfier while changing the impedance seen by the pre-amp, 'nothing  to do  with limiting power output .


Regards

[Freo-1]

Wow, vintage class d!

That design is what, 10 years old? I have to think the state of the art has advanced a bit...

Weren't you pumped up on '80's or '90's Japanese receivers not too long ago?

Whatever floats your boat.

The design was very advanced when it came out, with many unique features.  Folks I know who have ACTUALLY heard it compared to other Class D amps report it's better sonically. 

Try to find one and compare.  You will be plesantly surprised.  Over on AK, a guy with a EE reviewed the circuit,, and says its still current.  It has a custom digital filer setup, as opposed to analog.

[Freo-1]

This could be due to a few reason , impedance matching and or amp noise floor  level. Increasing the gain changes both , wideopen lets you hear more into the noise floor of the amplfier while changing the impedance seen by the pre-amp, 'nothing  to do  with limiting power output .


Regards

It scales down the input voltage, which reduces the output power.   


Not difficult to understand.If you scale it way down, the amp simply cannot achieve rated output power.

[JDUBS]

Here we go again

No kidding. 

-Jim

[OzarkTom]

My system consists:

Crown XLS2000 amp-Job 225 amp with Virtue Audio power cord
Sony HAP-Z1ES with Job Sweetcord
Itube as Pre with Astron Power supply and Reality power cable
Zellaton Emotion Speakers
Reality IC cables
Vaughn speaker cables

I made several comparisons last night with my set-up. I first tried by-passing the Itube qnd going direct form the Sony to the Crown. That was a big disappointment. It sounded flat and un-emotional. I searched for my balanced cables to go XLR direct but only found one.

Then I tried switching to the Job amp. I don't  like to A/B switch back and forth comparing because you always have to turn the amps off. You never get a fair comparison.

The way I like to compare is, do I miss the other amp? Ever since I have had the Crown on, I have never missed the Job. After about an Hour of listening to the Job, I said yeah, I miss that Crown and switched back.

The Crown is clearer, more detail, better focus, giving the Crown a bigger soundstage. The Crown is more forward as Dave has said, putting you up front in the first five rows of a concert. The Job and Ncores sounds like more in the 10-15 rows. The Job is more laid back and fuzzier, all recordings including bad ones, sounds good with the Job. Vocals are not as clear and defined.

On the Crown, if your recording has the meat, it will play the meat. Recording is analytical, it will sound analytical. It was hard to tear myself away tonight since the amp now has about 170 hours on it and sounds even better than last night.  Since my wife was gone, I cranked it up. The detail and focus of the vocals is stunning. It is hard to imagine anything better but I am sure there is. I would not be afraid to compare this Crown to any other Class D amp no matter what the price. But most here will probably never will, it does not have any snob appeal. It is the best sounding Class D that I have ever had in my home.

I never expected this amp to surpass my Job amp, but for me it does. Some here will prefer the Job. If the Job was $300 and the Crown was $1700, I would still buy the Crown. At very low listening levels, the Crown really takes the cake. I like comparing different amps, and for 300 bucks, I said why not. Life is short, play with as many toys as you can.

[werd]

I hate to break it to you guys but the distortion and Thd on these Crown amps are dismal. .5% with 103 db noise respectably. Class's D needs very good specs to get it right. That's just the nature of the beast. 

Once working it's just a battery of treble clamber and fatigueing playback otherwise, not good.

With gain you want to set the gain to a voltage ratio of 1 on the amp. The gain adjustment on the amp goes from 0 to 10. Likely 0 to plus 10db voltage gain. To get to a ratio of 1 -  iI would guess the 9:00 pm setting would be about right.

[wushuliu]

Interesting. Thanks for the comparison Tom. At some point I'd like to get beefier speakers that need more juice than the TPA can provide. I'll give the Crown a go. Amazing the quality you can get in all things audio at an affordable price these days.

[DaveC113]

I switched from the SET to the Crown and I pretty much forgot I switched amps after a short time. I agree with Tom, it's a really good amp and not just for the price.

The power advantage is hard to ignore, monoblock the 1500 and get dual mono + about 1000 WPC for the $600-800 range. That's amazing, and really a no-brainer, many speakers of average sensitivity sound best with the most powerful amp you can get behind them.

The THD and noise on the Crown is better than my SET amp and it's a great amp too, those measurements are fine. It's not a fatiguing amp either, not even close. The edge and noise that can plague some D amps seems to be completely absent.

Anyway... Congrats Harmon! 

[OzarkTom]

Interesting. Thanks for the comparison Tom. At some point I'd like to get beefier speakers that need more juice than the TPA can provide. I'll give the Crown a go. Amazing the quality you can get in all things audio at an affordable price these days.

And the amp is super quiet.

[Wind Chaser]

Are you guys plugging the Crown straight into the wall?