The Demo is Dead for Me. Is it for You?

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Laundrew

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Re: The Demo is Dead for Me. Is it for You?
« Reply #40 on: 20 Aug 2011, 02:03 pm »
"...It is just like a sales guy constantly saying ' did you hear that?!' 'awesome!' during the demo,  :icon_lol:..."


I think that amblim makes an excellent point. I have experienced this on numerous occasions where some audio dealers would critique every nuance from their gear during the demo and this normally resulted in me thanking them for the demo and leaving their store. I preferred it much more when the dealers left you alone with the gear but were close by if you required their assistance.

Be well...   

PRELUDE

Re: The Demo is Dead for Me. Is it for You?
« Reply #41 on: 20 Aug 2011, 02:55 pm »
Have you ever heard HERALD h777m speakers? Please if any one did,share your experience with us then I will talk. :D


DaveNote

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Re: The Demo is Dead for Me. Is it for You?
« Reply #42 on: 20 Aug 2011, 03:14 pm »
Correct - many times we can be influenced or seduced by the rhetoric and we loose sight of the point - great sound - so listen first - talk later :thumb:

james

I agree with James that in terms of coming to one's own opinion about gear, it is necessary to listen first, then talk. But as most people commenting on this topic understand, the issue here is under what circumstances it is possible to demo before buying.

Amblin raises a terrific point in question. Based on reviews, and the very positive reception of the HD800s by a distant pen pal, I bought a pair sight unseen for two reasons. One there were none in town to demo. Two, the dealer was taking orders at a gouging level price. I bought online at a lower price and received them by delivery a day later. Great, but as Amblin reports, as good as the HD800s are, it wasn't until I bought LCD2s (sight unseen, drawn by reviews, bought online) that I found how cold and clinical they sound. So what to do? I want to keep the HD800s as reference cans, but would like to make them sound better. A respected reviewer with whom I have communicated, has made some suggestions that will require an additional, modest purchase, sight unseen. It is another gamble, I confess, but so was buying the LCD2s.

I prefer demos, probably because it makes sense, and I feel I've lost something in not having them available. On the other hand, the good news, at least for me, is that I have to say, on balance, in terms of actual experience with buying blind versus buying with demos, I have had just about equal success in terms of satisfaction buying either way. I confess, therefore, that the death of demos is, above all, a lament for a passing age, like so much else in our fast moving times.

For consumers (as opposed to James's use of demos), I believe the demo is all but dead. and the moral of the story may be, it isn't the end of the world, so get used to it.

Photon46

Re: The Demo is Dead for Me. Is it for You?
« Reply #43 on: 20 Aug 2011, 03:43 pm »
Wow, I realized after reading this thread and taking inventory of what I've bought, I've reached the point where every single piece of equipment I own has been a "blind," no demo purchase. Thankfully, all have worked out extremely well and I've no regrets. Here in central Florida, there are just too few options and almost everything that was of interest had no dealers. Those brands that did interest me (Magnepan) have a dealer that never stocks anything and only wants to take orders, so I couldn't demo that brand. If you're interested in two channel audio instead of home theater, there's only one store that treats you with respect. I really miss the days when stores didn't behave like car dealers, i.e., freaking out if you don't buy something TODAY, RIGHT NOW!! I have great sympathy for dealers who waste time on customers who just demo and then buy online. The current state of affairs in audio brick & mortar retailing is difficult for dealers and customers.

Phil A

Re: The Demo is Dead for Me. Is it for You?
« Reply #44 on: 20 Aug 2011, 04:05 pm »
Here's an interesting editorial/article on the state of high end audio and the demo that is a couple of years old:

http://www.avguide.com/blog/high-end-audio-demo-or-die

DaveNote

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Re: The Demo is Dead for Me. Is it for You?
« Reply #45 on: 20 Aug 2011, 04:48 pm »
Here's an interesting editorial/article on the state of high end audio and the demo that is a couple of years old:

http://www.avguide.com/blog/high-end-audio-demo-or-die


Thanks for the interesting article, Phil. The comments were very good as to which dealers people on the site use. I wonder how many of those shops are still around. One comment complained about the three high-end shops here in Vancouver that have arrogant sales staff. There are still three here and their attitudes depend on which sales person you talk to, but in every case, the problem of demos is there because none of them can afford to stock the priciest items of their authorized manufacturers. On the other hand, if you have an established relationship with a dealer or sales person, exceptions are made. For example, one of these shops arranged to sell me a major item the brand of which it does not carry, and just this week, one of its salesmen, with whom I've dealt for a number of years offered to do - wait for it! - an in-home demo!!!

