[JohnR]

A good set of tower speakers are typically nice pieces of furniture & blend better with a room’s aesthetics.

Not to anyone except audio nutters

This is the Home Theater and Video circle so I would have thought it's not unreasonable to assume that people already have a 5.1 or more system (in terms of numbers of speakers, wires etc). Here's an Auro install, doesn't look so bad to me -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JSYcUH4oxIc

[youravhandyman]

John,
Agreed, that is a system well done.  Kind of makes my point from way earlier in the thread about WAF being a big deal.  Nice work there.

[witchdoctor]

C'mon. You can't say that with a straight face. Your thread title & original post mentioned 2 channel & the word "suck" 3 times.  Two posters responded by referring to your thread as clickbait & you graduating from troll college. You knew that you were going to get a rise out of folks by being over the top.

Congrats though, you took a 1-2 page thread at best & stretched it out to 6 pages & counting. Hell, I bit. Good job. 

Thank you. The cost of entry to immersive audio is low in the scope of budget for audio gear. The idea of mounting speakers high on the wall and running speaker wire is a bit of a hassle but no more so than traditional surround speakers. I was chatting with another forum member who has converted to immersive setup. He said when he upgraded from a receiver to a $20K Datasat processor his wife didn't even notice. The first time he fired up immersive audio after adding the height channels she was blown away, and she is not even into this hobby. 

[witchdoctor]

To give you an idea of how easy this is to set up get 5 pairs of these ($1145 all in):

http://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/cambaero2bla/cambridge-audio-aero-2-6.5-2-way-bookshelf-speakers-black-pair/1.html

one of these ($999):

http://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/denavrx4300h/denon-avr-x4300h-9.2-ch-x-125-watts-networking-a/v-receiver/1.html

add a nice sub and a source and you are done. The good news is most people in this circle already have 5.1 so all they would need is the receiver and another 4-5 speakers.

How could you go the next 5 years of home theater without at least trying immersive audio? Especially with the reasonable cost of entry.

For $2000 all in you can keep your 2 channel rig and install this system in another room. Can you spend more than $2K? Sure, I am just saying this is not insanely expensive to get into.

[stlrman]

I don't want  10 speakers in my living room!!
I am more than happy with my 2.1 hometheater  with projector and screen .

[witchdoctor]

I don't want  10 speakers in my living room!!
I am more than happy with my 2.1 hometheater  with projector and screen .

Fair enough, I could get bigger and better speakers for my current system too but am happy with what I have.

[AJinFLA]

I was chatting with another forum member who has converted to immersive setup. He said when he upgraded from a receiver to a $20K Datasat processor his wife didn't even notice. The first time he fired up immersive audio after adding the height channels she was blown away, and she is not even into this hobby. 

Here is someone willing to try just added L7 rears http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/two-channel-design-installation/161626-son-off-college-dad-2-channel-room-3.html#post1561474

Keep in mind preference here. Some folks think all music should sound like 40s frontal stereo and have no idea how immersive an orchestra in a concert hall experience is. YMMV.

[RandyH]

The truth is there is probably way more common ground in listening preferences between the original poster and "two channel crowd" who are pushing back than there are differences in opinion.  We all in this hobby have an interest in enhancing the listening experience so the topic of "immersive audio" should be one that is of interest to us all.  The issue some of us have with the initial post is the same issue that seems to exist in politics, religion, or any number of topics where there is the potential for differences of opinions or preferences.  The tone nowadays for so many discussions like this seems to be "your ideas suck and mine are good".  Further discourse, discussion and debate in any kind of a give and take civil manner is pretty much shut off.  Rather than begin what should have been a very interesting and informative discussion in an inviting tone like "hey let me share what I have discovered...I like it and you may too" approach it came across as what I like is great and what you like sucks.  Great way to start a discussion...

[AJinFLA]

As far as measurements go, I was referring to all SPL frequency response & waterfall, say "before" w/ 2 channel only & "after" with multiple speakers. Just curious if anything is given up to achieve an immersive experience.

FR and CSD are different views of the same thing. That wouldn't tell you anything about immersion. Multiple links have been posted for anyone interested in what this is actually about.

[AJinFLA]

Here's an Auro install, doesn't look so bad to me -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JSYcUH4oxIc

The front channels should be OB 

[Bendingwave]

Stick around audiocircle long enough and you'll realize that most of us are willing to allow complete strangers into our homes for demos.

I dont need to stick around to know that majority of people wont allow complete strangers to knock on there door at what ever hours of the day or night and let them come into there home to demo sound like a BUSINESS DEALER would. 

On a forum one would get to know that person first and talk to them both on the forum as well by phone and feel them out and then if one feels comfortable enough with that person one will decide if its ok to let that person into there private home.....If not you could just post your address and phone number on this site and let every tom dick or harry just drop by at all hours or even specified hours like any other audio store business. Where is the LMAO smiley????

