[NoahH]

I've never heard monoblocks from Van Alstine. I had one Van Alstine amp almost a decade ago, a stereo solid state amp (FetValve 300 or something like that). It was screechingly bright, and I returned it within the 30-day trial period. I wouldn't know how any of their current amps sound.

Sorry - I am mistaking you with another user.

[morganc]

Sorry - I am mistaking you with another user.

Not yet, still breaking  monos and I’ve not had the time but will have time in the next week or so. 

[munosmario]

Not yet, still breaking  monos and I’ve not had the time but will have time in the next week or so.

Thanks, Morganc...look forward to it.
Out of curiosity, do you already own both types of amplifiers (stereo and mono-pair), or do you somehow still have evaluation time to decide from the manufacturer?

All the best................Mario

[mick wolfe]

Let us know if you hear an improvement with the XLR cables.  Some gear with true balanced circuits tend to sound better with XLRs in the chain. I experienced a nice improvement with the PS Audio gear that I had.

My brief experiment with an XLR IC vs. single ended IC feeding the Mini GaN 3.....if you have a single ended IC you're happy with in this combination, I'd leave well enough alone. The difference at least here using the Freya+ doesn't seem to favor one over the other. But as you note, this may vary with a different pre-amp in the equation. So in the end, YMMV.

[DBT AUDIO]

My brief experiment with an XLR IC vs. single ended IC feeding the Mini GaN 3.....if you have a single ended IC you're happy with in this combination, I'd leave well enough alone. The difference at least here using the Freya+ doesn't seem to favor one over the other. But as you note, this may vary with a different pre-amp in the equation. So in the end, YMMV.

Thanks for the update.

[atmasphere]

Daryl Z - you are exactly correct.  The point of this thread is to argue for the superiority of GanFets over MOSFETS re: music reproduction.  To that end: Title of the thread? check. Numerous references throughout to GanFets as opposed to MOSFETS? check. Technical distinctions (switching frequency, slew rate, replication of square wave) noted detailing the superiority of GanFets over MOSFETS? check. 


oh well...

The main reason to use GaNFETs seems to be that its a lot easier to control stray parasitics that can cause Radio Frequency Interference (RFI). GaNFETs can switch at some pretty crazy frequencies! We found that we were able to get the radiated noise down so low that its actually lower than some tube amps out there. So all that concern that you hear some people talk about 'switching noise' really doesn't have to be a thing if the designer knows what he's doing.

Beyond that GaNFETs might offer a little bit less deadtime needed, but due to the way they switch on and off, the deadtime isn't needed for the GaNFET so much as it is to allow time for the magnetic field in the output choke to collapse. When it does then and only then can the GaNFET be switched also. Otherwise it can sit there and pay no attention the off state on its gate! So the output choke is a critical bit of the design in a GaNFET amp.

In our amp we found that the non-linearities that cause distortion are caused by the encoding scheme and the deadtime. I can't speak for other amps but in our circuit that results in lower ordered harmonics; the distortion spectra looking a lot like we see in our class A triode OTLs but at a much lower level. Not surprisingly (since the distortion of any amplifier is the amp's 'sonic signature') our class D sounds very similar to our OTLs as a result, the same liquidity in the mids and highs, but easier to hear into the rear of the soundstage owing to the lower distortion (distortion obscures detail after all...).

IMO, class D has vacuum tube power amps on borrowed time.

[genjamon]

Thanks so much for contributing your knowledge to this discussion, Ralph!  Very informative!

And while my miniGaN 5 just arrived, I'd love to hear your new GaN amp someday.

[2bigears]

  tube amps are HISTORY ? That's a bold statement ! I might have to try these. 17 pages and going. 
      KISS seems to really take off here. And new tech. 

[Early B.]

IMO, class D has vacuum tube power amps on borrowed time.

OK, this is really intriguing for the near future of high-end audio, especially coming from a company whose reputation is built on the backs of tubes.

[atmasphere]

OK, this is really intriguing for the near future of high-end audio, especially coming from a company whose reputation is built on the backs of tubes.

I switched to our class D amps about a year and a half ago. I don't miss the tubes at all. Apparently our customers hear what we're hearing as well if the feedback we get is any indication.