amblin

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Re: The Demo is Dead for Me. Is it for You?
« Reply #46 on: 20 Aug 2011, 05:37 pm »
Dave. I'm relieved to see that i'm not the only one who thinks the HD800's a bit bright and perhaps there's 'too much of a good thing'.   most of the reviews i've seen r horrahs and wows.  :green:

I tested it on my SPL phonitor, the interesting german made head-amp with many knobs play with :green: . The SPL was one very neutral sounding  and unforgiving device, so perhaps it somehow 'magnified' the HD800's characteristics to a point a little bit beyond the sennheiser would feel comfortable.

------------------------

In my opinion, If i'm going to buy something without an actual demo,  i'll need either 1,there's someone i can trust and had a great deal of knowlege and experience on the thing i'm going to buy. Or 2, I already own more than one products from that brand and they did a superb job. 

They are NOT the funny little plastic speakers i'd pick up mindlessly from some airport dutyfrees. We r talking about thousands and sometimes tens of thousands of real hard earned money here :green:  And 'SOUND' is just NOT the thing that i can simply measure with a ruler.  :lol: pity, i wish the bright eggheads in their secret labs can come up with pair of artificial audiophile ears similar to those being used by Germans to measure the noise in their posh sedans.  So some sort of 'true to life standards ' can be created.  Oooh, the sacred muppet with holy ears..  :icon_lol:

James Tanner

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Re: The Demo is Dead for Me. Is it for You?
« Reply #47 on: 20 Aug 2011, 05:47 pm »
Interesting comments on the 800's guys. I felt on the BP26 preamp they really sounded flat and lifeless without dynamics. On the new Bryston BHA - with the right gain settings - they actually sound very nice :thumb:

James

DaveNote

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Re: The Demo is Dead for Me. Is it for You?
« Reply #48 on: 20 Aug 2011, 06:11 pm »
Interesting comments on the 800's guys. I felt on the BP26 preamp they really sounded flat and lifeless without dynamics. On the new Bryston BHA - with the right gain settings - they actually sound very nice :thumb:

James

James, it would be helpful if you could elaborate on how the BHA sounds with 800s. What exactly makes them sound very nice? Are they warmer on with the BHA? Is the bass stronger? Anything else? For those of us with these cans, something more descriptive would be most appreciated.

Dave

DaveNote

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Re: The Demo is Dead for Me. Is it for You?
« Reply #49 on: 20 Aug 2011, 06:22 pm »
Dave. I'm relieved to see that i'm not the only one who thinks the HD800's a bit bright and perhaps there's 'too much of a good thing'.   most of the reviews i've seen r horrahs and wows.  :green:

I tested it on my SPL phonitor, the interesting german made head-amp with many knobs play with :green: . The SPL was one very neutral sounding  and unforgiving device, so perhaps it somehow 'magnified' the HD800's characteristics to a point a little bit beyond the sennheiser would feel comfortable.

------------------------

In my opinion, If i'm going to buy something without an actual demo,  i'll need either 1,there's someone i can trust and had a great deal of knowlege and experience on the thing i'm going to buy. Or 2, I already own more than one products from that brand and they did a superb job. 

They are NOT the funny little plastic speakers i'd pick up mindlessly from some airport dutyfrees. We r talking about thousands and sometimes tens of thousands of real hard earned money here :green:  And 'SOUND' is just NOT the thing that i can simply measure with a ruler.  :lol: pity, i wish the bright eggheads in their secret labs can come up with pair of artificial audiophile ears similar to those being used by Germans to measure the noise in their posh sedans.  So some sort of 'true to life standards ' can be created.  Oooh, the sacred muppet with holy ears..  :icon_lol:

My Grace m903 amp has a very clinical sound, perhaps something like the SPL, which I haven't heard but read about. I know the Grace was designed as much for sound engineers as anyone else. I think the criteria you use for buying blind are bang on. Others have mentioned doing a lot of reading, as well, which can work if you avoid falling in the trap James rightully is concerned about, accepting rhetoric. There certainly was a lot of hype about the HD800s. Even so, I'm not sorry I bought them.

 I'm hoping James can expand on his impressions of how the BHA-1 handles the 800s for a practical reasons - I'm on the hunt for an amp that will make the 800s sound better.

