Paradisea DAC

jaspal kallar · « **Reply #440 on:** 28 Apr 2007, 05:42 pm »

Quote from: GHM on 28 Apr 2007, 05:37 pm

I admit the curiosity about Nick's new dac is killing me!
I need to find out how much he'll charge me too put in that USB port and what USB receiver he's planning to use in it. aa

Nick mentioned in an email to me that USB would be USD35 extra but no info about the USB reciever.

- jaspal

GHM · « **Reply #441 on:** 28 Apr 2007, 05:49 pm »

Quote from: jaspal kallar on 28 Apr 2007, 05:42 pm

Quote from: GHM on 28 Apr 2007, 05:37 pm
I admit the curiosity about Nick's new dac is killing me!
I need to find out how much he'll charge me too put in that USB port and what USB receiver he's planning to use in it. aa

Nick mentioned in an email to me that USB would be USD35 extra but no info about the USB receiver.

- jaspal

Thanks jaspal this sounds very reasonable. The only reason I wondered about what type of receiver. Was because my USB-AUDIO driver isn't compatible with the chip used in my +Paradisea. It works fine with the 27XX BB USB receiver used in my my former UD-10. The Paradisea sounds fine though using direct kernal streaming in Foobar. I would like to use this driver with something. If he uses the 27XX chip this would be a plus. I have a $65 USB-AUDIO driver that I can't use at the moment.

Oscillate · « **Reply #442 on:** 30 Apr 2007, 02:38 am »

"I have a $65 USB-AUDIO driver that I can't use at the moment"

I downloaded the trial version of that same USB driver. But the install hangs each time.
It can't seem to recognize my USB sound device. Has that happened to you also?

I am using XP Pro SP2.

GHM · « **Reply #443 on:** 30 Apr 2007, 03:40 am »

From what I gather so far. The driver isn't compatible with the Paradisea's USB receiver chip. I remember the driver recognizing the UD-10 receiver chip. It actually displayed the name of the chip as it loaded up.

rollo · « **Reply #444 on:** 1 May 2007, 12:22 am »

jaspal,
Did not demo Altman as of yet. The reason for the transformer output in the Promitheus DAC is to provide a proper impedance match for the next piece in line. Companies like AudioNote, Wright, use this technology as well. It is very effective. The power transformer is balanced, which is a first at this price level ,actually unheard of.
The Paradisea is a quality DA that can be modified to outperform many a DAC. I just want to compare to Promitheus DAC with its innovative design.
rollo

jaspal kallar · « **Reply #445 on:** 1 May 2007, 09:55 pm »

Quote from: rollo on 1 May 2007, 12:22 am

jaspal,
Did not demo Altman as of yet. The reason for the transformer output in the Promitheus DAC is to provide a proper impedance match for the next piece in line. Companies like AudioNote, Wright, use this technology as well. It is very effective. The power transformer is balanced, which is a first at this price level ,actually unheard of.
The Paradisea is a quality DA that can be modified to outperform many a DAC. I just want to compare to Promitheus DAC with its innovative design.
rollo

Cheers for the info Rollo.

Looking into Nick's DAC first and also the Altmann. Infact I feel like changing my amps; so perhaps the Altmann BYOB may be the first.

Looking forward to your Promitheus DAC comments. When will you get it?

- jaspal.

kbuzz3 · « **Reply #446 on:** 2 May 2007, 08:05 pm »

I hit about 120-150 on my new usb version. I have to say im shocked, shocked at the improvement. I believe in break in but this is a major change. The funny thing is not texture or tone, but imaging and grain. I dont usually give two #$%$ about imaging but on a lot of music, the players are floating in space. Wow

the fatigue free presentation aint bad either....

nicksgem10s · « **Reply #447 on:** 2 May 2007, 09:01 pm »

Does anyone know what the output level is on the new Paradisea DAC? Thanks if you can provide that info.

Nick

NotoriousBIG_PJ · « **Reply #448 on:** 12 May 2007, 05:08 am »

Sorry to derail the thread, but has anyone received their Promitheus DAC yet?

Biggie.

yashu · « **Reply #449 on:** 12 May 2007, 10:49 pm »

I have a hagUSB and I got the USB audio driver... I bought it hoping for an improvement but what I got was not an improvement. The sound was... harsh... I have the hagUSB going into an MHDT Dialogue II so you guys may not like the driver if you get it to work. The best sound so far has been ASIO4ALL and ASIO plugin using the regular windows USB audio driver. All the mixers are bypassed and I am getting a bit-accurate signal so I don't think I am missing anything by not using the special driver.

I don't know why it sounded harsh, honestly, but I can tell you that I was kindof concerned with how the driver interfaced the USB audio device with windows, it seemed like something was not right, like I was not getting a bit perfect signal. I am sure I am getting bit perfect with ASIO4ALL and an ASIO plugin, so I would rather stick with what I know is a sure thing.

I don't see anything about the driver that makes it worth the 65 dollars, at least in our cases, I am sure it works well with people that are in music production and need the low latency. I think that is it's only advantage.

GHM · « **Reply #450 on:** 13 May 2007, 12:39 pm »

That's very strange Yashu. I used the UD-10 with the USB-AUDIO driver into a Paradisea. It never sounded harsh in any way. It was clearly superior to the free ware ASIO drivers.
That was when I used XP though. Using Vista..the sound is much closer using Kernel streaming or ASIO4LL . Currently I use Foobar / kernel streaming out to USB DAC. Even the spdif output direct from the PC using Vista is much better than it was using XP... Basically another ballgame. I would imagine most would be content with that approach as no extra drivers are needed.