I also play in a rock band. I've seen a number of bands that use class D amps (and not the cheap 'modelling' amps) at shows instead of the much heavier Fenders or Marshalls. They can do this because the 'sound' they get comes entirely from the effects pedals they use rather than the amps unlike 50 years ago. Part of the motivation is also that a class D guitar amp might weigh 15 pounds where a Marshall is more like 50 or 60 pounds. That makes a big difference at 1:AM in the morning!

The guitar market has driven the tube market- the reason we have a lot of the fancy tubes like KT150s is because companies like JJ can afford to make small runs of them because the guitar amp companies buy so many of the guitar stalwarts like 6L6s, EL34s and KT88s. As those sales dwindle it will become harder to keep the more exotic stuff going too.

Class D has gotten that good. Here's another prediction that some might see as apocryphal: If you are an amplifier manufacturer and haven't sorted out the class D thing yet you're doing so at your own risk.

[DBT AUDIO]

I switched to our class D amps about a year and a half ago. I don't miss the tubes at all. Apparently our customers hear what we're hearing as well if the feedback we get is any indication.

Do you guys plan to introduce higher powered class D amps and do you offer them with black or silver face plates?  They look nice, but they remind me of CJ gear with the champagne faceplates.

Thanks

[Daryl Zero]

I switched to our class D amps about a year and a half ago. I don't miss the tubes at all. Apparently our customers hear what we're hearing as well if the feedback we get is any indication.

I also play in a rock band. I've seen a number of bands that use class D amps (and not the cheap 'modelling' amps) at shows instead of the much heavier Fenders or Marshalls. They can do this because the 'sound' they get comes entirely from the effects pedals they use rather than the amps unlike 50 years ago. Part of the motivation is also that a class D guitar amp might weigh 15 pounds where a Marshall is more like 50 or 60 pounds. That makes a big difference at 1:AM in the morning!

The guitar market has driven the tube market- the reason we have a lot of the fancy tubes like KT150s is because companies like JJ can afford to make small runs of them because the guitar amp companies buy so many of the guitar stalwarts like 6L6s, EL34s and KT88s. As those sales dwindle it will become harder to keep the more exotic stuff going too.

Class D has gotten that good. Here's another prediction that some might see as apocryphal: If you are an amplifier manufacturer and haven't sorted out the class D thing yet you're doing so at your own risk.

Having played in an amateur local rock band in my day, I can definitely second your remark about how heavy and exhausting some of the equipment are. Now if we can only find a way to make PA systems tiny.

[Early B.]

Here's another prediction that some might see as apocryphal: If you are an amplifier manufacturer and haven't sorted out the class D thing yet you're doing so at your own risk.

Yeah, it's been a few decades since we've seen substantial innovation in amplifiers. Many of us on this forum have already stated we're not going back to heavy amps with huge transformers. However, I hadn't ruled out tube amps. Perhaps I should. 

[RonN5]

Ralph, if your GanFet amp, or I guess any ganfet class d amp were produced in 3 versions… one was with virtually zero distortion, one with low but domination second harmonic and one with third, how would their sounds differ from each other and would the differences be slight nuances or more pronounced.

[catluck]

WOW!!!  Ralph's comments are profound for obvious reasons.  And, as I wrote previously, I couldn't agree more. Literally.  I haven't run a tube amp since I purchased the MiniGans.  The M3's continue to amaze as never before.  Ralph is not the only designer/manufacturer who thinks GanFets are the future.  And we're only considering sound quality here.  But, in truth, there will come a point for every audiophile where, even if that person feels the sound quality of a non-GanFet amp is somehow superior to its GanFet competitor, the delta will become so small as to be overwhelmed by the other meaningful considerations wholly favoring GanFet amps like weight, cost, heat dissipation, AC consumption, and size.   Do audiophiles have some obligation to environmental concerns?  I know that's a controversial query but for me it's easy to migrate to GanFets and feel good about doing so for more than just sound quality concern. It's comical comparing these little MiniGans at 5 lbs. each to their 100 lb. tube competitors in the same cabinet and which, sadly, sit dormant now. Probably going to sell my tube gear before the word gets out...

[rooze]

I think the delta is already very small between a good solid state amp and a good tube amp. I’ve gone back and forth between a pair of Allnic Audio A6000 300b monoblocks and Nelson Pass J2, into a number of different speakers, and the differences imparted by the amps are small.

