Question on future Bryston pre-amps (if there is one in making)

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Sasha

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James,

Are there any plans for pre-amp that would have adjustable gain including unity gain?
Considering that majority of today’s sources, including BDA-1, have quite high output voltage, and that Bryston amps offer selectable gain, would it not make sense to have a pre-amp with unity gain to further maximize the transparency and avoid all the unnecessary gain followed by attenuation followed by yet another gain?

James Tanner

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James,

Are there any plans for pre-amp that would have adjustable gain including unity gain?
Considering that majority of today’s sources, including BDA-1, have quite high output voltage, and that Bryston amps offer selectable gain, would it not make sense to have a pre-amp with unity gain to further maximize the transparency and avoid all the unnecessary gain followed by attenuation followed by yet another gain?

Hi Sasha,

You mean like a unity pass-through or adjustable to unity on each and every input??

james


Sasha

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Hi Sasha,

You mean like a unity pass-through or adjustable to unity on each and every input??

james

If by unity pass-through you mean avoiding attenuation altogether and passing the signal through than no, it is not what I was referring to, there would still need to be attenuator in the path.
The same approach that some pre-amps offer, for example some ML pre-amps allow for adjustable gain including 0dB gain. Another example is placette active pre-amp which is unity gain only by design, the only purpose of active stages in it is to keep input and output impedance.
I believe a pre-amp from Bryston with ability to adjust gain would be killer product.

James Tanner

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If by unity pass-through you mean avoiding attenuation altogether and passing the signal through than no, it is not what I was referring to, there would still need to be attenuator in the path.
The same approach that some pre-amps offer, for example some ML pre-amps allow for adjustable gain including 0dB gain. Another example is placette active pre-amp which is unity gain only by design, the only purpose of active stages in it is to keep input and output impedance.
I believe a pre-amp from Bryston with ability to adjust gain would be killer product.

OK I will pass this along.

james

bummrush

Coda,,,,,,Sanders sound system

Sasha

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Coda,,,,,,Sanders sound system
Interesting, I have not come across that one.
Have you heard it or compared it to BP-25 by any chance?

bummrush

No but check out both the websites ,, very very informativeI'm biased I have a Coda pre amp

Elizabeth

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Agree unity gain as option would be great.
Enabled by some switch or jumpers inside like on Bp 1.5
So the total gain of the preamp was the same as now, or, the option to cut total gain to unity gain with some sort of switch/jumper.
naturally the volume control would still be attenuating down from that point.

I too feel strongly that the total gain from my Bryston BP-26 and 4B-SST2 is too much. (thus i am always in the first 25% of the volume knob.. IF I only use the preamp for CD sources. Sure wish i could use more of the volume knob.

Sasha

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Agree unity gain as option would be great.
Enabled by some switch or jumpers inside like on Bp 1.5
So the total gain of the preamp was the same as now, or, the option to cut total gain to unity gain with some sort of switch/jumper.
naturally the volume control would still be attenuating down from that point.

I too feel strongly that the total gain from my Bryston BP-26 and 4B-SST2 is too much. (thus i am always in the first 25% of the volume knob.. IF I only use the preamp for CD sources. Sure wish i could use more of the volume knob.
Elizabeth, are you Elizabeth from Audioasylum, posting under the same name?
I agree that total gain with Bryston gear is too much, but some of my audiophile friends and I are after something else as well, the improvement in transparency you achieve without pre-amp in the path and to some degree with pre-amp of 0dB gain as well.
The difference is quite startling, unfortunately not all pre-amps that have adjustable gain meet all of our requirements. We envisioned a sort of an ideal pre-amp being BP-26 with adjustable gain.

Anonamemouse

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I think the German Aaron Cineast No 22 is exactly what you mean.
This is an extremely good pre amplifier, definitely in league with the BP26. But most likely very hard to get overseas.

http://aaron.hifi.net/intl/no22.html

Anonamemouse

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OK I will pass this along.

james

So... You ARE working on something new and exciting?

Sasha

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I think the German Aaron Cineast No 22 is exactly what you mean.
This is an extremely good pre amplifier, definitely in league with the BP26. But most likely very hard to get overseas.

http://aaron.hifi.net/intl/no22.html
That one would not work, I do not see balanced inputs and outputs.
It would be nice if there was such pre-amp from Bryston because at this level it becomes too expensive to do trial and error approach and you cannot assume that more $ gives you better performance. I have heard ML one with selectable gain in direct comparison with BP26 and I was not entirely impressed by ML. Preferences were divided in half among 4 pairs of ears, and were dependent on the type of music. 0dB gain on ML was certainly transparent and impressive, as one would expect, but too much was left to be desired in some other aspects of its performance. My friend was somewhat more enamoured with ML pre at 0dB gain that he thought ML monoblocks instead of his 7Bs would be the ticket together with ML pre and would sort of rectify areas where ML pre was falling short (you know, the “synergy” theory, as well as lower output impedance on ML pre and higher input impedance on ML amps). He got them in the end, I have not heard them yet, but based on his description it was major disappointment, a huge step back. His description goes in line with general impression I get from ML amplification, so my skepticism was founded (I hope no ML owner takes offence). For these reasons I think such pre-amp from Bryston would be sure bet.

Elizabeth

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Elizabeth, are you Elizabeth from Audioasylum, posting under the same name?
yes. i am the same person. Also on Audiogon.

Anonamemouse

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That one would not work, I do not see balanced inputs and outputs..

