[vegasdave]

I don't think anyone's condemning him, we're just questioning his system, room, and what have you. It does seem suspect at the present time.

Of course he doesn't hear what you and I hear. That's a given.

Anyway, the point is, it wasn't a fair and balanced review, imo. And he could have done better given his experience. Not saying he had to like the 7Bs of course.

Regardless of this review, the 7B will live on as a great amp. The good reports far outweigh the bad.

[vegasdave]

I'm glad I listen  to world class musicans,studios,post product ect as they use
BRYSTON in their studios,home inviroment.
If there was something not right with the sound they'de change it or fix it.
Bryston has plenty of back up of people who,listen ,breath music all their lives.
I definately take note as they have tons more experience than the mailman that got a shot at reviewing.Ticks me off a bit, but then there is always one around that has his nose in the air and thinks his shit don't stink.
That's why I ask people who have been around audio for a long time,because they had heard gear in all types of venues,I'll trust them first and then myself.
I'm more than satisfied with Bryston,for me they get the music right and I follow.

That's pretty much why I got into Bryston as well.

[VOLKS]

does anyone have actual link to the said review?

[mkaiser]

Hi everyone, I lurk more than participate on these threads, but I am here
alot, and I do enjoy Audiocircle. Here is my take of this review.

KUDOS to Michael Fremer!!!!!!  I give him alot of credit for reporting it like
he heard it.  Now I do not mean to offend anyone, but lets be honest, no one
likes to hear a negative review of a component you own. Right? I know I do not
feel good hearing anything negative about any of the products that I own.
The truth is, I would rather have someone be honest with me about there findings, or reviews of components I own or am considering owning instead of blowing smoke up my backside to make me feel better.

As an audiophile I have come to learn what so many people have said to me in the past. TRUST YOUR EARS!!!!! I have already bought components that maybe did not get the most favorable review, but I still bought them anyway because I TRUSTED MY EARS!! LOLOLOL.

I have been reading Stereophile on and off for many years, and I do like Mr.
Fremers analogue corner. I do believe that he is totally honest with his findings
when he reviews a component in his system. He would be doing the reader a disservice by writing a false review. I just don't believe he would do that. He is
a very respectable reviewer in the industry, and a true audio enthusiast. His review is based on what HE HEARD, and he is entitled to his opinion. I do not have to always agree what reviewers hear and write, but I do respect
when a reviewer is honest with his findings. This is what makes this hobby interesting. Everyones system will sound different with identical components
because we all listen in different listening environments

I wouldn't condemn the guy because he doesn't hear what you hear. Thanks for letting me share.

I agree, good reply Tagman

[drew54]

I just got my Sphile this evening and want to write this before I read the Bryston review.

Every one of us latches on to different key characteristics when we listen critically to equipment.  It may be soundstage, or bass, or transients, macro/microdynamics, air, body, etc. 

Bryston amps have been given rave reviews by Greenhill in s-philes past, and i'm glad to see they gave this one to someone else.  I dont always agree w Mr. Fremer's opinions, but I do agree with him way more than I do w Tellig or Valin, to name a couple.

His job is to tell it like he hears it.  The job of the magazine is entertainment (the real job is to make enough money to stay afloat, and I'm glad to see 146pp up from the 120s in recent issues).

I cheer Fremer's honesty, and can remember other times he has loved components that measured poorly, or that I thought unremarkable.

We are all experts, and we all have different systems, and lust after different equipment.  This implies some variance in opinion, no?  How polarized is this group about Wilson Maxxes? 

BTW,
I own a Bryston 4B, which I use for bass duty only.  It is an older unit and I expect it to work forever.  I dont like it that much full range, which is why god invented tubes.

Now I can read the article.

Cheers,
Drew

[James Tanner]

I'm glad I listen  to world class musicans,studios,post product ect as they use
BRYSTON in their studios,home inviroment.
If there was something not right with the sound they'de change it or fix it.
Bryston has plenty of back up of people who,listen ,breath music all their lives.
I definately take note as they have tons more experience than the mailman that got a shot at reviewing.Ticks me off a bit, but then there is always one around that has his nose in the air and thinks his shit don't stink.
That's why I ask people who have been around audio for a long time,because they had heard gear in all types of venues,I'll trust them first and then myself.
I'm more than satisfied with Bryston,for me they get the music right and I follow.

