Rock and roll speakers

Brad · « **on:** 15 Jul 2004, 06:27 pm »

My current speakers (Omega Super 3's) are excellent for a lot of the music I listen too, used in conjunction with a VMPS smaller sub.

However, some of the music I like best - 70's/80's rock and metal

, is missing some midbass punch with the Omegas.
I end up listening to things that sound better - not because that's what I wanted to hear.

I'm considering moving the Omegas to a tube-based bedroom system and getting some more 'raucous' speakers to go with the Sony for Home Theater and Metal. I'd like them to be fairly efficient.

Any suggestions under $2k?
I'm willing to look on the used market, too.
Tower or bookshelf either one is fine - I have good stands.

Speakers I have on the list now are:

Zu Druid Dark - $2k list
Klipsch RF7 or RB75 speakers - supposed to have a much improved high end over the more traditional Klipsch
PSB Image 7PT
Decware HDT
Meadowlark Kestrel or Shearwater
Reference 3A MM Decapo

EDS_ · « **Reply #1 on:** 15 Jul 2004, 06:41 pm »

Quote from: Brad

My current speakers (Omega Super 3's) are excellent for a lot of the music I listen too, used in conjunction with a VMPS smaller sub.

However, some of the music I like best - 70's/80's rock and metal , is missing some midbass punch with the Omegas.
I end up listening to things that sound better - not because that's what I wanted to hear.

I'm considering moving the Omegas to a tube-based bedroom system and getting some more 'raucous' speakers to go with the Sony for Home Theater and Metal. I' ...

Used Hales Revelation IIIs. maybe?
The box is sealed so you'd need some watts plus the ability to deliver current. So maybe the Sony won't/will?-work. Rev. IIIs are pretty big and weigh about 100lbs. each.
I listen to lots of ACDC, The Who, Gov't. Mule, Hendrix, Tool, etc.
These things were built for rock and roll-period.

BTW-they are single wire only.

EDS_ · « **Reply #2 on:** 15 Jul 2004, 06:41 pm »

sorry-dp

ABEX · « **Reply #3 on:** 15 Jul 2004, 06:42 pm »

I do not know what you are going for as far as a presentation,mid-hall or up front as some of those speakers vary widely in theor presentation. I prefer speakers that are not in your face,but are more mid-hall and disappear in the soundstage.

I always considered JBL's as Rock Speakers and from your list Klipsch are good for Rock speakers IMO.

PSB and DeCapo's are more of the sound I prefer and I listen to a lot of Rock music. I grew up in that era also.

The thing I do not like a bout Front row presentation type of speakers is that they are fatigueing to me. My preference would be the DeCapo's ,but I do not think they would be a great Rock speaker if you are looking for a front row presentation and PSB's are similar mid-hall presentations.

Anyway ,good luck!

Rob Babcock · « **Reply #4 on:** 15 Jul 2004, 06:42 pm »

The PSBs would save you some money. Money you could spend on...MORE METAL!!!

Brad · « **Reply #5 on:** 15 Jul 2004, 07:15 pm »

Thanks for the suggestions.

A quick look at the PSB website shows the new image line is out. The T65 looks like the way to go there.
Upscale Audio has the Image 7PT for $849 A stock.

Groups I want to sound good: Metallica, Iron Maiden, Judas Priest, Megadeth, Slayer, Anthrax in the metal category. Triumph, Rush, AC/DC, Styx, Cheap Trick, etc, from the old fart's rock era.

I think this is one of those "no substitute for cubic inches" things.

I may just try the Klipsch on a 30 day trial from Tweeter.

I'm doing pretty good on finding metal. I got about 20 LPs from a record shop in Dallas a few months ago when I was up there for work.
Vinnie Vincent, Killer Dwarfs, David Chastain, Magnum, Anthrax, TNT, Virgin Steele among others. I plan on spending a few hours there next trip. Also picked up an LP from the F*cking Champs in Austin.

Rob Babcock · « **Reply #6 on:** 15 Jul 2004, 07:24 pm »

I'm almost embarrassed to admit the what I've paid for some rare-ish metal CDs over the last couple months: Chastain- Ruler of the Wasteland $42, Warrior- Fighting For The Earth, Van Zant-S/T (more hard AOR, really) $50, Platinum Blonde- Alien Shores $35 (and considered m'self damn lucky at that), Raven- Stay Hard $17.

Brad · « **Reply #7 on:** 15 Jul 2004, 07:42 pm »

I saw Raven on the Stay Hard tour at the Austin Opera house in '85.
Great, energetic show. Saw it from the pit - may still have some of those bruises.

I paid about $10 apiece for the vinyl - some of it sealed, all in great condition. Can't wait to go back to that shop with more time and $$.

TheeeChosenOne · « **Reply #8 on:** 15 Jul 2004, 08:30 pm »

Green Mountain Europas.

VERY good with rock.

If you don't know about their giant killing reputation, go to AA or the 'gon forums. There's actually a rather new thread on the 'gon where they discuss their rock abilities. Users like them for rock due to their forgiving nature (necessary for the multitude of poorly recorded rock albums).

JLM · « **Reply #9 on:** 15 Jul 2004, 11:37 pm »

Brad,

Most of the speakers on your list look like better matches for a SET than a Sony and for jazz than rock. IMO dedicated rock monitors need to have an improved sound over concert monitors. Others feel that the rough edges of rock need smoothing over, but with your Omega based system you have that end covered.