[witchdoctor]

I dont need to stick around to know that majority of people wont allow complete strangers to knock on there door at what ever hours of the day or night and let them come into there home to demo sound like a BUSINESS DEALER would. 

On a forum one would get to know that person talk to them both on the forum as well by phone and feel them out and then if one feels comfortable enough with that person one will decide if its ok to let that person into there private home.....If not you could just post your address and phone number on this site and let every tom dick or harry just drop by at all hours or even specified hours like any other audio store business. Where is the LMAO smiley????

Over 10 years ago another member here named Satfrat did invite me over to checkout his setup as we were both using a Sunfire processor. It can happen but I don't know that I would go home and make a purchase based on what I listened to in another members home. It was more about socializing than an equipment audition. I also had a member who was a dealer once stop by and drop off some equipment for an audition which I purchased after I auditioned it in my own setup that I was familiar with. I think at the end of the day nothing compares to hearing whatever you might purchase in your own room.

[thunderbrick]

Correct about posting your address for anyone to come calling, but on AC we tend to build trust relationships over time and our shared interest in quality audio.  I've been lucky enough to visit 6 or 7 AC members, and have loaned/borrowed gear to/from near strangers without any problems at all.  It's great to learn from each other in person and get turned on to new music or other interests.   

[Bob in St. Louis]

To give you an idea of how easy this is to set up get 5 pairs of these ($1145 all in):

http://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/cambaero2bla/cambridge-audio-aero-2-6.5-2-way-bookshelf-speakers-black-pair/1.html

one of these ($999):

http://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/denavrx4300h/denon-avr-x4300h-9.2-ch-x-125-watts-networking-a/v-receiver/1.html

add a nice sub and a source and you are done. The good news is most people in this circle already have 5.1 so all they would need is the receiver and another 4-5 speakers.

How could you go the next 5 years of home theater without at least trying immersive audio? Especially with the reasonable cost of entry.

For $2000 all in you can keep your 2 channel rig and install this system in another room. Can you spend more than $2K? Sure, I am just saying this is not insanely expensive to get into.

As a home theater guy, I'd like to back up a bit and get clarification on exactly what's "immersive audio".
In the title of the thread, you even capitalized those two words like it's a proper noun. Meaning that there's a company called "Immersive Audio".
Granted, I've spent the past several pages skimming this thread looking for a reason to act on it from a moderators standpoint. But when you use the word "Immersive", are you just talking about a state of being wholly submerged in the audio experience you're bathing in? Or are you talking about being immersed in the new HT tech called "Atmos"? Or just because the AVR has an additional two outputs for a pair of "front high" speakers?
I built my HT/audio room and feel like I'm "immersed" when I watch a movie, but if there's another level of "immersion", then I'm all ears.
Do tell. 

[Bob2]

on AC we tend to build trust relationships over time and our shared interest in quality audio.  Have loaned/borrowed gear to/from near strangers without any problems at all.  It's great to learn from each other in person and get turned on to new music or other interests.   

+1

[srb]

Have I been under the misconception that loudspeaker quality was an important factor in sound reproduction, where the "rubber meets the road", if you will?

Do I need to forget about the incredible sounding speakers I've owned or heard with precision Revelators, Illuminators, Satoris, RAAL ribbons, beryllium domes and quality crossovers?  Can 10 entry-level speakers sound better for the same budget as a stereo pair of higher quality speakers if they are processed by Auro 3D?

Not sure I'm buying into that and no way can I afford 10 high-quality speakers.  We've all been pleased with some of our ~ $200/pr speaker purchases for the money, whether Cambridge Aero, Gallo Classico, Philharmonic/Dayton Affordable Accuracy, etc., but most of us have relegated them to more casual secondary systems and few have found their way into our main systems, except perhaps as rear surrounds for movie effect use.

Steve

[witchdoctor]

As a home theater guy, I'd like to back up a bit and get clarification on exactly what's "immersive audio".
In the title of the thread, you even capitalized those two words like it's a proper noun. Meaning that there's a company called "Immersive Audio".
Granted, I've spent the past several pages skimming this thread looking for a reason to act on it from a moderators standpoint. But when you use the word "Immersive", are you just talking about a state of being wholly submerged in the audio experience you're bathing in? Or are you talking about being immersed in the new HT tech called "Atmos"? Or just because the AVR has an additional two outputs for a pair of "front high" speakers?
I built my HT/audio room and feel like I'm "immersed" when I watch a movie, but if there's another level of "immersion", then I'm all ears.
Do tell. 

