[Bendingwave]

Folks

As I have said many times "the demo is everything - the rest is rhetoric".

We can discuss all day the plus minuses of A/D or D/A conversions technology differences, driver types, parts quality, chips vs discrete etc. but it really comes down to one thing - have a listen to a quality Active system and decide for your self what you think.

If you compare any of our specific Passive speaker models to any of our specific Active models the performance differences are evident. You may not like the sound of either our Passive or Active speakers but there is no denying the performance advantage of the Active versions in my opinion.

james

So does that mean your separate Bryston power amps will become obsolete when active speakers control the market?

[James Tanner]

So does that mean your separate Bryston power amps will become obsolete when active speakers control the market?

Hi

Only if people feel external amplifiers have no value over internal amplifiers

James

[macrojack]

Only 10 lbs? Sounds like the cabinets are the weak point - like in my 305P MKII's. Seems like they could use some internal bracing also as I have done.

Thanks for the tip.

[OzarkTom]

I need to apologize to JLM for jumping him about passives being muddied. I also believe active is better. The Acoustats with DD tube amps sounds head and shoulders above the ones with transformers. I know several that still own these and after 40 years, they still think these beat every other speaker today. One AC'er here goes to all the audio shows and says he cannot find anything better. But Cosmetics is the best, many hates a big panel screen.

I sold Meridian back in the 80's, and while sounding good, imaging was never outside the box. My Mordaunt Short EX-442 with a David Berning tube amp was much better. They had a lot better imaging and transparency.

I went to RMAF in 2010 and found a pair of actives that were awesome. They were the PTE Phoenix, and at $5700 a pair, represents a very good value. If anyone here gets serious about actives, I would put these at the top of your list.

http://pteacoustics.com/

Actives have been out now for at least 40 years, they have been a tough sale, and will probably always be for audiophiles. Maybe if more companies would come out with actives, more people would take interest. But with so few brick and mortar stores today, that presents a huge struggle to hear these demos.

[WC]

As someone who likes to build amps, I think all speakers should be active. 

I have built 2 channels of amplification, but I have parts to construct 12 more channels of amplification of various types. (separate 2 way and subs for 2-channel, 5.2 for surround including the subs). Amps will be separate from the speakers.

Passives are more convenient and simple to connect. Actives can be simple if they have built in amps. Actives can be a tweakers dream with separate amps for each driver. With different amps you can tailor your sound to your liking and adjust the crossover so it sounds the best to you.

[witchdoctor]

As someone who likes to build amps, I think all speakers should be active. 

I have built 2 channels of amplification, but I have parts to construct 12 more channels of amplification of various types. (separate 2 way and subs for 2-channel, 5.2 for surround including the subs). Amps will be separate from the speakers.

Passives are more convenient and simple to connect. Actives can be simple if they have built in amps. Actives can be a tweakers dream with separate amps for each driver. With different amps you can tailor your sound to your liking and adjust the crossover so it sounds the best to you.

I get your point. Audiophiles spend piles of cash to tweak their system and lack the tools and experience that the engineer has. As an amp builder what is your opinion of active speakers using class D amps? Do they offer any advantages/disadvantages in terms of price or SQ?

 

[kingdeezie]

I get your point. Audiophiles spend piles of cash to tweak their system and lack the tools and experience that the engineer has. As an amp builder what is your opinion of active speakers using class D amps? Do they offer any advantages/disadvantages in terms of price or SQ?

 

Aren't all products that an audiophile purchases engineered by engineers with the appropriate tools and experience?

Aren't these same products engineered to function within a system? Those piles of cash are used to purchase products with a designated set of specifications and a preset level of performance.

Why are you pretending that a person buying an active system is different than a person buying a passive system?

You use the Bryston Model T as an example in this thread. You do realize the only difference between the passive and active model T IS THE CROSSOVER TYPE, right? There is no included amplification.

The audiophile still has to spend "piles of cash without correct tools and experience..." to finish the system. Amps, preamps, DAC, etc, etc.

You keep conflating powered speakers with an active crossover, with active crossover speakers. Two different things.

[James Tanner]

Hi Folks,

Just got a copy of a new review from Soundstage Magazine due out next week on the Active Middle T's.

Will post when available.

james

[witchdoctor]

Aren't all products that an audiophile purchases engineered by engineers with the appropriate tools and experience?

Aren't these same products engineered to function within a system? Those piles of cash are used to purchase products with a designated set of specifications and a preset level of performance.

Why are you pretending that a person buying an active system is different than a person buying a passive system?

You use the Bryston Model T as an example in this thread. You do realize the only difference between the passive and active model T IS THE CROSSOVER TYPE, right? There is no included amplification.

The audiophile still has to spend "piles of cash without correct tools and experience..." to finish the system. Amps, preamps, DAC, etc, etc.

You keep conflating powered speakers with an active crossover, with active crossover speakers. Two different things.

Good luck with your cash, I think we are debating the future trend of active speakers. I am not pretending anything. Pro's use primarily active systems. Consumers primarily use passive. Who knows how to squeeze every last drop of performance from a Bryston Model T?
I couldn't say that I could do it, even with an unlimited budget. Why not take the budget I have available and let the designer match the crossover and the amp for me?

Don't get me wrong, I am sure I could be happy with a Paradigm Reference Studio 40 and a receiver. But after experiencing the ACTIVE 40 (not powered) version in my own system I have no desire to go backwards. YMMV

BTW not all engineers are created equal so I do think there is substantial risk when you buy electronics of any type. (shout out to the Bryston 20 year warranty)

[WC]

I get your point. Audiophiles spend piles of cash to tweak their system and lack the tools and experience that the engineer has. As an amp builder what is your opinion of active speakers using class D amps? Do they offer any advantages/disadvantages in terms of price or SQ?

The benefits of Class D are low heat dissipation and significant wattage in a small footprint. Sound quality varies. Class D is beneficial if you want to install inside the cabinet of a speaker. With Class A and Class A/B you would need to install a heatsink on the speaker. Heatsinks add weight, size and cost to a speaker. Probably why most powered speakers are Class D.

[witchdoctor]

The benefits of Class D are low heat dissipation and significant wattage in a small footprint. Sound quality varies. Class D is beneficial if you want to install inside the cabinet of a speaker. With Class A and Class A/B you would need to install a heatsink on the speaker. Heatsinks add weight, size and cost to a speaker. Probably why most powered speakers are Class D.

Thank you for that, makes sense.

[Joe Frances]

 

Passives sound muddied and dull? You need to come to my place and hear my Alnico full range speakers. Bring your JBL's over and we will make a comparison.

I love this!!! We should all agree with Mr. Tanner to go to an audio show, and have a blow out side-by-side "battle of the bands" with active and passive speakers playing the same music before a two focus groups/juries: one of audio professionals and one of amateur music lovers and see which system wins.  We could even make it easier with Bryston products on both sides to limit any other factors other than active versus passive speakers.  Wouldn't that be great!?  I bet it would be a big hit at the show.

If it's been done already, please don't bust my bubble. 

Joe


P.S. I personally don't like the sound of Class D amplification.  I am an A or A/B kinda guy.