Hi Don,

Speaking of professionals that choose Bryston I am extremely proud of this one:


PRESS RELEASE
BOSTON PHILHARMONIC ORCHESTRA CONDUCTOR BENJAMIN ZANDER SELECTS BRYSTON/PMC 5.1-CHANNEL REFERENCE PLAYBACK SYSTEM



Peterborough, Ontario March, 2009—Bryston (www.bryston.com) has announced that world-famous conductor Benjamin Zander (Boston Philharmonic Orchestra) has chosen Bryston-powered PMC speakers for his playback studio. "I have found it at last: The Perfect Sound!" said Zander.

The reference surround-sound system was designed by Joe Less from JL AV Design, who worked closely with the famed conductor to ensure the highest playback quality. JL AV Design also supplied and installed the system components. Zander was supplied with a pair of PMC MB2-XBD-Active loudspeakers for the left and right channels, plus an MB2-Active Center, all of which are powered by PMC-Bryston Active amplifiers and crossovers. For surround channels, Joe Less chose a pair of PMC Wafer 2™ On-wall flat-panel loudspeakers powered by a Bryston SP2 surround amplifier/processor.

Zander commented on the realism and transparency achieved with his new Bryston/PMC ultra-precision monitoring system: "Warmth, precision, power, depth and, above all, truth. Ah, there's the rub! If the performance or the recording has the slightest flaw there is nothing to hide it. I close my eyes, and think I am in the ideal seat in the greatest concert hall in the world. Every detail, from the gentle swish of a cymbal to the complex texture of a Mahlerian orchestra, is realized with perfect clarity. I thought I had heard everything that audio could do, but this takes us to another level."

With his own orchestra and as a guest conductor with orchestras around the world, Benjamin Zander has become known as a musical maverick. His recordings with London's Philharmonia are some of the best regarded CDs of the modern era, winning prizes and selling in the hundreds of thousands. Of his Telarc recording of Mahler's Third, Home Theater said: "This is one of the most revelatory moments in the history of surround orchestral recordings." Of the Mahler 6th, High Fidelity wrote: "This recording is quite simply the finest Mahler Sixth. It raises the bar for the whole classical recording industry."

The conductor has also released five highly successful CDs with the Boston Philharmonic, all of which are listed in the Penguin Guide - The Best Recordings of the past Twenty Years. Their recording of "The Rite of Spring" was voted by the New York Times as one of the Ten Most Important Musical Events of 1992 and even Zander's phenomenal high-school aged Youth Philharmonic at the New England Conservatory where he has taught for over 40 years, has made five commercial recordings and several PBS specials on their 15 international tours.

[drummermitchell]

Hi James, I read that to, and I'm sure Benjamin would be very,very picky about how he likes his sound.Just like a piece somebody was playing if it wasn't on the money,you'de do it again or change gear.Alicia keyes,Ray Charles,Stevie Wonder,EarthWind&Fire,Steve Winwood,they wouldn't be using Bryston if it didn't do justice to their MUSIC,let alone all the studios ,sound productions ect.These guys I'd love to be around for 6 months.Hell It be great to visit Bryston and see what's happenin+how it's done.And then to top it off
trek over to James place to check out his rooms while he's tending the Texas BBQ and say Howdy.Conductors, musicians,James, ect,those folks I take notice.
You can't put a price on people that have been around the music,movie industry
for 30 or more years as there is tons of info they have and are willin to  share
and they love it,with no ego

[James Tanner]

I'm glad I listen  to world class musicans,studios,post product ect as they use
BRYSTON in their studios,home inviroment.
If there was something not right with the sound they'de change it or fix it.
Bryston has plenty of back up of people who,listen ,breath music all their lives.
I definately take note as they have tons more experience than the mailman that got a shot at reviewing.Ticks me off a bit, but then there is always one around that has his nose in the air and thinks his shit don't stink.
That's why I ask people who have been around audio for a long time,because they had heard gear in all types of venues,I'll trust them first and then myself.
I'm more than satisfied with Bryston,for me they get the music right and I follow.

Hi Folks,

I certainly do not have all the answers but as a company we try to build the most accurate gear we can given the current state of the art.  Obviously it is up to each individual to decide whether we succeed or fail at our task. What I can say with certainty though is that amplifying the waveform as accurately as possible is the only approach that makes sense to Bryston. If everyone is left to ‘voice’ a product as they see fit then the circle continues and judgments about accuracy become more difficult.  Replicating the sound of a real instrument playing in real space is our goal at Bryston.  There is a big difference between production and reproduction.  We are about reproducing the input. 

I have been very fortunate over these many years being involved with Bryston because it is one of the few companies that bridge the gap between the Pro Studio recording side of the business and the home listening experience. It has really help me understand both sides of the equation and how there are really more similarities than differences between what traditionally is seen as differing points of view on the same subject. We at Bryston perceive the difference in audio equipment as the difference between "Production and Reproduction". If your goal is to reproduce the input, then your choices of equipment will be different than someone who desires to produce a particular sound or result because they may personally prefer it.