Surround sound is 2D, you have sound front and back, left and right. " Immersive" audio is the addition of a vertical sound stage from floor to ceiling make it "3D". This article goes into more details:

http://www.audioholics.com/audio-technologies/auro-3d-interview

As for Atmos it is GREAT for movies when you want sounds panned from above. It SUCKS for music upmixing with guitars or drums (even vocals) coming down from the ceiling. If you are watching a movie mixed in Atmos or sometimes upmixed with Atmos it is good. Music, not so much.
Auro3D has 3 layers compared to Atmos 2 layers. You have the typical 5.1 bed channels, then high on the walls above your bed channels you have height channels and then one speaker above you for a voice of god channel. Together it is 3 layers compared to Atmos 2. Now in my room you can not localize the speakers unless you put your ear next to them. It sounds extremely natural.

It is neither submerged or bathing in sound. On acoustic recordings you can localize things like fingers moving up and down the frets of a standup bass or the height of the piano as well as the placement on stage. In a concert video listening to Tina Turner on Qello today you feel a lot closer to the stage and it sounds more like a concert than a music video.
In movies some how the algorithm knows to place planes and such above you. In the beginning of The Jungle Book you could hear the bugs and the leaves rustling all around you. If you are more of a movie guy you may want to consider an Atmos setup as there is much more Atmos content on Blue Ray. Atmos sounds fine in my Auro setup to my ear. One of the best movies I have heard in Auro 3D upmix was Avengers Civil War. It felt like my condo was coming down on me. My favorite movie in Atmos was LOTR, the scene where the wizard on a sled is being chased by Orcs, just great. Some of the people with Atmos actually prefer Auro because you can adjust how much you want to enagage the height channels. With Atmos you get what you get, like it or lump it. If I spent $30 on an Atmos disc and the director didn't use the height channels much in the mix due to problems with conversion to blue ray you are screwed. With Auromatic you have a scale of 1-16 for height channel enagement and another for the size of your room. You can get any material dialed in for your preference. Again with Atmos or DTS-X you get what you get, like it or not. If you are going to stay in this hobby you need to compare for yourself and decide. You would hate to waste time consuming conten if you could have increased your enjoyment this easily. The next time you upgrade your receiver or processor just get one that offers Auro as Atmos and DTS-X aren't adjustable and don't do music very well in upmix mode IMO.

[AJinFLA]

Can 10 entry-level speakers sound better for the same budget as a stereo pair of higher quality speakers if they are processed by Auro 3D?

Possibly. When did you compare them for immersion and/or "sound better"?

[witchdoctor]

Have I been under the misconception that loudspeaker quality was an important factor in sound reproduction, where the "rubber meets the road", if you will?

Do I need to forget about the incredible sounding speakers I've owned or heard with precision Revelators, Illuminators, Satoris, RAAL ribbons, beryllium domes and quality crossovers?  Can 10 entry-level speakers sound better for the same budget as a stereo pair of higher quality speakers if they are processed by Auro 3D?



My system was built over time. I started with 5.1, then 7.1, then 9.1 (I used wide channels with my Sunfire gear). That took about a year adding little by little. Then when I got the Marantz with Auro I started with two front height channels then about six months later got the rear height channels. I enjoyed each iteration and never gave up anything. I can listed to any iteration (2,5,7,9 or 10 channel) by toggling my remote. You can tell from my thread title which I prefer but that is with my speakers and room. YMMV.

Not sure I'm buying into that and no way can I afford 10 high-quality speakers.  We've all been pleased with some of our ~ $200/pr speaker purchases for the money, whether Cambridge Aero, Gallo Classico, Philharmonic/Dayton Affordable Accuracy, etc., but most of us have relegated them to more casual secondary systems and few have found their way into our main systems, except perhaps as rear surrounds for movie effect use.

Steve

Hi Steve, You ask the million dollar question and I have a million dollar answer. The speakers need to be appropriate for your room, whether you have 2 or 10. My approach worked for my condo, I don't know if it would work for a dedicated home theater like I see in a magazine. (Actually it wouldn't work because no one would tolerate the exposed speakers I have in a dedicated theater).
I think in a small room I would do Gallo Orbs, Kef Eggs or the like all around. Would 10 Kef Eggs blow away 2 Kef LS 50? No way. I think that is silly. BUT, can I create a kick ass system with 3 Kef LS 50's in front and 7 Kef Eggs in an immersive home theater? Yes, and I could listen how I want, when I want, to what I want. You can't do that with a 2 channel rig. I can do both with a 10 channel rig, so why not?

[witchdoctor]

My system was built over time. I started with 5.1, then 7.1, then 9.1 (I used wide channels with my Sunfire gear). That took about a year adding little by little. Then when I got the Marantz with Auro I started with two front height channels then about six months later got the rear height channels. I enjoyed each iteration and never gave up anything. I can listed to any iteration (2,5,7,9 or 10 channel) by toggling my remote. You can tell from my thread title which I prefer but that is with my speakers and room. If you want a LOT of bigger budget speakers spacing your purchases lets you enjoy what you own now and add channels as funds allow without feeling you are sacrificing on speaker quality. YMMV.