[maxwalrath]

I came across this in another thread, and it got me thinking about people's feelings about rap music:

Country music. All of it. Followed closely by rap.

Does rap actually qualify as music?

It might qualify as tribal entertainment, but it's at the top of my shit list if it really is music.

I'd like to say  to comments questioning if rap is music, but I digress.  I grew up in an urban area in the 90's, and was exposed to tons of rap music, and liked it a lot.  Today, I find a lot of what I liked to be crap, but I think a lot of it has stood the test of time.  I have found rap songs that my grandparents and other older relatives liked.  If you dig deep enough, there is rap music that is lyrical, rhythmic, creative (allowing that the genre is based on sampling), socially conscious, and even occasionally non-offensive!  These are few and far between, but the genre as a whole might have more redeeming qualities than it is given credit for....

That said, I really do understand where people are coming from when they dismiss this entire genre of music and part of our culture.  I dislike about 95% of what is played on rap radio stations, and nearly 100% of the crap that the music industry forces upon MTV and BET, and I absolutely understand why people dislike what they've been exposed to. 

So here's the plan...I have an idea about a few rap songs I'd recommend to people who hate the genre, but I'd like to hear from the other 5 people who've enjoyed rap music out of the 13,000 members here at AC.  After some input from others, I'll put together my official list of the top 10 songs to change people's opinions about the entire genre of rap music.  This will be my list, with my biases, but I could use some help.  So lets hear it people, what rap music do you think could make people give the genre a second look?

Trolls, please keep quiet and let this thing happen without too much snark. 

[JoshK]

Don't know about songs, but two groups that were very tolerable, even enjoyable, even though I don't really care a whole lot for the genre were A Tribe Called Quest and Public Enemy.

I sure there were others, but those two had stuff that even I liked.

[Len_Dreyer]

I love most of Michael Franti's stuff. For me, it's hippie rap. My eldest son (20) turned me on to him a couple of years ago. Michael does a free concert every year in Golden Gate Park.

Len

[drab]

Express Yourself by NWA. Dre at his best. Most people hear NWA and think of gangsta rap and
f the police but this song is fantastic and doesn't have any of that stuff.

[bunnyma357]

For me Digital Underground is the best, most musical. Public Enemy is great. Also agree with Michael Franti (Spearhead, Disposable Heroes).

I like some Eminem if I'm in the right mood, but I hate a lot of his stuff as well. I liked DMX's music, but can't really support anyone involved with cruelty to animals.

Then there are all the one or two hit type people with a great song or two.

Jim C

[emac]

It's a shame that some people here feel this way about hip hop.  I'll be the first to admit that there's a decent amount of hedonistic garbage out there, but there are some really terrific tracks and albums out there.  Personally, I'm more into more musical and positive hip hop that now-a-days is reserved for underground hip hop.  And rather than listing tracks, which is going to be difficult, I'd prefer to list my top 10 hip hop albums to change peoples' perspectives.  No particular order.  Here we go:

1.  Swollen Members: Black Magic
    (unfortunately named group) all of their albums are terrific, usually having a darker vibe to them
2.  K-Otix: Universal
    Terrific vibe
3.  Cunninlynguists: Southernunderground
    (another unfortunately named group), nice Southern feel to the album, on this album they don't always take themselves seriously either
3a.  Kno vs. Hov: hard to find, so not officially part of the list, but Kno is the producer for the Lynguists, and this is Jay-Z's Black    
      Album w/ that Southern feel.  Terrific.  
4.  Foreign Exchange: Connected
     Musical production and lyrics by Phonte of Little Brother
5.  K-Os: Joyful Rebellion
    Uses real instruments, and, gasp!, singing on this terrific album
6.  Zion I and the Grouch: Heroes in the City of Dope
    Big fan of the lyrics and electronic-styled production of Zion I, this is one of their better produced albums one that I can use to
    test my systems
7.  Jemini and Dangermouse: Ghetto Pop Life
    Produced by Dangermouse of the Grey Album and Gnarles Barkley fame.  Jemini is a terrific lyricist.  Somewhat lo-fi at times, but the
    vibe is great.
8.  Styles of Beyond: 2000 Fold
    Got a nice spy-like vibe to it
9.  Jurassic 5: Quality Control
    Well produced w/ good harmonizing of the lyricists
10.  Ugly Duckling: Journey to Anywhere
    Old school sounding and they don't take themselves seriously.

