What has happened to the melody?

Wayner · « **Reply #20 on:** 17 Sep 2010, 09:23 pm »

Quote from: jsaliga on 17 Sep 2010, 08:39 pm

Then Webster's is defining music very narrowly in a way that most musicians would not accept. For example, there is a very large body of Avant Garde and underground music that doesn't conform to any particular convention. Much of it is freely improvised, and for fans that is its greatest appeal.

--Jerome

Then throw your dictionary out of the window. Words (and their meanings) then mean nothing. Text away.

Wayner

Art_Chicago · « **Reply #21 on:** 17 Sep 2010, 09:33 pm »

Wayner,

Your OP reminded me an old story about Shostakovich-- Zhdanov, who was the Leningrad's "mayor" and a kommunist boss in the late 1930's, critisized Shosty' music because " the music was hard to whistle"

I am not really disagreeing with you, though, because popular music ( and most rock groups belong there all right) must have melody, otherwise that music simply stinks.

\

Art

orthobiz · « **Reply #22 on:** 17 Sep 2010, 10:04 pm »

Quote from: Wayner on 17 Sep 2010, 09:19 pm

By the name of the band, I would not listen to the trash.

Wayner, The New Pornographers have an unfortunate name but are an absolute delight. Named after a comment from a TV evangelist who said modern music was the "new pornography" of the day. Nothing in the music is nasty and unlike neaRly everything out there, no parental advisory!

Highly recommended. Start with the album Electric Version and I defy you not to fall in love with it. Guaranteed melodic to the max.

Paul

Letitroll98 · « **Reply #23 on:** 17 Sep 2010, 10:06 pm »

Quote from: Wayner on 17 Sep 2010, 09:19 pm

Quote
Also check out The New Pornographers "Together". Lots of melody.
By the name of the band, I would not listen to the trash.

Wayne, I sympathize with the sentiment in your OP, but may I gently suggest this post is why you have a problem finding melody in new music? This is a great group with a fabulous girl, Neko Case, fronting the band. She has a couple of solo albums as well (Fox Confessor Brings the Flood is my fav) and now does only a couple of songs on the newest album. And how can you say Wilco has no melody? They are nothing if not melody. Just open your mind. The Shins, Jack Johnson, British Sea Power, Band of Horses, some great vinyl out there if you look for it. Yes, of course there is a lot of avant-garde stuff that doesn't claim melody as it's first handle, but with an odd taste some (not Wayne) may like Joanna Newsome or The Tallest Man On Earth, or some other eclectic artists, but there's still plenty of melody, don't despair.

sts9fan · « **Reply #24 on:** 17 Sep 2010, 10:08 pm »

He ain't lyin

Artie · « **Reply #25 on:** 17 Sep 2010, 10:11 pm »

You guys have convinced me. I'm going to look for some "New Pornographers" music.

I just shudder to think what I'm going to have to wade through in a Google search.

sts9fan · « **Reply #26 on:** 17 Sep 2010, 10:14 pm »

Pop to the max but so good.

etcarroll · « **Reply #27 on:** 17 Sep 2010, 10:53 pm »

And Artie, look for a Neko Case solo effort with a song titled "Deep Red Bells".

Artie · « **Reply #28 on:** 17 Sep 2010, 10:55 pm »

Doing it, as we speak.

Edit: Excellent! Found it, (her). This is why forums are far more relevant than FM these days.

sts9fan · « **Reply #29 on:** 17 Sep 2010, 11:12 pm »

Good reversal of the curmudgeon thread.

Artie · « **Reply #30 on:** 17 Sep 2010, 11:30 pm »

Quote from: sts9fan on 17 Sep 2010, 11:12 pm

Good reversal of the curmudgeon thread.

Is that worthy of a search . . . or should I just let it go?

jsaliga · « **Reply #31 on:** 17 Sep 2010, 11:32 pm »

Quote from: Wayner on 17 Sep 2010, 09:23 pm

Then throw your dictionary out of the window. Words (and their meanings) then mean nothing. Text away.

I don't know what edition of Webster's dictionary you are using...but here is just one definition among many that is less rigid and exclusive than you seem to believe it to be.

Music - Noun. The science or art of ordering tones or sounds in succession, in combination, and in temporal relationships to produce a composition having unity and continuity.

Note that this definition doesn't say anything about melody, harmony, or rhythm. The source for the above definition is Merriam-Webster Online.

I would hope that on a forum devoted to music lovers that we all really know what music is without having to argue over its meaning or refer to a dictionary to discuss it.

Rock on...