Klipsch are forward and efficient, best with warm/small tube amps (a real sleeper because they're never displayed with tubes).

Decware HDT and Reference 3A Decapo do not have excessive bass and are also highly efficient.

Meadowlark Kestrels or Shearwaters are again not headbanging speakers.

Typical "hi-fi" speakers sound more like concert monitors than the above speakers. Good mass market speakers, like Paradigm, should work nicely and they have a wide variety of models and line ups. Stores along the Canadian/U.S. border cater to Yanks to sell at good discounts and help with the paperwork at customs.

Brad · « **Reply #10 on:** 15 Jul 2004, 11:57 pm »

"Poorly recorded rock albums" ???
Isn't that redundant?

JLM - thanks for your well-thought-out reply. You have experience with a lot of the speakers I have on the list. The PSB's are probably the closest to the Paradigms you mention.

I think the Zu or the Decware will have a fuller sound than the Omegas, while retaining a lot of the things I like about the Omegas. And still no crossovers to mess up the sound.

I talked to a friend of mine today who is a manager at a local Tweeter store. I think he'll let me borrow a demo pair of Klipsch's for a week or so to see how they do. Best way to find out what works is to listen in my system, in my room right?

mab · « **Reply #11 on:** 16 Jul 2004, 01:11 am »

Brad - I miss the Austin Opera House. I used to live right across the street and stumbled home from many a show in college. Wish they still did shows there

.

Matt

Bingenito · « **Reply #12 on:** 16 Jul 2004, 01:20 am »

Brad,

If you want a great speaker for rock that is efficient and will work well powered by a receiver

Then get some PHL mid-bass drivers and a good ribbon and have Selah Audio design you a killer speaker.

I built a PHL ribbon system for my friends 60Lx24Wx10H' room and he powers them with a pioneer elite receiver- some of the best HT and Rock I have heard yet.

Most of the PHLs are around 97-102 DB sensitivity.

Can't go wrong with this and the cost could be below $2k

JoshK · « **Reply #13 on:** 16 Jul 2004, 03:55 pm »

Might also take a good look at Hammer Dynamics speakers. I was thinking of building a pair at some point.

sharper · « **Reply #14 on:** 19 Jul 2004, 07:27 pm »

I would go with VMPS. I think their "2" series speakers sound great with rock yet offer many of the virtues of other audiophile speakers. I've owned the Tower II/R, Tower II SE/R, and the RM2 Neo. These speakers deliver phenomenal bass power and at the same time (especially the RM2 Neo) quite resolving without being harsh in the highs. I believe Brian is offering a Tower II 20th Anniversary Edition that's under $2K.

IMHO, there's nothing better for classic rock. Their ability with rock is so beyond other speakers, it's comparable to the unique strengths of the Quad ESL-63, Sonus Faber Extrema, and Rogers LS3/5 vs. others.

No more Ana Caram and way more of Boston's first album and Van Halen's debut, etc.

DVV · « **Reply #15 on:** 19 Jul 2004, 10:51 pm »

In the wild and reckless days of my youth, AR's sales literature pointed out that there's no such thing as a speaker good for this but bad for that, or vice versa. A good speaker was good with anything, period. The rest were bad speakers.

In my infinite foolishness, I still believe in this. Which is why I spent so much time helping design the speakers I have now, which are unfortunately no longer commercially available because the company which made them went out of business (the two partners quarrelled).

But I point out my auncient AR94, which I did work over very thoroughly (new suspension, rubber this time thank you, new multitech capacitors, silver wiring, etc). It can play anything you throw at it with more or less the same faults and same strengths - it does NOT change the character of any music. They still need real muscle to move them, but Harman/Kardon have no problem with that.

Reading what you guys say about speakers, I see I am ready for extinction, I am a throwback to the dark ages of audio.

Cheers,
DVV

_scotty_ · « **Reply #16 on:** 20 Jul 2004, 01:25 am »

DVV, I Thought I was the only one who remembered the days when
Dinosaurs roamed the earth. It's nice to know I am not alone,welcome to the club. Scotty

Tbadder1 · « **Reply #17 on:** 20 Jul 2004, 02:30 am »

How long can you wait Brad? I just purchased a new pair of Zu Druid Darks. They'll be coming early August. I'll send you a review out of the box. If I remember. PM if you care to after the 1st. Most of my stuff is rock, though I'm more a punk guy than a metal guy.

DVV · « **Reply #18 on:** 20 Jul 2004, 05:50 am »

Quote from: _scotty_

DVV, I Thought I was the only one who remembered the days when
Dinosaurs roamed the earth. It's nice to know I am not alone,welcome to the club. Scotty

Not surprised to see you there, Scotty. Yessir, in my day .... that's how we should start our messages, we two dinosaurs.

Hey Scotty, remember the Big Bang? Man, that was fun!

Ciao,
DVV

mcrespo71 · « **Reply #19 on:** 20 Jul 2004, 12:33 pm »

If you look at what flat earthers (Naim, Rega, Linn) use for speakers (and flat earthers listen to the most rock of any hifi users I know of), the de facto standard is Neat acoustics. I would look into Neat Mystiques- I'm going to hear a pair this week with an all Naim system and will report back, but from what I've heard from some very educated users, nothing can touch Neat acoustics when it comes to PRAT and IMHO, PRAT is extremely important for rock music.

Michael