Squeezebox Touch released today

MerlinWerks · « **Reply #20 on:** 11 Apr 2010, 03:07 pm »

Quote from: eclein on 8 Apr 2010, 08:34 pm

Can the SB touch work with ipeng software app??

It will work if you have SqueezeBox Server running on a separate computer like a typical installation. If you are trying to use the Touch "standalone" using it's built in server, then no, because it's processor is not powerful enough to support a web gui.

pippin · « **Reply #21 on:** 11 Apr 2010, 09:32 pm »

Quote from: MerlinWerks on 11 Apr 2010, 03:07 pm

It will work if you have SqueezeBox Server running on a separate computer like a typical installation. If you are trying to use the Touch "standalone" using it's built in server, then no, because it's processor is not powerful enough to support a web gui.

The iPeng App Store App will work, it doesn't require the Web GUI. It's actually pretty quick since Logitech made a few optimizations to the queries iPeng uses.
The older iPeng plugin for the Web GUI will not work.

Quiet Earth · « **Reply #22 on:** 12 Apr 2010, 05:25 pm »

How does the touch access my music library without a computer? I had trouble understanding this from the Logitech website. They say :

USB host connector for accessing music and photos via USB drive or USB key.
SD card slot for music and photos.

but they also say :

"For access to local music: 256MB RAM and 100MB hard disk space."

That second part sounds like I need a computer to access my music library. I know that I can listen to internet radio without a computer because I do that with my Duet. But my music library too?

Wayne1 · « **Reply #23 on:** 12 Apr 2010, 05:36 pm »

Quote from: Quiet Earth on 12 Apr 2010, 05:25 pm

How does the touch access my music library without a computer? I had trouble understanding this from the Logitech website. They say :

USB host connector for accessing music and photos via USB drive or USB key.
SD card slot for music and photos.

but they also say :

"For access to local music: 256MB RAM and 100MB hard disk space."

That second part sounds like I need a computer to access my music library. I know that I can listen to internet radio without a computer because I do that with my Duet. But my music library too?

If you music library is on your computer, you computer will have to be turned on. If you library is on an external hard drive, you can plug that directly into the Touch and it will be able to access it. It will need 10% of the hard drive space to write it's database info.

eclein · « **Reply #24 on:** 12 Apr 2010, 05:46 pm »

Hey Wayne1 !! As you may recall I just recently found a Duet receiver and got it working, is the output of the touch such that I should consider replacing my Duet?? Does the touch like smoke previous versions?? If yes, would it be a good move in my case to pursue a DAC, say Maverick D1 to put between SB and AV receiver?? I'm not sure if you beta tested these or not...or is yours on the way. Just looking for some advice as to direction.

All my music is on a laptop as wav or alac file type

Big Red Machine · « **Reply #25 on:** 12 Apr 2010, 05:54 pm »

Quote from: Wayne1 on 12 Apr 2010, 05:36 pm

If you music library is on your computer, you computer will have to be turned on. If you library is on an external hard drive, you can plug that directly into the Touch and it will be able to access it. It will need 10% of the hard drive space to write it's database info.

And then we can feed it to a DAC of higher quality?

Do you think we can parallel a computer in so we can view on a large screen the SC song collection when we want to instead of just using the smaller Touch screen?

Quiet Earth · « **Reply #26 on:** 12 Apr 2010, 06:06 pm »

Thanks Wayne1

. My music is on an external firewire drive.

The touch has firewire as well as USB. Can I hook my firewire drive up to it without the computer?

Also, is the S/Pdif out improved from the DUET or about the same?

All these questions . . . . . .

BPT · « **Reply #27 on:** 12 Apr 2010, 06:24 pm »

Are you sure your Touch has fire wire?
Chris H.

srb · « **Reply #28 on:** 12 Apr 2010, 06:29 pm »

Quote from: Quiet Earth on 12 Apr 2010, 06:06 pm

The touch has firewire as well as USB. Can I hook my firewire drive up to it without the computer?

The Squeezebox Touch that I am looking at only has Ethernet and USB ports.

Steve

jopagi · « **Reply #29 on:** 12 Apr 2010, 06:49 pm »

I have a SB3 and a Duet already.
If I buy a Touch and run it off of an external USB drive, it sounds as though it would appear like a Squeezebox server to the SB3/Duet and thus I could synchronize them directly to the Touch, completely bypassing my computer. Is this correct?