Good listening

yashu · « **Reply #451 on:** 13 May 2007, 04:58 pm »

Yeah it's weird.

Actually, vista seems to be the way to go in some respects. The problem with XP is that you can't remove one device from the mixer in the control panel without removing ALL audio devices from the mixers. I have the USB audio device but I also keep an audigy4 installed for games, movies, and so on.

ASIO4ALL does bypass all of them when using the hagUSB.

I think that is the only thing I am concerned about with the USB-AUDIO driver, I am not entirely sure I am getting a bit-accurate signal. See, you can't use ASIO4ALL with that driver, you have to use the usb-audio driver and with that I am not sure if it is still using one last mixer control. Unfortunately the only way to access the control panel of the driver is through pro software that I don't have.

GHM · « **Reply #452 on:** 13 May 2007, 06:07 pm »

Quote from: yashu link=topic=33534.msg#msg date=

Yeah it's weird.

Actually, vista seems to be the way to go in some respects. The problem with XP is that you can't remove one device from the mixer in the control panel without removing ALL audio devices from the mixers. I have the USB audio device but I also keep an audigy4 installed for games, movies, and so on.

ASIO4ALL does bypass all of them when using the hagUSB.

I think that is the only thing I am concerned about with the USB-AUDIO driver, I am not entirely sure I am getting a bit-accurate signal. See, you can't use ASIO4ALL with that driver, you have to use the usb-audio driver and with that I am not sure if it is still using one last mixer control. Unfortunately the only way to access the control panel of the driver is through pro software that I don't have.

You can use Winamp's asio control panel to access the control panel for the USB-AUDIO.I think the driver is bit perfect. If you go into foobars control panel to output devices, it shows up as 16 bit 44.1 or 48 kHz depending on how you configure the driver.

yashu · « **Reply #453 on:** 13 May 2007, 10:18 pm »

Quote

You can use Winamp's asio control panel to access the control panel for the USB-AUDIO.

Yeah about that... I have the winamp ASIO plugin, yet I can't get any options that I not already able to get with ASIO4ALL... I have heard I can access the control panel this way, but I'll be damned if I see it. The plugin uptions are exactly the same as they are for any ASIO output module I choose, ASIO4ALL, USB-Audio, or creative's ASIO for the audigy.

pardales · « **Reply #454 on:** 13 May 2007, 11:12 pm »

For you Mac users: I tried the demo of the USB driver that cost somewhere around 50-75 dollars. I did not find it an improvement. I think the internal Mac drivers are as good, maybe better -- not sure about the Windows/PC stuff.

yashu · « **Reply #455 on:** 14 May 2007, 10:38 pm »

I am pretty sure it is the same situation on the PC... The driver is about latency for pro applications... I just don't see how the bit perfect that comes out via ASIO4ALL and a proper usb audio device or the USB-Audio driver is going to be any more or less "perfect".

The clocking is done by the device itself, not the driver, so it can't be digital signal quality (jitter, ect...).

I thought it sounded harsher, but like I said, it may be that when I was using the driver, it wasn't getting past ALL the mixers. I still am not able to access the driver's native control panel to see if it can be fixed. Any mixer in the chain means the possibility of digital gain... so...

luvmusic8 · « **Reply #456 on:** 21 May 2007, 11:28 pm »

Is new USB tube DAC Paradiea+ true I2S USB, direct without conversion to spdif? If not, is the sound quality compromised in anyway compared to Scott Nixon's I2S USB? Can it be used with CDP besides PC? Thanks.

GHM · « **Reply #457 on:** 21 May 2007, 11:45 pm »

Quote from: luvmusic8 link=topic=33534.msg#msg date=

Is new USB tube DAC Paradiea+ true I2S USB, direct without conversion to spdif? If not, is the sound quality compromised in anyway compared to Scott Nixon's I2S USB? Can it be used with CDP besides PC? Thanks.

I haven't heard the Scott Nixon unit so I can't comment on compromises. The Paradisea doesn't sound like there is a problem with the USB to spdif conversion. It doesn't convert directly to I2S from USB.

Yes the Paradisea has a coax and optical input besides the USB input. It would be better to listen and decide for yourself if the I2S makes a huge improvement. I suspect there's more to a good sounding dac than whether it converts directly to I2S.

Good listening

yashu · « **Reply #458 on:** 24 May 2007, 12:44 am »

Consider what causes jitter in the first place, even with the extra conversion level, the signal path is so short (the physical length the signal is going to exist as s/pdif), that unless MHDT really messed their design up badly somehow, the benefits of being able to use USB for getting the signal to the DAC outweigh the possibility of jitter caused by this extra conversion, which would be very minimal compared to using s/pdif over exponentially larger distances (like from source to DAC).

The only reason NOT to use USB, would not be whether it goes to I2S or not directly, but for electrical isolation from the PC... even USB straight to I2S is going to have that problem, maybe more maybe less, but I don't know how sensitive I2S is to that vs the way MHDT does it...

I use a DIP to isolate my PC from my MHDT, I don't have a USB version to compare it to though.

anubisgrau · « **Reply #459 on:** 24 May 2007, 06:54 am »

this is also charles altmann's thoughts. he doesn't want USB on attraction DAC for similar reasons and recommends toslink for more jitter-inducing transports and coax for less.