20.7s

SteveFord · « **on:** 9 Dec 2012, 06:05 pm »

Life is full of surprises, you can just never tell what's going to happen.
A while back there was a message on my phone from Don at The Listening Room in Towsend, MD asking me to please give him a call as he got some Magnepans in that I might be interested in.
I really want to hear the new MMGs so I call him right back, thinking that he managed to get ahold of a set of the new ones. I'm making plans in my head to drive down to his store on Saturday and am wondering if I need to bring my 20 year old MMGs with me for a comparison when Don answers the phone and says, "How would you like to trade your 3.7s in on a pair of 20.7s?".
Eh?

This was certainly an unexpected development!
Here were my plans for the Winter of 2013:
purchase a Dynaco tube amp and a tube preamp to use with the Mini Maggie System
Upgrade to the new MMGs
Purchase some Sound Anchor stands and upgrade to Kimber 12TCs for the 3.7s
and send some tubes out to Cryoset for their cryogenic treatment.

As you can see, those miniscule brainstorms went out the window and the 20.7s came in the door.
It is not easy to astonish the Mrs. but these actually made her mouth drop open and then she mouthed, "Oh my God!" when she came out to see what we were doing.

roscoeiii · « **Reply #1 on:** 9 Dec 2012, 06:13 pm »

Wow. Beauties.

launche · « **Reply #2 on:** 9 Dec 2012, 06:24 pm »

Congrats Steve, speakers to explore and enjoy for a long, long time. 20's are one of my favs, looks like your Christmas will be a merry one.

medium jim · « **Reply #3 on:** 9 Dec 2012, 06:30 pm »

What a nice Christmas present to yourself. I recently heard a pair of 20.7's and was impressed at the low bass they produce...ditch the subs!

Jim

Rocket_Ronny · « **Reply #4 on:** 9 Dec 2012, 06:45 pm »

It's not very often I get jealous Steve, but high powered tube amps on dipole ribbon 20.7s are pulling hard on me. You have a magic combo there in my books. What gains do you hear going for the 20.7s over the 3.7s?

Rocket_tube amps with ribbons is my very favorite_Ronny

cab · « **Reply #5 on:** 9 Dec 2012, 07:02 pm »

Are they going to perform optimally in such a cramped space?

lonewolfny42 · « **Reply #6 on:** 9 Dec 2012, 07:47 pm »

Quote

It is not easy to astonish the Mrs. but these actually made her mouth drop open and then she mouthed, "Oh my God!" when she came out to see what we were doing.

Actual words spoken....."Oh my God!.....those speakers are....Soooo BIGGGGGG...."

Rocket_Ronny · « **Reply #7 on:** 9 Dec 2012, 07:54 pm »

Quote

Are they going to perform optimally in such a cramped space?

AH Space - The final frontier.

Rocket_18'x26'x10'=Yum_Ronny

SteveFord · « **Reply #8 on:** 9 Dec 2012, 08:14 pm »

Thank you, gentlemen. I'm just floored by the whole thing.

Lynda's taken a shine to them now that the original horror has passed...
The dog is still rather intimidated which is a good thing.
My camera seems to have difficulty in capturing distances properly - if you look at photos of the 1.7s upstairs it looks like the listening position is 50 yards away when it's only like 15 feet and this photo makes the room look like a shoebox. Who knows.
Room size was the big concern but everything I read said that where a 3.7 would work the 20.7 would as well. They were right.

Initial listening impressions:
They're still tight so need a few good workouts to loosen things up, they have that new speaker weirdness going on but you can hear the resolution in them.
The women are home so I'll be considerate and not blast them out of their undies. You can tell that they'll play a lot louder, too - right now they're just loafing.
MediumJim is right in no sub required - I doubt if I could mate any up and not have it screw up the sound.

Probably the best way to sum them up would be 3.7s on steroids: you've got the same basic sound quality but it goes deeper in the bass, dynamics are increased by an order of magnitude, you can hear more detail and the soundstage is larger in every direction which is a good thing.
They also perk up at a lower listening volume which is a blessing.

medium jim · « **Reply #9 on:** 9 Dec 2012, 08:29 pm »

Steve:

It is really nice when one of the good people in this world get rewarded, congratulations. BTW, I also noted that they didn't need a lot of volume to make them shine. My 2.5's also don't need much in the way of volume, but they need sub augmentation to represent the bottom 2 octaves properly.

Some day when I get a bigger listening room, I know what speaker I will be looking for. Oh yeah, from what I hear about them, they are actually as easy to drive as the 3.7's!

Jim

dB Cooper · « **Reply #10 on:** 9 Dec 2012, 08:41 pm »

I've never owned planars, but Magnepan on their website specifically cautions against placing parallel with the rear wall. I would expect that would be even more important in front of all that glass. Have you experimented with toe-in?

