[Saturn94]

In the past each time I started researching computer audio I always gave up in frustration and confusion.  It just seemed too complicated and inconvenient.  Now with the availability of budget USB DACs and USB-S/SPDIF converters it seems it may be simpler now, so I tempted to give it a try to see if I like computer audio.  I hoping my fellow AC members can offer some guidance.

I have a pretty good audio system including an Anthem AVM20 Pre/Pro, Parasound amp, and Salk speakers.  I also have an HP laptop I bought about 4 years ago (1.6ghz AMD Turion 64x2 dual core processor, 2g RAM, Windows Vista service pack 2).  I mostly use Windows Media Player 11, but recently downloaded Foobar.  My partner may also want to hook up his laptop (1yr old HP running Windows 7) to our audio system, so whatever I get needs to work with both computers.

Right now my computer has mostly mp3's and WMA lossy files on it from CD rips and music downloads, but I'd like to start downloading some higher quality material (hi rez FLACs for example).  We also may want to listen to music services such as Rhapsody and some internet radio services (Pandora?) through the sound system.

Up until now, to listen to mp3's and WMA's on the sound system I've just been hooking up the headphone output on my Sansa mp3 player to an analog input on my Anthem processor.  It sounds pretty good, but I suspect I could be doing much better.

Since I'm a computer novice, I'd like something that's easy to set up and use, has great sound quality, and will play files at their native resolution without having to change settings each time the resolution changes.

I've been doing a bit of reading and think I've found two devices in my ~$200 budget that may do what I want.  I'm certainly open to other suggestions as well.  The first is the HRT Music Streamer II USB DAC.  The other is the M2Tech hiFace USB-S/SPDIF converter.  The maker of my Pre/Pro, Anthem, suggested the hiFace since it would eliminate and extra A-D step my processor would perform on the HRTs analog signal for bass management.  It appears that the digital inputs on my Anthem can accept up to 24bit/192khz (given its age, I'm surprised by this and wonder if this is correct).

Perhaps I may be getting in over my head with this one, but it appears that you can download multichannel DTS or DD music (my processor can decode DTS and DD).  Would the hiFace allow me to bitstream DTS/DD to my processor?

So am I on the right track here?  Any help and suggestions are greatly appreciated.

[Vincent Kars]

As your amp has a digital in (SPDIF) and your budget is limited, a USB to SPDIF converter is a good solution. Saves you a DAC.
Standard Win driver allow for DTS pass through.
If you don’t meddle with the bits at the PC side, it will probably play fine.

[Saturn94]

61 views, no responses.

Oh well, I'll take this as a sign not to make any decisions yet.

Edit:  Ooops.  That post wasn't there when I last posted.

Thanks Vincent.

[toddbagwell]

I'll agree that a USB to spdif converter is the easiest way to connect your equipment and stay within your budget.

Play around with different file types, levels of compression and different player software to determine if you find a certain preference or synergy with your equipment. For example, some people don't use any form of compression (either aiff or wav) because it sounds better to them. Other people use flac or apple lossless compression. Most on this site will tell you to avoid lossy compressed files on your main stereo if possible.

The last thing to decide what to use is the player, foobar is very customizable, but less easy to setup if you don't feel comfortable with computer audio. Itunes will work with windows, but lacks certaintweaks.

Play around with things , post when you have questions, have fun, but give some of us time to get back to you:)

Todd

[Saturn94]

I'll agree that a USB to spdif converter is the easiest way to connect your equipment and stay within your budget.

Play around with different file types, levels of compression and different player software to determine if you find a certain preference or synergy with your equipment. For example, some people don't use any form of compression (either aiff or wav) because it sounds better to them. Other people use flac or apple lossless compression. Most on this site will tell you to avoid lossy compressed files on your main stereo if possible.

The last thing to decide what to use is the player, foobar is very customizable, but less easy to setup if you don't feel comfortable with computer audio. Itunes will work with windows, but lacks certaintweaks.

