[-Richard-]

Hi Dennis,

'...If you plug your cd player into the dvd input, you can
listen to it by toggling your input selector between DVD
and DVD multi...'

Ok...that is what I thought you meant...but I was not
certain...

I hear no appreciable difference between DVD and
DVD/Multi...perhaps it is my setup: my Pioneer 563A
CD player, my Nixontubedacplus, my Signal Cables
or Maggie 1.6's...or the way they combine...but I hear
no difference at this time...

They both sound utterly fabulous but very similar.

I'll continue to experiment however...especially given
the extravagant feedback describing the benefits
in superior sound...

Thanks for your help.

I find all experiments to try and extract even more
aural pleasure from the JVC fascinating...

 -Richard-

[Dmason]

WOW  for whatever reason, DVD Multi is the way to go. A sudden upgrade to my stereo's sound, and in no small way. Turn a knob and have a new stereo. Sounds like it won't necessarily work everywhere though. Thanks for that. This thread has turned into an RX users' group: Rx for the RX

Ass-Tray Auteur:   I just ordered some Sil grease from Mapleshade. Looking forward to that one. I also noticed they have some very eccentric looking stuff. One thing I saw were some nice thin gauge-twist, pure OFC copper speaker cables with no fittings, which would work well with the "terminally handicapped" RX user. They were quite reasonably priced as well. Someone should check those out who is looking to fix the speaker cable issue.

Slowly we are together learning how to wring the most magic out of our little magic boxes, without need of alot of effort. The little X1 is beginning to sound very, very nice with the Fostex speakers. Last night it was eeeerily like someone actually playing a nylon string guitar in the back room.

[TheChairGuy]

WOW  for whatever reason, DVD Multi is the way to go. A sudden upgrade to my stereo's sound, and in no small way. Turn a knob and have a new stereo. Sounds like it won't necessarily work everywhere though. Thanks for that. This thread has turned into an RX users' group: Rx for the RX

Ass-Tray Auteur:   I just ordered some Sil grease from Mapleshade. Looking forward to that one. I also noticed they have some very eccentric looking stuff. One thing I saw were some nice thin gauge-twist, pure OFC cop ...

D,

Shocked, totally, will be your experience once you grease them ends.  Don't forget the internal fuses, too...BIG benefits.  

Yeah, I'll look a bit more at MapleShade's offerings...I'm pretty happy with my near-free' 14ga (aggregate) CAT6 tho.

[RoadTripper]

DVD -good

DVD/Multi - Wetter, fuller, wider, far more palable, much better bass, far more emotion.  Not subtle at all.  Especially on classical where congestion goes and space comes. Individual lines are not so hidden, buried.

I will get out my meter and read the dB increase that also comes with DVD/Multi.

[-Richard-]

Seminarian wrote:

'...DVD/Multi - Wetter, fuller, wider, far more palpable,
much better bass, far more emotion...'

OK I hear that...I also hear a less flat presentation...
better separation of instruments for example...
I went back and forth...with Deb listening
as well...she agreed...however on my Maggies it is
rather subtle...there to be sure...but subtle...

I can easily imagine a sound shaping option a little
later in the development of this new technology that
will allow us to "fine tune" the sound to fit whatever
musical genre, or scale, or other considerations
that we may want to bring to bear on the particular
music, or our temperament for that day of listening.

I would willingly embrace that kind of option...especially
if it was not complicated to implement, and not a gross kind
of shifting around but a highly refined "sound shaping" function.

I'll try it later on the Ruark's...I think I might hear more of a
difference there.

Thanks again everyone for your help and feedback.

Warm regards -Richard-

[jswallac]

Ready to take the "plunge."  After reading all these glowing reviews I can't wait much longer.  My Jolida tube integrated wnt on Agon yesterday and sold today.  Guess I did not ask enough.   Hopefully this will be a step up in performance, together with a step down in price.    And the economists say there is no free lunch.  This one even comes with a remote!  So my remaining question is which one?  J and R has the newer F10 for $269.88 with free shipping.  I can get the older ES1sl on eBay for $179 plus $18 shipping.  So the newer model is only $73 more.  Is it worth it?  I already have a separate HT setup, so this will be my 2-channel amp.  It will only be pressed into HT as a backup.  Still, $73 is so little if the F10 has any advantages.  Compared to the money we spend on this hobby, the $73 difference is not terribly significant.  My concerns are things like fan noise and heat.  I seem to recall more concerns about this from owners of the F10 or ES1sl models purchased from costco.  Any comments on whether the F10 has a louder fan and/or runs hotter?  Actually, has anybody done an A/B test of this two?  Finally, what are the advantages of the newer model.  I read something about digital tone controls, but have no idea what that does for you.  As always, I appreciate your comments.

