[Jason T]

Thanks for that info it's good to know.
I ordered my parts for 3 Felix filters and cant wait to build

I appreciate the effort put into this by the smart guys 

thanks
 

[Occam]

Panomaniac,

I assume that design is an example of 'horses for courses', but for the life of me, I can't discern what course that horse is supposed to be running. Given the positioning of the capacitors, its designed more to keep noise from going through rather than noise 'backwashing'. Caps in front of the non-ground inductors could adress that somewhat.

The line and neutral inductors are typical for differential/transverse mode noise filtering, but the caps are configured for common mode noise filtering. Its neither fish nor fowl. Those 'Y' caps are constrained in value due to leakage to ground considerations. To improve differential mode attenuation one could add an 'X' cap, accross hot and neutral, sized to minimize Q peaks under some assumed minimal load.

But it is "supposed" to be a good one.

That might well be; but I can't discern for what.

The Felix is a very different topology, using a Common Mode Choke alone for attenuation of yup, common mode noise, and those CMCs are specifically chosen for their high leakage inductance, which in conjunction with the X caps address transverse/differential mode noise. One could add Y caps to the Felix design, but the increased leakage currents, IMO, cause more trouble that the benefits they might provide. YMMV

Regards,
Paul

[panomaniac]

Given the positioning of the capacitors, its designed more to keep noise from going through rather than noise 'backwashing'.

And it's not very good at either.

Its neither fish nor fowl.

I certainly have to agree there.    But no need to go any further with this one.
Suffice to say that not all designs are good, or suited to audio.
My worry about the high "backward impedance" still stands for any filter tho.  I will certainly test a Felix if I can.  If no one beats me to it.

Thanks!

[Occam]

Here is the schema of the line filter I tested.  You see, not as nice as the Felix.
The goofy looking Z things are MOVs.   The cap values are small, like 220pF.


The inductors are beefy, look like 15A or more, but the values are a fraction of the ones you use.  The ground inductor is smaller in size. ....

Upon further reflection, I've concluded it is both fish and fowl, a Chimera actaully. What you've posted is an incorrectly labeled, redrawn schematic for a output filter for the 2 dc outputs from a switching supply. Possibly a split dc supply.  Indeed someone has told someone, somewhere in its circuitous oral history that it is a good filter, but, its not one designed for single phase Mains AC. It is 2 totally separate filters designed for 2 independant dc outputs from a switching supply. If it were for AC it would use X caps. Assuming this is an actual commercial product, rather than some mutant, you'll also find that the capacitors values are possibly more likely to be 220uf (thats microFarads) rather than 220pf. And if so, they're probably electrolytics that you've blow 'open' electrically, as well as the low voltage MOVs.

Do me a favor, please post the manufacturer's name and the filter' model designator. I'll track that sumbitch down.

Thats my story, and I'm sticking to it....
Now, I've gotta ask you - Have you been yanking my chain?
Is this some sort cruel supernerd prank? If so, it was actually quite a good one.

FWIW,
Paul

[kyrill]

I look forward to the results. I have used the Audience adept response 6-T (teflon) it actually made a difference that I could hear and was the first filter I had used to do so. this is why I am so interested in the Audience style power filters.  I will be running the 3 Felix I'm building on a dedicated 15A gfi breaker. too bad there is 100' of aluminum badly shielded garbage wire feeding my breaker box    Maybe not:  "http://6moons.com/audioreviews/acousticsystem5/liveline.html : First, recall the now accepted truism that it's not the miles of power distribution wiring that precede your wall plug which matter. It's those last few feet inside your upgraded power cords. That's what your gear "sees"; not the crap outside your house all the way back to the power utility plant.In Franck's view, the same applies to signal cable. It's the ends that matter."

  and that's exactly what every manufacture of power cables wants you to think   the electronic engineer's I have spoken to that aren't in this business put it quite simply.  100ft of 14gauge romex with a 3ft $1000 power cable at the end is now 103ft of 14 gauge romex. this is why power filtering and regeneration is so important. I completely agree, nice chords do not change the garbage but do not add to the garbage. Somehow the last feet that do not add lessen the subjective experience of the garbage.  with line conditioner followed by good sounding PWC is the way to go but I dont want to start this debate here 

[panomaniac]

No Joke at all!  I drew that schema from the actual part.  Pretty simple, so I think I got it right.  Will double check.

I will NOT post the name of the manufacturer, that would not be fair.  But if you PM me, I'll provide details and photos.  The strange thing is, I can't find it on their website, what they have there looks better suited.  But 'nuff said.  Best to take this private.

[Jason T]

I look forward to the results. I have used the Audience adept response 6-T (teflon) it actually made a difference that I could hear and was the first filter I had used to do so. this is why I am so interested in the Audience style power filters.  I will be running the 3 Felix I'm building on a dedicated 15A gfi breaker. too bad there is 100' of aluminum badly shielded garbage wire feeding my breaker box    Maybe not:  "http://6moons.com/audioreviews/acousticsystem5/liveline.html : First, recall the now accepted truism that it's not the miles of power distribution wiring that precede your wall plug which matter. It's those last few feet inside your upgraded power cords. That's what your gear "sees"; not the crap outside your house all the way back to the power utility plant.In Franck's view, the same applies to signal cable. It's the ends that matter."

  and that's exactly what every manufacture of power cables wants you to think   the electronic engineer's I have spoken to that aren't in this business put it quite simply.  100ft of 14gauge romex with a 3ft $1000 power cable at the end is now 103ft of 14 gauge romex. this is why power filtering and regeneration is so important. I completely agree, nice chords do not change the garbage but do not add to the garbage. Somehow the last feet that do not add lessen the subjective experience of the garbage.  with line conditioner followed by good sounding PWC is the way to go but I dont want to start this debate here 

LOL Well put sir 

and my Felix project will be done in about a week !

