[Danny Richie]

The Neo-2X uses the M-165X woofer and new deep back cup Neo3pdr.



It is shown here in the larger of the PE curved boxes. It is also in a sealed box and should integrate really well with the Direct Servo subs. I already have a few people wanting to build these as a three way using the Direct Servo subs. A single side loaded SW-12-04 would make this an incredible full range speaker with great sound and flat to 20Hz.

The basic kit for the M-165X with Neo3pdr with deep back cup will be $329.

This uses Alpha Core foil inductors, Lynk resistors, Erse poly caps, and Sonicap Gen.2 by-pass cap in the tweeter circuit. This also uses the GR Research standard binding post cups. It does not include a port as it can be used in a sealed .5 cubic foot box.

Upgrade options are as follows:

All Sonicaps throughout and Mills resistors, add $110.

Sonicaps and Mills resistors in the tweeter circuit only, plus a by-pass cap for the woofer circuit, add $75.

Vampire wire binding post (BP1.5 Hex) add $31.50 See more info on those here: http://vampirewire.com/pc-48-16-binding-postbrbp15hex.aspx  If you use the PE cabinets these drop right into the pre-drilled holes by making the holes that are already in the back of the box just a little bit larger. Chasing through them with a slightly larger drill bit is pretty easy.

JPS Labs internal wire, add $42. (14 feet, used in sealed mini-monitor) More info here: http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=53822.0

If you want to go all out and add Sonicap Platinum by-pass caps to the tweeter circuit then that will add $116.

A taller floor standing version can be built using the 2" PSP port or a slotted port to give you a -3db of 40Hz. A pair of 2" flared ports from PSP, add $20. http://www.psp-inc.com/

1 sheet of No Rez add $38. This will cover a pair of small cabinets. 2 sheets are needed for the floor standing version.

Here are the crossover responses.



On axis, 10, 20, 30, and 40 degrees off axis.



Again the vertical off axis measurements look really good too. We have on tweeter axis, 6, 12, and 18 degrees above tweeter axis.



Spectral decay is really clean too.



And the impedance sweep.

[klh]

Hey Danny... nice work .

What is the anechoic response of the 1X and 2X? What can be expected in room? Sensitivity? Recommended power? Of the two, which do you prefer? How much space is needed for the 165-X driver to be ported? Just thinking out loud, but could the Neo-1X be sealed and in the PE 0.5 cubic foot enclosure and then have one 165-X ported in a second enclosure below (e.g. the curved PE 1 cubic foot enclosure)?

[Danny Richie]

What is the anechoic response of the 1X and 2X?

Neo-1X:



Neo-2X:

What can be expected in room?

Considering how even the off axis responses are, the in room response should be much smoother and more consistent than most speakers.

Sensitivity?

See graphs above.

Recommended power?

I'd recommend 30 to 40 watts.

Of the two, which do you prefer?

I'll need to live with them a little more before I answer that.

How much space is needed for the 165-X driver to be ported?

1.0 to 1.2 cubic feet.

Just thinking out loud, but could the Neo-1X be sealed and in the PE 0.5 cubic foot enclosure and then have one 165-X ported in a second enclosure below (e.g. the curved PE 1 cubic foot enclosure)?

I think there are better ways to incorporate those drivers.

[poseidonsvoice]

What is the F3 for the sealed Neo-2X and the ported Neo-1X?

Thanks,
Anand.

[Danny Richie]

What is the F3 for the sealed Neo-2X and the ported Neo-1X?

The numbers say 77Hz and 55Hz.

[Zero]

Danny - they look great !  I'm sure they sound even better than they look.   

[slksc]

So, if I needed bookshelf speakers next to a wall, would this version in a sealed box be the best choice of the two?  And how would this compare to the AV/3S in a bookshelf?

[Zero the Hero]

awesome work Danny. Question about adding the sub; if you were going to use just one amp to power both subs, would you do 2 4 ohms in series or 2 8 ohms in parallel. Or is that a bad idea for the servo to have the drivers that far apart?

[Danny Richie]

So, if I needed bookshelf speakers next to a wall, would this version in a sealed box be the best choice of the two?

Yes, the sealed box version would be best for against a wall.

And how would this compare to the AV/3S in a bookshelf?

The A/V-3S is a great little speaker, but it does not have this level of detail. I fact this speaker, is really quite a step up in performance across the board.

Question about adding the sub; if you were going to use just one amp to power both subs, would you do 2 4 ohms in series or 2 8 ohms in parallel.

I'd parallel the two 8 ohm woofers. In regards to the Direct Servo subs, they MUST be paralleled.

Or is that a bad idea for the servo to have the drivers that far apart?

If I were going to run a pair of subs that are separate from the main speakers then I'd run both of them together in a common box (not necessarily the same air space, but a common box).

[Zero the Hero]

how do these compare to your mtm with the 16ohm gr130s and the Neo 3? Can you use the new Neo 3 in that design? Does the dual woofer's response curve look as smooth?

[Danny Richie]

how do these compare to your mtm with the 16ohm gr130s and the Neo 3?