I will say though that I think the ability for us to demonstrate our products at the many shows we attend and have quality listeners report that we achieve some of the best sound they have heard speaks volumes for what performance level our products attain.  Believe me trying to get credible sound in some of these hotel rooms is not an easy task! Also the fact that many, many professional recording engineers and people in the music and entertainment business choose Bryston indicates to me that we are on the correct path.


James

[1oldguy]

It the same story with B&W Speakers...I'm referring to the 802D in particular.The midrange for this speakers is very forward as those who love them say.I however  think it's a polite way of saying the speakers is unbalanced.Now to some others I'm sure they feel it's the best thing since sliced bread.
Personal preference I would think has so much to do with if we like a particular  set of speakers or any other piece of audio gear.

[drummermitchell]

If I'm reading mclsound(PAGE 4)correctly, that tells me alot about that reviewer and he has
followers ,Like I said I'm glad I use my ears and I pay attention to people who have been LISTENING,PLAYING MUSIC for most of their lives.
Wasn't there a review done by John Atkinson(same mag)that said the 7s were SUPERB,let alone others.If that's mike's words on PG.4,we don't have to dwell on it anymore as it shows exactly where he's at honest or not.

[predrag]

I wonder why MF paired 7B˙s with Wilsons?
These come from two different corners of HiFi world.
To make a good test of an amp one should test it with more loudspeakers.
To get the best out of Bryston 7B`s I would connect them to their natural partners IB2 or MB2.
Ten years from now Sasha will be replaced with another "revolutionary model" and 7B`s are still gonna be playing around.
 
Just my $0,02.

[werd]

I wonder why MF paired 7B˙s with Wilsons?
These come from two different corners of HiFi world.
To make a good test of an amp one should test it with more loudspeakers.
To get the best out of Bryston 7B`s I would connect them to their natural partners IB2 or MB2.
Ten years from now Sasha will be replaced with another "revolutionary model" and 7B`s are still gonna be playing around.
 
Just my $0,02.

yes i agree.  I find it very suspicious that he would use those speakers. and from what i've read they aren't very friendly. Which is fine but if you are reviewing amps and the speaker is not working, wouldnt you find another speaker. I am not suggesting filing through every speaker but considering the Wilson maxx reputation it seems that you can still review unbiased and move on from the Wilsons.

To demonstrate what i mean, i read a speaker review from Hifi+ on the wilson maxx2. In that review he used a whole assortment of amplification. He wasnt specific on setup or combination of amps. But his list was clear. The Radia and the Koran 1200 were two of about 5 amps that i can remember. But the point is he used multiple amps to garner the very nice review on the Maxx2. Is it not unreasonable that the same consideration can be made for an amp review. 

[DEV]

Hi there,

I just heard about this not so glowing review today and started reading the above threads and all I can say is WOW! I have never heard the 7's but have read they apparently sound similar to their bigger brother my 28's so that being said;

I've been too busy listening and enjoying music  while you guys have been pushing those keys away. I happen to own Bryston 28 squared mono's driving my MBL 101E speakers which I believe Mike F really loved, what I have read from some posters referring Bryston's sound characteristics has left me scratching my head  , the new squared design that is only making reference to my 28's sound.

Why do I say this? well because of your description is so far off,  so either you haven't listen to them and just have a hidden agenda  or there was a miss match within your set-up, you just don't like them which is okay but making such ridiculous statements only demonstrates to me your lack of credibility. 

I'm personally after the end result so it does not matter to me what amp manufacture  or cost it is, I recently owned $40K CAT JL3 Sig. MKII mono blocks which are well respected tube amps and they were replaced by the 28's, I have also had others costing up to $100K on demo including the MBL 9011's. What I currently own should tell you something  , so many others individuals that I have spoken too after they found out what I have has peaked their interest enough to have an "open mind" and listen to them in their own set-up, end result well James can tell you; "sales along with already established dealers wanting to add Bryston to their current line" others who have heard my set-up are usually exspecting a more exotic name but after listening are just in awe. 

There are a few of you individuals posting that really seem to just have a hidden agenda, your attitude stinks, you are rude and seem to like to characterise others like myself just because I own Bryston product, you don't even know me nor have you heard my set-up, your postings have no credibility, why don't you just move onto another thread as life is too short reading your nonsense. 