Honorable mention: Mos Def & Talib Kweli are Black Star: for the lyricism

[konut]

 The Revolution Will Not Be Televised -  Gil Scott-Heron

[rockadanny]

I don't have 10, but for me it was Us3's Cantaloop. What it changed in my mind was that it COULD be done well. Unfortunately, IMO, for the most part I don't hear what I would consider music in most all of it still.

Gil Scott-Heron. Ha! Good one Konut! I have that CD. I also like, "Whitey on the Moon". Cracks me up every time. Good music on that CD.

[emac]

Speaking as someone who listens to predominantly electronic music as well as some hip hop, I feel both genres require a certain background or mindset.  If you're into traditional instrumentation or singing, you're going to be put off by both genres since they typically don't incorporate either.  But there's no good reason to say that either genre is terrible, and that they aren't musical.  Sure, there is terrible music in both genres (and unfortunately a lot of hip hop that you hear on the radio is nowhere near being good), but there are also amazing pieces of music in every sense of the word.  It's just different. 

If rapping and synths/samples aren't your thing, then that's fine.  Just don't knock those who have musical tastes than you do.   

[BillB]

PE, a Tribe called Quest, Run DMC, some LL Cool J, NERD, Disposable Heros, Flobots.

As you can see I am an old school kind of guy.

[funkmonkey]

I third the anything by A Tribe Called Quest.

And add anything by Digable Planets, or The Roots

"Rap" encompasses a very wide range of music that is still being defined, some of which is outstanding.  Some...  not so much.

[richidoo]

Mystikal "Bouncin Back"... Strong positive message, awesome innovative production style.

[Rashiki]

I like a lot of music from Control Machete. It's in Spanish, but it's basically rap. Technically, it's Mexcian hip hop, but what do I know?

[mcgsxr]

+1 on the Digable Planets, great stuff on their first 2 albums.

Fantastic Voyage is also a great Coolio song.

[TF1216]

emac, great reply!  There is a lot of new material I was not familiar with.  Thank you.

I can recommend a few songs that I have successfully turned relatives onto rap music with.

2Pac's "Starin' Through my Rearview" from the Gang Related soundtrack.  If you are cunning enough one could find the mix with Phil Collin's "In the Air Tonight".  Also check out "Brenda's Got a Baby".  2Pac has a real way with his lyrics.

I love listening to Lyrics Born who is big on the west coast and with the Aussies.  A few songs I would recommend to give one a taste of him are "I Can't Wait For Your Love", "Differences", "Whispers", "Is It The Skin I'm In?", "Callin' Out", "Bad Dreams" and "Stop Complaining".  Sorry, that's a lot of recommendations.  His lyrics are a ton of funk, check him out.

Notorious B.I.G. "One More Chance / Stay With Me Remix"
Every person I know loves "Notorious Thugs" by Notorious B.I.G. and Bone Thugs N' Harmony (my favorite group ever).

[Wayner]

I'm sure you will all hate me but there isn't even one song that would change my mind. I think the "music" has many problems one being the culture it crawled out of. The second is the message which is usually slurred with negative, anti-establishment blah, blah, blahs. Even the volume level the music is played at, ESPECIALLY IN THE LISTENER'S CAR, is very disrespectful and again shows the arrogance of the culture. The neighbor kid tried to play this shit outside one day this summer, playing basketball. I told him that his "boombox" was going to have an accident if he didn't shut it off. Later, his dad came home and I told him what had happened. He said good and gave me a beer.

Wayner

[F-100]

There are only couple of rap songs that I can tolerate is when they mixed a little rap with other original song like Run D.M.C. and Aerosmith in Walk This Way. Other than that, I'm with Wayner and have the same feeling about rap.

[drab]

Even the volume level the music is played at, ESPECIALLY IN THE LISTENER'S CAR, is very disrespectful and again shows the arrogance of the culture.

Although similar to your post in this thread.

[strider]

I'm sure you will all hate me but there isn't even one song that would change my mind. I think the "music" has many problems one being the culture it crawled out of. The second is the message which is usually slurred with negative, anti-establishment blah, blah, blahs. Even the volume level the music is played at, ESPECIALLY IN THE LISTENER'S CAR, is very disrespectful and again shows the arrogance of the culture. The neighbor kid tried to play this shit outside one day this summer, playing basketball. I told him that his "boombox" was going to have an accident if he didn't shut it off. Later, his dad came home and I told him what had happened. He said good and gave me a beer.

Wayner

Not trying to incite any bad blood or anything, but why would you post this?

[maxwalrath]

.