If so, that's a nice feature. I'd use an external USB drive with auto-sleep/auto turn-on. I'm not a fan of keeping my computer on all the time, and the 5 minutes that it takes to fully start up is not ideal for music playing.
Thanks,
Jonathan

Wayne1 · « **Reply #30 on:** 12 Apr 2010, 07:11 pm »

Quote from: eclein on 12 Apr 2010, 05:46 pm

Hey Wayne1 !! As you may recall I just recently found a Duet receiver and got it working, is the output of the touch such that I should consider replacing my Duet?? Does the touch like smoke previous versions?? If yes, would it be a good move in my case to pursue a DAC, say Maverick D1 to put between SB and AV receiver?? I'm not sure if you beta tested these or not...or is yours on the way. Just looking for some advice as to direction. All my music is on a laptop as wav or alac file type

I have not received the Touch, yet. Hopefully it will arrive sometime this week. The preliminary reports are that both the digital and analog outputs sound better than the stock SB3. I have not read anything about comparisons with a DUET or any modded SB unit. I believe I have seen a comparison between the stock transporter analog outputs and Touch where the Touch was preferred.

eclein, I don't think an external DAC is going to help you if you are using a HT receiver. Most HT receivers take all the analog inputs and change them to digital for signal processing and run back to analog for amplification. You would be better off running digital direct into your receiver and skipping the A/D step. In that case, perhaps the improved digital output of the Touch might sound better to you.

Big Red Machine,

There is still too little comparison information out there. Some have compared the analog output of the stock Touch to both a Lavry and a Benchmark. The reports are that the sound of the stock Touch is very close to those units. The web UI does not work when the Touch is used as a server. To see what is playing with another computer, you would have to use a computer as a server.

Quiet Earth,

As Chris and srb have mentioned, the Touch will only accept USB, Ethernet and SD cards.

jopagi,

The Touch can be used as a controller for two other SB units while running it's own server.

There have also been reports that the sound quality may be reduced when running it off a USB drive.

srb · « **Reply #31 on:** 12 Apr 2010, 07:43 pm »

Quote from: Wayne1 on 12 Apr 2010, 07:11 pm

eclein, I don't think an external DAC is going to help you if you are using a HT receiver. Most HT receivers take all the analog inputs and change them to digital for signal processing and run back to analog for amplification. You would be better off running digital direct into your receiver and skipping the A/D step. In that case, perhaps the improved digital output of the Touch might sound better to you.

I can't be absolutely certain, but my understanding is the Sony STR-DH800 will not do any A/D to D/A conversion when 2 CH / Analog Direct is selected for an analog input.

Steve

lcrim · « **Reply #32 on:** 12 Apr 2010, 07:58 pm »

I've said this before but again, putting a hard drive and all its mechanical and electrical noise back in the environment where you listen to music is a step backwards. One of the great advantages of the Squeeze Box technology is that the music storage can be put elsewhere, where its noise is not a distraction.
An SD card or a USB memory stick are not noisy. A solid state hard drive, while silent is going to be very costly. The term is appropriate technology.

ebag4 · « **Reply #33 on:** 12 Apr 2010, 08:02 pm »

Quote from: lcrim on 12 Apr 2010, 07:58 pm

I've said this before but again, putting a hard drive and all its mechanical and electrical noise back in the environment where you listen to music is a step backwards. One of the great advantages of the Squeeze Box technology is that the music storage can be put elsewhere, where its noise is not a distraction.
An SD card or a USB memory stick are not noisy. A solid state hard drive, while silent is going to be very costly. The term is appropriate technology.

I have found the WD green drives to be inaudible until you put your ear within a couple of inches from it (in a quiet room), YMMV.

Best,
Ed

Quiet Earth · « **Reply #34 on:** 12 Apr 2010, 08:37 pm »

Thanks for the firewire correction guys. I don't even know what made me think it had firewire.

Maybe a little information overload . . . .

Ok, back on track now.

I'll wait to see what you guys think about it before I jump in anyway.

lcrim,
I respect your argument about streaming vs. hardwiring. I also question my own judgement when placing a wireless transceiver within arm's reach of the system. I guess if you want to play, you have to pay one way or another.