--Jerome

Artie · « **Reply #32 on:** 17 Sep 2010, 11:49 pm »

I think we should grant Wayner some poetic license on this. I don't think he meant this to be this literal.
I hope I don't sound patronizing. Didn't mean it that way.

galyons · « **Reply #33 on:** 18 Sep 2010, 12:39 am »

Quote from: jsaliga on 17 Sep 2010, 11:32 pm

I don't know what edition of Webster's dictionary you are using...but here is just one definition among many that is less rigid and exclusive than you seem to believe it to be.

--Jerome

Wow! Enough of the etymological flogging. Music has always been socially and culturally based. One person's music always has the potential to be another person's noise. Give it a rest and go listen to whatever you enjoy!

Cheers,
Geary

Ericus Rex · « **Reply #34 on:** 18 Sep 2010, 02:12 pm »

Quote from: Wayner on 17 Sep 2010, 07:20 pm

Someone suggested that I try a band called Radiohead (OK computer). They said if you liked Pink Floyd, you'd dig this band. Well, I think not. There not even in the same league.
Wayner

The interesting thing in this post to me is that I consider OK Computer to be a very melodic album and Pink Floyd's earliest albums nearly amelodic.

Letitroll98 · « **Reply #35 on:** 18 Sep 2010, 02:14 pm »

Quote from: galyons on 18 Sep 2010, 12:39 am

Wow! Enough of the etymological flogging. Music has always been socially and culturally based. One person's music always has the potential to be another person's noise. Give it a rest and go listen to whatever you enjoy!

Cheers,
Geary

Yes, but even though I'm trying to modify Wayne's outlook, I do understand and sympathize with his point. There is a lot of crap in the mainstream media channels today, and one might describe it as a lack of melody. Not unreasonable if you haven't looked below the surface to find the gold that is lying there. I would only encourage Wayne to get out his shovel and pan and mine for some gold, it's there.

And as vapid and shallow with a limit vocal range and limited musical talent as she has, I still like Taylor Swift. I assume it's called country music, don't know as I don't listen to it or have any of her albums, but every time I listen to one of her songs on TV, I like it. I think she has melody.

vinyl_guy · « **Reply #36 on:** 22 Sep 2010, 06:11 am »

Quote from: Wayner on 17 Sep 2010, 09:19 pm

By the name of the band, I would not listen to the trash.

Wayner,

I want to echo what others have posted about The New Pornographers and encourage you to give them a listen. I initially felt the same way you do about the name. I assumed the music would reflect the band's name. Then, on an airplane I read a review of Challengers in The Absoulte Sound. I had passed over the review several times because of the band"s name. When I read the review and who they were compared to, I thought to myself "I like those bands a lot so maybe I will like TNP." I bought Challengers and absolutely fell in love with it. This was how I discovered Neko Case. After listening to Challengers, I bought Mass Romantic and Twin Cinema. Then I found a sealed copy of Electric Version. The songs are uplifting, fun, full of melody with a great mix of male/female vocals. They are a very, very talented band full of energy. I believe they are the best power pop band in North America today.

IMO, their latest ablum, Together, is their best record since Electric Version. Neko Case's My Shepherd, Carl Newman's If You Can't See My Mirrors and Dan Bejar's Silver Jenny Dollar are great pop tunes.

Paul is correct about how they got their name. All of the members were in other bands and were in a studio in Vancouver BC, recorded a few songs that became part of Mass Romantic, decided they enjoyed playing together and needed a name. They saw a TV evangelist railing about rock n roll being the new pornography, looked at each other and said something to the effect that since we are a rock n roll band we must be the new pronographers. They continue to record individually as well as TNP.

I have seen them in concert and there is no way you can stay seated. They are very personable and engaging with the audience. Check them out. I plan to put some of their songs on a compilation CD for RMAF and I'll bring it by Frank's room for you to have a listen.

BTW, for those of you who like Neko Case, I highly recommend Middle Cyclone.

Happy listening,

Laura

woodsyi · « **Reply #37 on:** 22 Sep 2010, 02:54 pm »

Laura brought a New Pornographer album and we listened a couple of days ago: There be melody, Wayner!

Good stuff, man. I gotta get a vinyl copy.

sts9fan · « **Reply #38 on:** 22 Sep 2010, 03:07 pm »

I don't think Wayner is coming back to his thread...

TheChairGuy · « **Reply #39 on:** 22 Sep 2010, 03:16 pm »

If melody is an ersatz proxy for the term 'hook'...I think music still has it, it's just that some of us, ahem, older folks

don't listen to the newer music much to know.

My (then) 5+ year old daughter was humming a tune in the back seat while driving her to school before the end of last year.

'What's that'? - I asked.

She proceeded to sing louder....'I kissed a girl and I liked it....' (!)

Well, I didn't much dig the tune she just learned (fortuneately the inquisitive little one didn't ask me to explain the lyrics

) ; but that 'hook' or melody was clearly ingrained in her head (thank you, Katy Perry)

John