It seems to me that because for many audiophiles who cannot demo, for whatever reason, it would be great if there were a guide called "Buying Blind."

Dave

S Clark

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Re: The Demo is Dead for Me. Is it for You?
« Reply #50 on: 20 Aug 2011, 06:28 pm »
The popularity of tours for new products here at AC addresses this very problem.  DACs, phono pre's, cabling, even speakers go from member to member, for the cost of one way shipping.  There is still nothing better than listening to equipment in your system and room. 

DaveNote

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Re: The Demo is Dead for Me. Is it for You?
« Reply #51 on: 20 Aug 2011, 06:41 pm »
The popularity of tours for new products here at AC addresses this very problem.  DACs, phono pre's, cabling, even speakers go from member to member, for the cost of one way shipping.  There is still nothing better than listening to equipment in your system and room.

Good reminder. Thanks.

Dave

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Re: The Demo is Dead for Me. Is it for You?
« Reply #52 on: 20 Aug 2011, 06:52 pm »

Dave: A product tour for your speakers would be an interesting proposition for everyone involved.  :wink:

D.D.

konut

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Re: The Demo is Dead for Me. Is it for You?
« Reply #53 on: 20 Aug 2011, 07:39 pm »
Demo, you're nothing to me now.
 You're not a brother, you're not a friend.
I don't want to know you or what you do.
I don't want to see you at the audio shows, I don't want you near my house.
 When your at our showroom, I want to know a day in advance, so I won't be there.
I know it was you, Demo. You broke my heart. You broke my heart!

Sorry, I couldn't resist.

amblin

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Re: The Demo is Dead for Me. Is it for You?
« Reply #54 on: 20 Aug 2011, 08:07 pm »
Demo, you're nothing to me now.
 You're not a brother, you're not a friend.
I don't want to know you or what you do.
I don't want to see you at the audio shows, I don't want you near my house.
 When your at our showroom, I want to know a day in advance, so I won't be there.
I know it was you, Demo. You broke my heart. You broke my heart!

Sorry, I couldn't resist.


Aye, demo, neither friends, nor enemies.

There's nothing, There's all the things..

Alas, perplexing souls

But there's coke, in classic bottle. Classic bottle.


Aye, demo,neither shows, nor the houses.

There's dealer, There's all the deals..

Alas, hankering minds

But there's drink, c'est gratuit...C'est gratuit...


 :green: seriously, my dealer had a huge fridge so there's an endless supply of free coke and No bookings necessary. How can you resist that *burp*  :icon_lol:

Edit, refined it abit, now makes more sense.  :icon_lol:
« Last Edit: 20 Aug 2011, 09:30 pm by amblin »

Diamond Dog

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Re: The Demo is Dead for Me. Is it for You?
« Reply #55 on: 20 Aug 2011, 08:27 pm »
 Konut & Amblin :  Outstanding work, gentlemen. Truly outstanding. 

:rotflmao: :rotflmao: :rotflmao: :rotflmao:

D.D.

jjc1

Re: The Demo is Dead for Me. Is it for You?
« Reply #56 on: 20 Aug 2011, 09:36 pm »
Demo, you're nothing to me now.
 You're not a brother, you're not a friend.
I don't want to know you or what you do.
I don't want to see you at the audio shows, I don't want you near my house.
 When your at our showroom, I want to know a day in advance, so I won't be there.
I know it was you, Demo. You broke my heart. You broke my heart!

Sorry, I couldn't resist.
  But you're MY little brother.

vegasdave

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Re: The Demo is Dead for Me. Is it for You?
« Reply #57 on: 20 Aug 2011, 10:03 pm »
No, the demo is still important. Unfortunately here in Las Vegas, there's no Bryston dealer at the moment. So, I did in fact buy everything without audition it first. Thank goodness all of it works perfectly and sounds good together!

vegasdave

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Re: The Demo is Dead for Me. Is it for You?
« Reply #58 on: 20 Aug 2011, 10:03 pm »
Have you ever heard HERALD h777m speakers? Please if any one did,share your experience with us then I will talk. :D



Looks like a rip-off of B&W.

amblin

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Re: The Demo is Dead for Me. Is it for You?
« Reply #59 on: 21 Aug 2011, 10:25 am »
Looks like a rip-off of B&W.

Or KEF, they also have some speakers with that funnly looking melon on top.