Why so focused on balanced? I own a $ 16 000 pre amp and nothing is balanced on that, all RCA. I have heard it next to the BP26 and the difference in sound was mindblowing. It now drives a 4B SST2 and I wish I had the money to drive 2 x 7B SST2 or a 14B SST2. But it shows what the 4B SST2 is capable of, much better than the BP26 can do.

Don't forget that your cables also can make or break a set... I use Nordost Red Dawn throughout my set, I came from Siltech, which turned out not to work with my stuff.

Step away from technical details and let your ears do the talking.

Diamond Dog

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Why so focused on balanced? I own a $ 16 000 pre amp and nothing is balanced on that, all RCA. I have heard it next to the BP26 and the difference in sound was mindblowing. It now drives a 4B SST2 and I wish I had the money to drive 2 x 7B SST2 or a 14B SST2. But it shows what the 4B SST2 is capable of, much better than the BP26 can do.

Don't forget that your cables also can make or break a set... I use Nordost Red Dawn throughout my set, I came from Siltech, which turned out not to work with my stuff.

Step away from technical details and let your ears do the talking.

That's just crazy talk... :wink: Are you trying to land yourself before the Inquisition, heretic ?

D.D.

Sasha

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Why so focused on balanced? I own a $ 16 000 pre amp and nothing is balanced on that, all RCA. I have heard it next to the BP26 and the difference in sound was mindblowing. It now drives a 4B SST2 and I wish I had the money to drive 2 x 7B SST2 or a 14B SST2. But it shows what the 4B SST2 is capable of, much better than the BP26 can do.

Don't forget that your cables also can make or break a set... I use Nordost Red Dawn throughout my set, I came from Siltech, which turned out not to work with my stuff.

Step away from technical details and let your ears do the talking.

I have learned long time ago that measurements and “technical details” are indicative of performance, subjectively and objectively, so I stick to balanced whenever possible, if I am to consider a new piece of gear it will have to have balanced inputs and outputs.
Doing otherwise would be contrary to logic, my perception and my experience.
I share this perception and experience with many others and it is absolutely clear to us that balanced operation is superior. The “ears talk” did indeed bring us to such conclusion.
Through such approach I have also learned that with balanced operations interconnects have far less influence and that competently designed balanced interconnects constructed from quality parts, and of electrical properties appropriate for given application are all that is needed. The emphasis is on competently designed of course. Consequently I no longer subscribe to the approach of sound tweaking through cabling of any kind, as it turned out to be beyond any doubt fundamentally wrong way of trying to improve performance of the system and make it more truthful to the recording and ultimately the live unamplified sound. Incidentally I did have Nordost Red Dawn in my system long time ago when some of the components were single ended.

werd

Agree unity gain as option would be great.
Enabled by some switch or jumpers inside like on Bp 1.5
So the total gain of the preamp was the same as now, or, the option to cut total gain to unity gain with some sort of switch/jumper.
naturally the volume control would still be attenuating down from that point.

I too feel strongly that the total gain from my Bryston BP-26 and 4B-SST2 is too much. (thus i am always in the first 25% of the volume knob.. IF I only use the preamp for CD sources. Sure wish i could use more of the volume knob.

Hi

You might be interested in something like this.


http://www.roksan.co.uk/roksan/roksanpage.php?pageno=16

9db gain on an active. It will give you more movement on your volume control. Compared to the bp26 that is over 20db there abouts.

tdinut

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Why so focused on balanced? I own a $ 16 000 pre amp and nothing is balanced on that, all RCA. I have heard it next to the BP26 and the difference in sound was mindblowing. It now drives a 4B SST2 and I wish I had the money to drive 2 x 7B SST2 or a 14B SST2. But it shows what the 4B SST2 is capable of, much better than the BP26 can do.

Don't forget that your cables also can make or break a set... I use Nordost Red Dawn throughout my set, I came from Siltech, which turned out not to work with my stuff.

Step away from technical details and let your ears do the talking.
Hi Anonamemouse,
Can I ask what preamp you are using? I just bought a Conrad Johnson GAT (all RCA in and out) with the intention of trying either 7BSST2's or 28BSST2's with it.
Thanks!
Joe

Diamond Dog

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Hi Joe: Anonamemouse enjoys a Sovereign Director in his system. The use of solely RCA's must be more common than I realized on more esoteric preamps. I have a Manley Neo-Classic 300B which I use with 7B SST2's and it also has only RCA's like your and Anonamemouse's pre's.

D.D.


Anonamemouse

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Hi Anonamemouse,
Can I ask what preamp you are using? I just bought a Conrad Johnson GAT (all RCA in and out) with the intention of trying either 7BSST2's or 28BSST2's with it.
Thanks!
Joe

Like D.D. said, I enjoy a Sovereign Director. Not much info on it online I'm afraid, the Sovereign website only has a price list. When I bought it I drove to Germany to pick it up in person at the CEO's house. He is a very friendly and intelligent man, and lives a life I could get used to in about 0.004 seconds.

Hi Joe: Anonamemouse enjoys a Sovereign Director in his system. The use of solely RCA's must be more common than I realized on more esoteric preamps. I have a Manley Neo-Classic 300B which I use with 7B SST2's and it also has only RCA's like your and Anonamemouse's pre's.

D.D.

Balanced is widely used in the pro audio world, mainly to cover large distances without too many problems. Balanced is now slowly replaced by digital through fiber optics. More fragile, but saves BUNDLES of cables.
I for one have no problems whatsoever with all RCA. My pre is designed with only RCA in mind, and I trust Sovereign to squeeze the maximum out of it.