But it’s those SMALL DIFFERENCES that we’ve always paid the big money for in this hobby. I don’t personally see that changing any time soon.
Considering that my Allnic amps weigh almost 6 times as much as the J2, cost around 6 times as much as the J2, require around $4k for a retube, occupy at least 2 times the floor space, require 2 times the investment in cabling, yet sound perhaps only 5% better, one would think it a no brainer to keep the J2 ahead of the big Allnic amps, if one were to have to choose between the two. But it doesn’t work that way, as we all probably know.

Regarding Atma-Sphere amps specifically, I’ve never heard them so I shouldn’t say too much. I do own a H2O S250 ICE based Class D amp that sounds fantastic, powers just about anything, and cost a respectable $4k or so when new. I also own a Lyngdorf TDAi amp, which is superb on many levels. But it ain’t a tube amp and it clearly doesn’t deliver the sonic character of a good tube amp.

From what I’ve read so far, the GalNit amps ain’t tube amps either and they’re no closer to being tube amps than any other solid state, or class D or TDA amps etc.

It surprises me that there’s a conversation even taking place that seems to be promoting the idea that one will replace the other, rather than legitimately coexisting, as they almost certainly will.

[Mr. Big]

Tubes have their own sound, and that sound can change night and day depending on the tube used and brand, which is why tube lovers love their amps. Solid State as it sonics and they can vary from brighter with hyper detail to more natural and musical sounding with more laid-back detail. Class D has its own sound signature also. So is one superior, only to the owners who make their choice on what they perceive they enjoy more. For anyone to say tube gear is dead is something that's been said from the '70s when big power SS amps hit the market. Will class D amps rule, I doubt it, they will be in the mix because some will not like their sound, as well as some, may. For boomers, class D will offer gear with much less weight and that may well be their attraction more so than sound quality. I would be leary of buying from a self-run company, I just saw a guy who owns a Digital Amplifier Company Cherry amp that failed and he cannot find where to repair it because the company who designed it, the owner Tommy passed away, and is no longer in business. It's a business and whoever makes any type of gear, of course, will tell you it's the best as they should. Let your ears be your guide and your budget.

[catluck]

Interesting push back. I would however suggest that opinion be informed by actual listening as opposed to reading about.  Kind of like judging a souffle by reading about it in a cook book rather than tasting.... Further, concluding that other factors somehow outweigh sonics may be a misinterpretation.  The point is that, IF the sonics are comparable, even if different in subtle respects, and that's obviously the listener's subjective conclusion, then other factors hugely favor GanFets which, again, are a subtype of class D.  We're NOT talking about MOSFET class d devices.  Will there always be listeners who favor the distortion spectra of tubes? Almost certainly.  Again, the point is that GanFets have so elevated listening enjoyment that reliance on bias and predisposition ill serve today's audiophile.  There will be those, like myself, who have been decades long tube'o'philes, with substantial tube gear and tubes, who are converted to GanFets. But until you've given the technology a fair listen....

One last thing:  "leery of buying from a self-run company"  What is Spatial Audio?

[Early B.]

I'm reluctant to buy a tube amp (I want a 300b amp) because the best-sounding tubes have become exceedingly expensive. The main advantage of tube gear is tube rolling, but a similar approach can be accomplished in some Class D amps by rolling opamps.

[genjamon]

I've had my Line Magnetic 845 amp sitting unused since 2018, a combination of fears of burning little curious fingers and costs of retubing.  The costs of retubing my preamp are substantial enough that I don't see myself getting back to a tube amp anytime soon.  Odyssey Kismet stereo amp combined with my tube preamp was satisfying enough, and better in some ways.  Then my DIY fully dual mono stereo Folsom amp brought greater clarity, but at the expense of some "analog" character for lack of a better term. 

The miniGaN's seem to have several features that would help with matching to a tube preamp.  The first is their higher input impedance.  100K is very unusual in the Class D amp realm, and makes matching with tube preamps potentially much more copacetic, since tube preamps commonly have much higher output impedance than solid state.  Another is the variable gain settings, which might help further with a wider variation in tube preamp gain.  And finally, it has RCA inputs, which most tube preamps are single-ended.  Though I think the jury is still out on whether the XLR inputs definitely sound better than the RCAs.  I will be testing that at some point. 

Aside from the RCA input option, you don't really see these features in other Class D options.