Thanks

[beepx3]

I wonder if the fan noise is due to resonance with the equipment rack. I noticed a little vibration induced noised as well, but this disapeared when I put some sorbothane dampeners under the JVC unit.

I just ordered one of these:

http://www.creative.com/products/product.asp?prodid=9468

to use as a surround sound processor for movies and TV. I'm thinking of using this in conjunction with the DVD-multi inputs to bypass the processing in the JVC:

Source -> external processor/DAC/Analog -> Tube Preamp -> DVD Multi-In for Bass and Surounds/300B Set for Front Mid Highs.

While I think the JVC has a great organic sound and excellent bass punch for the low end, it is still not quite as direct as using a SET amp for the upper frequencies. This way I can get the best of both worlds.

[TheChairGuy]

   
 
Ready to take the "plunge." After reading all these glowing reviews I can't wait much longer. My Jolida tube integrated wnt on Agon yesterday and sold today. Guess I did not ask enough.  Hopefully this will be a step up in performance, together with a step down in price.  And the economists say there is no free lunch. This one even comes with a remote! So my remaining question is which one? J and R has the newer F10 for $269.88 with free shipping. I can get the older ES1sl on eBay for $179 plus $18 shipping. So the newer model is only $73 more. Is it worth it? I already have a separate HT setup, so this will be my 2-channel amp. It will only be pressed into HT as a backup. Still, $73 is so little if the F10 has any advantages. Compared to the money we spend on this hobby, the $73 difference is not terribly significant. My concerns are things like fan noise and heat. I seem to recall more concerns about this from owners of the F10 or ES1sl models purchased from costco. Any comments on whether the F10 has a louder fan and/or runs hotter? Actually, has anybody done an A/B test of this two? Finally, what are the advantages of the newer model. I read something about digital tone controls, but have no idea what that does for you. As always, I appreciate your comments.

js,

I don't think anybody has done A vs. B comparo of the ES1 and F10 yet...someone will, no doubt.  The primary difference is 5.1 vs. 6.1...so if you are strictly going to use the JVC for 2 channel, save the $73.00 (JVC is so mum on the technological details and specs of this thing, it makes a mime look chatty   ).

However, you may be soooooo impressed with it that you may press it into HT duty and, if you have 6.1 set-up, will need the F10.

$179 is what I paid from Samman's Electroncis in NJ...I have see for $169 on ebay, but don't know the vendor.  Samman's did everything a-okay.

I have no fan issues...don't know why others do...but they seem to.  Lonewolf and I got ours at Samman's (and others, but I can't recall) and both our units get hot, but the fan is quiet and it's not boilerplate hot.  Our serial numbers are within 16 of one another, so it would be my guess that Samman's other units in stock (I think they only have 8 left of the ES1) would be of this (good) production vintage.

Yes, some economists will give you their zero-sum theory of things...it just doesn't hold relevance as to the JVC, however.  

[lonewolfny42]

$179 is what I paid from Samman's Electroncis in NJ. ...

I agree with CG's comments....Samman's has a good deal, quick delivery,and  well packed. Head over to Ebay, best deal for brand new JVC.

[lonewolfny42]

Our serial numbers are within 16 of one another  

Does this mean we're related now....???

(if so, send me a few gyro's and stuffed grape leaves, thanks !!)[/list:u]

[tvyankee]

does anyone know if their are binding posts on the f-10?

thanks.

[Dmason]

Beautiful spring clips only on the F10.

You can find gold plated pins for speaker cables at Parts Express.

[jswallac]

Well I did it.  I have joined the growing hordes of cheap bas*ards who have spared no expense to get the best.  In my case it was a whopping $149.99 plus tax.  No shipping since the seller happened to be local.  Not bad for an open box that sure looks to be new.  Now starts the infamous journey to nirvana over the next 300 hours or so

[jswallac]

Well I did it.  I have joined the growing hordes of cheap bas*ards who have spared no expense to get the best.  In my case it was a whopping $149.99 plus tax.  No shipping since the seller happened to be local.  Not bad for an open box that sure looks to be new.  Now starts the infamous journey to nirvana over the next 300 hours or so

[TheChairGuy]

My, I thought the original JVC F10 Topic was long...this is getting to be a habit.  I suppose if the JVC wasn't as good as it is for the money, it wouldn't now be running 20 pages long.

Anyhow.....

I have a really nice front end...and paid alot more for it then I thought I'd delve into this hobby.  So, for me, I am really glad I picked the digital receiver that performed best with the analog ins. I'd sure be bummed to find out my $4500 front end (with mods and cabling) was bested only by my $1500 transport (with cable) run straight into the receiver.