Thanks for the tip on the quiet USB drive, Ed. I'm sure we'll see more suggestions as this thing unfolds.

chadh · « **Reply #35 on:** 12 Apr 2010, 08:51 pm »

Quote from: lcrim on 12 Apr 2010, 07:58 pm

I've said this before but again, putting a hard drive and all its mechanical and electrical noise back in the environment where you listen to music is a step backwards. One of the great advantages of the Squeeze Box technology is that the music storage can be put elsewhere, where its noise is not a distraction.
An SD card or a USB memory stick are not noisy. A solid state hard drive, while silent is going to be very costly. The term is appropriate technology.

My current option utilizes a networked hard drive that I leave in the basement. I run Foobar on a netbook with SSD (situated next to my USB DAC), which can take data from the networked harddrive either wirelesslessly or via ethernet cable. I have no noise issues.

Chad

lcrim · « **Reply #36 on:** 12 Apr 2010, 09:15 pm »

Chad:
The netbook w/SSD wasn't free was it? How are you going to utilize a SqueezeBox Touch w/ your present setup?

I've not heard the WD Green drives, but the cost of buying new drives should factor into this as well.

Quoting the Beta Tester John Swenson again "I've used the USB input extensively, but I haven't actually tried the SD card. Ive run both USB "sticks" and USB drives, they work well. But realize that with a hard drive you are back in the situation of having a spinning drive which can make some physical sound in your listening environment. For me one of the big advantages of the SB system is having the hard drive off in another room.

There is a very slight degradation of sound quality when using a drive plugged into the USB port, probably due to extra electrical noise on the power supply."

Wayne1 · « **Reply #37 on:** 12 Apr 2010, 09:27 pm »

On more point of information, the processor in the Touch, while more powerful than in previous generations, is not that fast. It takes roughly 6 times as long to scan a hard drive as does your computer. So if it takes 2 hours to do a rescan now, figure 12 hours for set up and each time it looks for new music.

24/96 files might have some trouble streaming through wi-fi. The best way to use the Touch might be to keep your files on a central computer connected to the Touch through wired ethernet

pippin · « **Reply #38 on:** 12 Apr 2010, 10:57 pm »

Quote from: Wayne1 on 12 Apr 2010, 09:27 pm

On more point of information, the processor in the Touch, while more powerful than in previous generations, is not that fast. It takes roughly 6 times as long to scan a hard drive as does your computer. So if it takes 2 hours to do a rescan now, figure 12 hours for set up and each time it looks for new music.

This depends on how fast your computer is.
While the processor in the Touch is slower, the software is much faster than the current incarnation of the "big" server, it's the same as the current 7.6 beta which is much, much, much faster on _my_ server.
Generally speaking the server on the Touch is slower than a modern PC/Mac but faster than on a NAS.

Quote

24/96 files might have some trouble streaming through wi-fi. The best way to use the Touch might be to keep your files on a central computer connected to the Touch through wired ethernet

Not as of my experience. I've tried 24/96 on Touch, Transporter and both synced. served up from the Touch. No issue.
The disclaimer in the Wiki is for 24/96 streamed to devices that don't support it (like SB3). This doesn't work because the Touch doesn't support transcoding.

firedog · « **Reply #39 on:** 13 Apr 2010, 07:50 am »

If you use the Touch itself as a server (music on SD card or directly connected USB HD), you can't use the Web GUI from SBS to control the Touch, as it isn't part of the SBS version that is installed on the Touch. You can use a Logitech Duet controller or iPhone/iPad Touch running the iPeng app.

However, you can install SBS on a laptop or desktop, and define your music library there as the music library attached to the Touch, and then run the Web GUI and control the Touch from the remote computer with SBS installed. I got this from the Logitech forum. You can also use the SB player, I think they call it Squeezeplay, to run the Touch from a remote computer on your network.

There ARE complaints at the Logitech Forum (Touch thread) that scanning a music library does take several times as long as it does in other SB setups, especially when using a USB drive connected to the Touch. Apparently this is because most USB drives are slow, and the Touch also processes slowly. It seems this isn't as much of a problem if your music is not on a USB drive attached to the Touch.

And yes, if you run the Touch as a server, you can synch other SB devices to it. However, the wiki says the Touch can manage a max of 3 SB devices, if I remember correctly. Worth it to read the Wiki, which explains exactly what the limitations of the Touch as a server are.