I haven't listened to them side by side. They should be very close. The big difference though is sensitivity. The Neo-1X and Neo-2X have fairly low sensitivity at around 86db. Using a pair of M-130/16's brings it up to a little over 90db. 

Can you use the new Neo 3 in that design?

Yes, I will be redesigning that one to use the new Neo 3.

Does the dual woofer's response curve look as smooth?

I am sure it will be just as smooth.

[Loftprojection]

And how would this compare to the AV/3S in a bookshelf?

The A/V-3S is a great little speaker, but it does not have this level of detail. I fact this speaker, is really quite a step up in performance across the board.

Hello Danny, how would you say these differ from my A/V-3 in terms of sound?  Obviously they wont go down as low but if I was to combine those new Neo-1X with my SW-12A sub versus my A/V-3 with the same sub?  If you say they are quite a step up from the A/V-3S then I assume it applies also to the A/V-3?  Thanks

[Danny Richie]

These new kits won't play as low as you A/V-3 unless you do a Neo-2X kit in a ported floor standing design.

The other real difference is sensitivity as I have already mentioned.

These new designs really do excel in every other way though. Resolution across the board is really outstanding using these new tweeters. It is clearly a performance edge.

[Loftprojection]

These new kits won't play as low as you A/V-3 unless you do a Neo-2X kit in a ported floor standing design.

The other real difference is sensitivity as I have already mentioned.

These new designs really do excel in every other way though. Resolution across the board is really outstanding using these new tweeters. It is clearly a performance edge.

Well then, I guess I just got myself a project for next winter!  We do have winter with real snow up North!   

[ttan98]

Danny,

This post is not to question your ability as a x-over designer but rather you can explain to me your design philosophy. This design philosophy permeates to other models in your current speaker range. My query is:

The on axis freq response seems has a peak around 4.5Khz  and rising response from 8Khz upwards. Does it affect the perceived sound quality? Most speaker designs seem to opt for a "BBC dip" on rising frequency response.

Does these rises give a perceived sound of a "sparkle" at the top?

Off axis response is ok, as the response seems to get flatter.

An explanation is welcome.

[Danny Richie]

This post is not to question your ability as a x-over designer but rather you can explain to me your design philosophy. This design philosophy permeates to other models in your current speaker range.

I guess I'd have to say a lean more towards accuracy and an even in room response. So I look to maintain an even response in the vertical and horizontal off axis ranges.

The on axis freq response seems has a peak around 4.5Khz  and rising response from 8Khz upwards. Does it affect the perceived sound quality?

Peak? Rising response? If you draw a line through the middle of it then it varies less than about 2db up or down from end to end. The Neo's do have a smoother response in the 10 to 20 degrees off axis than they do on axis. So off axis response is even smoother than on axis.

This means you can face the speaker more straight out into the room and get a smooth response plus a wider sound stage.

Most rooms with carpet, padded furniture, and any room treatments really suck up the high frequency output levels. Check the room response of these two speakers.



This is an LS-6 and an A/V-1. Neither of them have a rolled off top end. In fact, the top end of the A/V-1 is not too unlike the Neo-2X.

Most speaker designs seem to opt for a "BBC dip" on rising frequency response.

I measure lots of different speakers all the time and I rarely see a BBC dip.

I think that if the recording engineer would have wanted a dipped out area in there then he would have created one. The speakers job is to reproduce the input signal as accurately as possible.

Does these rises give a perceived sound of a "sparkle" at the top?

Nope, no sparkle, no brightness. A little added sense of air? Maybe, but it still does not add as much as the room takes away.

Something else to keep in mind is where the music is.

[Zero the Hero]

thats really impressive in-room response! Must be a real nice room, I imagine. I was going to ask you if the slightly raggeder response of the Neo-2x is noticible next to the x, or if it really is irrelevent in your average room.

I have no idea if raggeder is a real word, just sounded good 

[Danny Richie]

I was going to ask you if the slightly raggeder response of the Neo-2x is noticible next to the x, or if it really is irrelevent in your average room.

Both of those models sound very much the same. One plays a little lower (the Neo-1X) but the other has a little bit tighter and more controlled bass response (Neo-2X). On a lot of music you really don't notice the difference between the two.

Keep in mind too that we don't just hear the on axis response but a combination of the output in all directions. This is where these speakers really excel.

Also note that the design axis for these is about 10 degrees off axis. Check the response variance in a 10 degree off axis range.



It is about +/-1db over a pretty good range. That's not too ragged. 

[Doublenaughtspy]

What are the overall dimensions of this Neo-2X (and how does it compare to the ported Neo-1X)?

[Danny Richie]

What are the overall dimensions of this Neo-2X

The front baffle is 8.5" by 14" for the sealed box version, and .5 cubic feet of air space is recommended. It can also be built into a small floor standing design with a ported enclosure of 1 to 1.2 cubic feet.

(and how does it compare to the ported Neo-1X)?

They are a whole lot more alike than different. I haven't decided which I like best yet. Plus my Neo-1X pair needs more burn in time to catch up with my Neo-2X pair. I'll do more comparisons later.