I'll post a few pics once I finish it

[rajacat]

Jason,

Have you finished your Felix project yet? Pics?

-Roy

[Jason T]

Roy

I have them put together.
they are "in-line" on some of my power cords right now.
I haven't found any cases that I felt compelled to put them in yet

the wire I'm using is a silver plater high strand count 12 gauge and is probably temporary and no it isnt rated for 110V but who cares 

any ideas on good looking cheap project boxes ?
I would like to do one box that will hold all 3 filters and 3 receptacles.

[rajacat]

Jason,

Those look nice and compact integrated into your power cords. Any comments on the how they affected the sound quality? I have one Felix installed in front of my Acopian power supply for a Bolder SB3. I did notice an improvement in the SQ but a hum emanates from the PS but not from the speakers. I presume a DC blocker on the neutral line would eliminate it so that's on my to do list. I also intend to install a Felix on the output side of the Acopian.

I also intend to build a Felix power strip. I'll use acrylic and some Bird-eye Maple to build the project box. I just need to gather all the electrical parts to complete the project.

-Roy

[dogorman]

I just bought all the parts to make a four-outlet felix with dc-blocker, in a double-insulated chassis, and I have some naive questions for the room -- some of which are probably *really* naive, so forgive me.

1) I can figure out how to connect everything except the bridge rectifier for the dc-blocker, and its associated caps. The diagram that gets reproduced in here from time to time (you know, the one with the four arrowheads) doesn't actually enlighten me as to where to solder the hookup wire, and where not to.

2) I'm going with a double-insulated chassis to reduce the risk of electrocuting myself: all-aluminum inside and plastic of some sort (buddy industries) on the outside. Which means at some point I'll need a nudge in the right direction as to how to machine the holes to exacting tolerances, and also how to connect the two chassis to each other. Glue?

3) Can mounting bosses be added after-the-fact to a project enclosure that doesn't already have them? If so, how are they sized by the hobbiest to make an ideal fit and how are they affixed to the inside of the enclosure?

4) Is there anything like heat shrink that can be used to cover a non-radial area of exposed wire? Say, for example, one ends up with a T-junction that has been soldered, and wants to insulate the whole junction -- is there something that can be "wrapped" around the t-junction and then sealed a la heat shrink?

5) Can I use glue to hold the capacitors and the cmc's to the perf boards? If so, what kind?

6) Are any of you free two weeks from this coming Saturday, to deliver the eulogy?

[Jason T]

A quieter background is all I have noticed so far.
the difference was minimal but probably well worth the money spent.
I'm going to get them in a box with a dedicated 8awg line run to the box then distributed with 12awg stranded cable to the 3 felix filters inside and then again with 12awg to the outlets.
I'm probably going WAY overboard here but what the heck you only live once right
hopefully I'll notice a bigger difference once I get my cheap APC filter/power bar out of the way

[Dougl]

1) I can figure out how to connect everything except the bridge rectifier for the dc-blocker, and its associated caps. The diagram that gets reproduced in here from time to time (you know, the one with the four arrowheads) doesn't actually enlighten me as to where to solder the hookup wire, and where not to.

The Standard way to understand a circuit is to redraw it differently.
The Circuit in 1363 B was drawn to emphasize that there were 2 redundant paths, not for wiring clarity.  This is a valid choice, but doesn't help you much.
Do not think of this as a bridge rectifier.  It can't be built from one., and the results are different.  The B "single diode drop" is 4 diodes in parallel, 2 facing each way, with 4 bypass caps.  its a 2 node circuit. 

HTH

Doug

[yan6]

Hi there, I just built my felix supply, it has four split outlets (8 felix circuits). The sound improvement was surprising to me, it sounds much nicer. However the circuit my amp is on is making a large hmmmm-ing sound, similar to a large power transformer. Has anyone else experienced this, is there anything that can be done to eliminate this. I have used the recommended parts: P3717A coils with the recommended Vishay caps.

cheers,

Ryan

[rajacat]

You need to insert a DC blocker into the neutral line. These diagrams are copied from an earlier post in this thread. I've built a Felix too and have experienced the hum. Others have said that you need the DC blocker to get rid of the hum and in order experience the full improvement in sound quality. I still haven't gotten around to building the blockers. I still not sure what would be the appropriate values for  the capacitors.

Perhaps someone would come forward to give the correct cap values.

-Roy

[yan6]

Thanks for the replies, I wondered if something like explanation #2 was occurring. My amp is a Marantz SR4600 specs say 314W on 120V, which puts it in at 2.62A; Still below the 3A rms, but close. I will be building a tube buffed gainclone this fall, which should draw less than the Marantz

When I'm done my vacation I will take it to work and put the scope on it to see if there is any DC. I would like to build the DC blocker anyways any cap values for the blocker?

[TomS]

You might try here for an example of dc blocker from Per Anders

http://sjostromaudio.com/joomla/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=62&Itemid=27&limit=1&limitstart=1

[yan6]

Ha! P-A, I'm dealing with him these days on a group buy that went bad on the other forum.

Cheers

[TomS]

Well my point was you were looking for example values and there they are...

[yan6]

Oh, I should have used more words. He is a great guy, he stepped up to rescue the group buy. He has saved many people a lot of money by taking it on.