The first try at straight digital in, using my Sony transport and coax digital, was conclusive; it was inferieor to analog in.  Tho, there was  simplicity that was attractive, and could not be denied, in digital coax direct.

I've been hearing that some transports, and receivers, have a better optimized optical toslink interface.  So, I bought a $29 glass toslink on Audiogon last week.

I just tried it out for an hour....and it was still inferior to the analog in for me.  But, and I mean BIG but, it ws a lot better than digital coax.  It still lacked the right pitch and weight of the analog in connection, but it was better than the digital coax (a repectable LAT International DI-20 coax that bested Kimber D-60, to my ears long ago) in - of this, I am sure.

I wonder how many of the Panny digital crew have tried a glass optical toslink on their little wonders?  I know the preferred method with the Panny seems to be digital in, but I am very intrigued by the performance of glass toslink, just now.  

Simplifying further, I bought a little device from Turtle Beach that connects to my USB on the PC or laptop and terminates in an, you got it, optical toslink connection    I'll be running my laptop, with the Turtle Creek Audio Advantage Micro, via toslink, into the JVC...and report back soon.

You get a lot of good music for increasingly less money these days, it seems.

[Wayne1]

FWIW I have a glass toslink. I have tried it on the Panasonic receivers both stock and modded. To me, and on my system, the coax cables I make sound a LOT better than glass toslink.

Also on MY system I find that a Bybee quantum purifier sounds very good in the digital cable. Not all folks feel this way.

[gary]

For my 5-year anniversary at work I got to pick a consolation prize, mine was a $70 "Lasonic" dvd player. For S&G I listened to music with it over a toslink cable (just a cheap monster one I got a while back, not a fancy glass one) and it sounded really, really good. Not quite like my regular digital front end (Philips 963sa transport -> PT P1-A w/ SOCS for my Ref 1's -> Rev. Audio I2S Cable -> Modwright II PT P3-A), but pretty amazing considering the fact that it cost just a small fraction of the price.

Maybe this weekend if I get bored I'll do analog/digi coax/toslink comparisons with both players, leaving the PT gear out of the loop. That should be pretty interesting.

Gary

[TheChairGuy]

Wayne,

Outside of some faceless/nameless engineer in Japan/Matsushita, you probably have heard more Panny digitals than anyone.  Thanks for the input, of course, your digital may be better than my $99 LAT International (as you know, a brand fave of mine for a while)

============
Gary,

Yeah, go to it.  I think you'll find it's inferior too, but there is something likeable about a simpler digital pathway - coax or toslink.

[AphileEarlyAdopter]

That Glass Toslink from Audiogon is great. I also have a Acoustiz Zen Silver Photon (bought in 2002) coax. Between the two, the coax seems more 'livelier' or has more 'sparkle'. But you can also characterise this as having an 'edgy' sound. To a little extent, the sound is more upfront and has less soundstage. With the glass toslink, the soundstage is more apparent and easier to listen to for long periods of time.  Male singer voices are more separated from the bass, drums etc. To me, soundstage is a better indicator of fidelity than bass/treble chacteristics, which are affected by powersupply/quality of components respectively.

Right now, I have both the coax and glass toslink connected between Philips 963SA and my Panny XR50. I keep switching back and forth. But I think, I prefer the glass toslink.

[Mudjock]

Yeah, $179 plus shipping was too rich for my blood - but I finally broke down and ordered at $149.  The Nixon DACkit in some state of completion could also be on the radar screen, but I will wait until I have tried the receiver with my Tosh 3950 (still mostly stock - ceramic fuse).

In the meantime, I am somewhere between intrigued and disturbed by my other cheap b**tard audio adventure...     I acquired a somewhat beat up SA-XR25 for $66 on ebay to pair with the $50 3950 (connected by a Heartland cables digital coax cable that couldn't have cost more than $20).  For power conditioning I am using a VansEvers Super Companion with a OneAC isolation transformer plugged into it for the DVD player.  Anyway, this combo was not embarrased in A-B comparisons with my standard setup (Continuum Audio Stage Power Amp and Sim Audio Celeste 4001SE Pre).  I was comparing the setups using Ellis 1801 speakers, which should be pretty revealing of any differences.  For a lot of music, I preferred the Panny - which is transparent to a fault, but maybe a little thin sounding.  The dead silent background gives instruments a very natural sounding  attack and decay - which I am finding quite addictive... and I haven't even started modding the Panny yet.  It will be hard to justify keeping the heavy and power hungry he-man solid state stuff around for long...  Maybe there is some uber-transparency synergy going on between the Panny and the 1801's - similar to the synergy some of you are reporting between the JVC and Vandersteen/Fostex speakers.

With great anticipation, I am looking forward to auditioning the JVC, although with the Nixon DACkit, it is looking a little pricey