SteveFord · « **Reply #11 on:** 9 Dec 2012, 09:17 pm »

I only like an inch or two of toe-in for this room, that seems to work best to my ears.
One thing that they don't mention is that a lot of toe-in will accentuate the bass and that's a real concern with the rooms that I have to work with. I don't want to be overpowered. It took Kara Chafee's help to dial back the bass in the preamp and these have a bit more bass output than the 3.7s do.
The photo doesn't show it but there is all sorts of crap in the corners to break up the sound: plants and CD carousels and amps and drapes and maybe some dust bunnies.
Here's a really cool thing for adjusting toe-in, these little handles for my bulter, Tatoo, to grab ahold of. Luckily, they're placed pretty far down so the little shrimp doesn't have to use a ladder:

One thing that I need to do is come up with some threaded feet for the stands so I can get the speakers tilted down towards the couch as my house is anything but level. I'll use that trick from that Jim Smith book and get the light from the mirror to reflect right back at me.

medium jim · « **Reply #12 on:** 9 Dec 2012, 09:24 pm »

Steve:

Just a thought, you can use the ceiling fan to create a Leslie organ effect!

Jim

jimdgoulding · « **Reply #13 on:** 9 Dec 2012, 09:40 pm »

Steve, Hi. Do you listen to much classical music? If so, do you get a large stage and hall? Seems kinda narrow in there, jes sayin. How wide is your room? Thanks. Jim

cab · « **Reply #14 on:** 9 Dec 2012, 09:52 pm »

Quote from: jimdgoulding on 9 Dec 2012, 09:40 pm

Steve, Hi. Do you listen to much classical music? If so, do you get a large stage and hall? Seems kinda narrow in there, jes sayin. How wide is your room? Thanks. Jim

The narrow room, hard surfaces on the floor and walls, the coffee table, etc., it would seem these speakers are a very poor fit to the room. With the room being a large part of the system, wouldn't it be a much better solution to use speakers more appropriate for the room? I am sure these are fine speakers, but I would no sooner put bookshelf speakers in a gymnasium, nor 20.7's in this location. Can't imagine these can reach their potential in such cramped (for them) quarters.

kevin360 · « **Reply #15 on:** 9 Dec 2012, 10:44 pm »

Awesome Steve!

I have to disagree with the statement that the 20.7s will work anywhere the 3.7s will. Due to the shape of my ceiling, the 15'1” room width* and a 92” drop screen for the projector, 20.7s simply will not fit in my room. The room was designed with the 3 series in mind. You're instilling a trace of regret in my mind. I wish my room were wider so that I could torment myself with desire for the 20.7s.

If you do tilt them forward by some means, be sure to provide sufficient counterweight.

Enjoy them...you lucky devil.

* If my ceiling were 15'1" wide at an 8' height, there would be no problem - except for spending more and more of my retirement money.

SteveFord · « **Reply #16 on:** 9 Dec 2012, 11:27 pm »

Cab, they work just fine as did my 3.7s.
Jonathan Valin was correct in them working where 3.7s will although a larger room would be even better.
I don't think I'll be expanding the house any time soon, though, as I am under orders to remodel the kitchen.

I've got a 16' width to play with and have them out about 5' into the room right now; I'll wait until they break in before I worry about placement too much.
I tiled them a little bit and the stand for them offers pretty good stability. At first I thought it was a DMW pedestal that was packed up by mistake.
I'm not too much on classical but I did listen to a fair amount of Zappa today. There was a lot more detail locked up in the Weasels Ripped My Flesh album than I'd previously suspected. All that weird backwards tape stuff flying out from all over creation...

TONEPUB · « **Reply #17 on:** 9 Dec 2012, 11:56 pm »

Congrats Steve...

The 20.7s are fantastic speakers. Enjoy!

SteveFord · « **Reply #18 on:** 10 Dec 2012, 12:13 am »

Thank you.
I just took a look downstairs and without too much trouble I can gain another 6' in width and retain the dining room area which will be good all around. I wanted to open up the kitchen, anyway.
Not this year but next year's tax refund will go towards the home remodeling.
It's a crazy hobby, knocking out walls to fit your speakers. Keeps me off the streets which is a good thing, I suppose.

kevin360 · « **Reply #19 on:** 10 Dec 2012, 12:57 am »

Steve, would you mind providing height and width (of the top) measurements of your 20.7s? I ask just in case the actual size differs slightly from the spec sheet (and I think I used 20.1 dimensions when I ruled them too large - by about an inch). I'll place the inside edges of my 3.7s where those of the 20.7s would have to be - to be absolutely certain of the feasibility (although, I'm not altogether certain that I want to discover that it's possible after all).

It would change my amplifier requirements - I wouldn't want to redirect any of the low end to subs. Man, they'd really upset the apple cart, but we like the fact that the torture never stops, don't we? I could acquire another amp like the one I have and use them as monoblocks. Who needs to retire anyway?