Regarding reviewers, boy what a topic that is and I'm not even going there  , one thing for sure that interest me;

The table Mike has which list for over $100K and he just raves about, no where in his review or a follow up have I read him making any reference to the actual quality of the product, "fit and finish." Well I can tell you first hand I was looking at buying one of these and at this outrages cost factor my expectations were very very high and did not even come close, I am also aware of another individual who had the same negative experience but along with reliability. There's another pce MF also has and is thrilled about, huum!  I could say something but why? FYI. I have nothing against him. 

[vegasdave]

Not to change the subject, but I would really like to hear your system!

[budt]

  I hope he accepts my offer.If not I will be buying a new pair shortly or save up for a pair of 28b. When you make such a great product you sell a shit load.You are bound to see them on the used market because of the shear numbers sold.Bryston are so well made you even see lots of 20 year old plus Bryston amps for sale. How does Musical Fidelity stand up over time?

[vegasdave]

"We're not gonna take it. No, we ain't gonna take it. We're not gonna take it anymore!" -Twisted Sister.   

I agree, and I would like to add, that putting a Bryston preamp in front of a Bryston amp makes perfect sense. It's called impedance matching and in an audiophile sense, synergy. Common sense! It has nothing to do with marketing and what have you.

That's what Fremer failed to do, take that into account. Impedance matching. Perhaps Bryston, like in other cases, provided Fremer with a BP26 preamp to match with the 7Bs. However, like another poster said, Fremer should have tried another speaker if his personal ones weren't working well. I had the same experience. I tried a pair of Phase-Tech speakers and they were dull and lifeless. It would have been easy to blame the Bryston amp, but I sent those back to the dealer and got a pair of JBLs (which are my current speakers.) These JBLs sing with the Bryston equipment.

This whole thing is a mess, really. The Bryston measures 100 percent perfectly. There is nothing wrong with it mechanically or electrically. So what happened was a mismatch with the preamp and probably a mismatch with the speakers. Again, common sense. The measurements in Stereophile show a mismatch between Fremers preamp and the Bryston amps.

Sound-wise, that's a matter of opinion of course. As James said, the Bryston sound is to reproduce what is at the input. Bryston amps don't color the sound. If you're looking at tubes, those color the sound. Adjectives like "warm," and "smooth" suggests a colored sound. My guess is that Fremer likes a colored sound and the Bryston amps did not give that to him. Well, too bad. Bryston isn't going to make colored amps to please reviewers.

[Imperial]

Hi everyone, I lurk more than participate on these threads, but I am here
alot, and I do enjoy Audiocircle. Here is my take of this review.

KUDOS to Michael Fremer!!!!!!  I give him alot of credit for reporting it like
he heard it.
---

I have been reading Stereophile on and off for many years, and I do like Mr.
Fremers analogue corner. I do believe that he is totally honest with his findings
when he reviews a component in his system.

And this an important factor in any review, that you get the impression, and understand, that the
tester passes the test of his own truth.
So be it the truth, according to the truth that is Michael Fremer.
This is but a voyage, for one amp at sea, on the waters of Michael.

Don't we need his kind? The one that speaks what is the words he feel is his?
So be it that not all words are kind.
Two kinds of truth, one is kind, the other one is one of a kind...  aa
Are the amps one of a kind? Or the other?
Kind regards, Imperial.
(Have read the inner ear review, will read the other when I get my S'phile.)

And the sentence that popped out for me in the inner ear review is that he feels that the amps
are great for those speakers needing power, really kick them to life.
So my first thought now is, and I have not yet read Fremers words, that his speakers somehow...
are so efficient, and this is somehow a clue here.

As for Fremer having Michaelson over with the Titan amps... Excerpt from that test:
"When I first powered it up, the Titan's power supply emitted noticeable transformer hum. This wasn't audible when music was playing even at very low levels, but it's not something you should have to live with after forking over $30,000 for a power amp—or a car, for that matter. The hum has since been fixed for future production (the repair is retrofittable), but I wonder why it wasn't caught earlier.

He is a hardass... and sometimes an ass, one is kind, the other is one of a kind...
I mean, the designer could have been standing next to him, "It hums, I'm not impressed..M'kay"

Some are indeed hard to please.

Imp.

[1oldguy]

I read recently in one of MF articles that he said there is."No one perfect speaker"and that "All have something  a little different to offer".I can't see why this wouldn't be true for all other audio gear.I'm sure he would agree with that.
I do need a preamp and am have been thinking about something with tubes in it.I like to keep an open mind as much as I can.

[Imperial]

Nevertheless, I raise my glass in a toast to Mr Tanner and Mr Fremer for their continued love for their respective crafts!
May they strive to be their best, on any voyage, be it here, or in music!

Imp.

[redbook]

Well said. Regards from Peter Griffin.......