Play around with things , post when you have questions, have fun, but give some of us time to get back to you:)

Todd

Thanks Todd.  My appologies for my impatience.

What do you think of the M2Tech hiFace?  Are there other options you would recommend?

Last night I came across this forum discussing a problem with the hiFace. 

www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/503323/hiface-sensitive-information

Apparently, sometime early last year M2Tech changed the clocks and there were complaints of degraded sound quality.  There are also reports that M2Tech later in the year switched back to the original clocks.  If I go with the hiFace, I'd like to know how I can assure I get one of the "good ones".

I've not had much of a chance to play with Foobar, but it doesn't look as user friendly as Windows Media Player.  I do like that Foobar boots and accesses files more quickly than WMP (at least on my computer).  I'll have to play around with it to get more familiar with it.

Speaking of my computer, does it look like to you that it would be up to the task of playing hi rez files (up to 24bit/192khz)?

Thanks again.  I appreciate all the help and advice I can get.

[eclein]

Saturn94- I used to use itunes, Win Media Player, Media Monkey, Foobar, and a bunch of others that didn't make it into my old retired memory banks. Then on a recommendation by others here I tried the 30 day trial of J.River Media Center, it has a very easy to use interface but also has vastly adjustable and feature rich back office stuff going on like WASAPI which bypasses the windows audio drivers I believe-whatever it does technically it blew away all the others and I had just purchased Media Monkey Gold when I tried it, if you like it its like $50 after the 30 days....just keep it in mind if you don't want to try right away, you may find as I did, it just sounds so much better. Good luck...

[Saturn94]

Saturn94- I used to use itunes, Win Media Player, Media Monkey, Foobar, and a bunch of others that didn't make it into my old retired memory banks. Then on a recommendation by others here I tried the 30 day trial of J.River Media Center, it has a very easy to use interface but also has vastly adjustable and feature rich back office stuff going on like WASAPI which bypasses the windows audio drivers I believe-whatever it does technically it blew away all the others and I had just purchased Media Monkey Gold when I tried it, if you like it its like $50 after the 30 days....just keep it in mind if you don't want to try right away, you may find as I did, it just sounds so much better. Good luck...

Thanks for the tip.

[Saturn94]

I figured I would ask this here instead of starting new thread.....

Typically my laptop will sit about 10-15ft from my DAC/processor.  In terms of cable lengths, which of the following setups would be best;

1.  Short USB cable, long RCA coax
2.  Long USB cable, short RCA coax
3.  Equal cable lengths
4.  Doesn't matter

Does the answer change depending on whether I'm using a USB DAC such as the HRT Music Streamer II or a USB-S/PDIF converter like the M2Tech hiFace?

Thanks.

[toddbagwell]

I'm not going to be much help with USB to S/Pdif converters, I don't use one in my setup. I've seen several posts about Musical Fidelity's V-Link, which might work for you and your budget. As anthem suggested, I'd try to get a digital signal into the processor, just to avoid the extra A/D/A conversion.

As to the Cable length question, I'd be careful about trying to get USB cables much longer than 15ft, as that is the limit of what the USB specification allows for... (yes longer active cables exist, but for keeping things simple to get started let's assume they don't exist)

With that caveat, I'd just use whatever cables you might already have around the house to get things setup and running, and down the road you can adjust and see if you hear a difference.

Will the laptop sit with you, or will you use something else like a phone to control the music? If the laptop will be moving with you every time you get up and down, I'd make sure the cables are long enough to avoid any unwanted tugs and yanks on the rest of the equipment.

have fun!
todd

[Saturn94]

Thank you, Todd.

I'm not going to be much help with USB to S/Pdif converters, I don't use one in my setup. I've seen several posts about Musical Fidelity's V-Link, which might work for you and your budget. As anthem suggested, I'd try to get a digital signal into the processor, just to avoid the extra A/D/A conversion.

Yeah, I'm kind of leaning in that direction, hence my interest in a USB-S/PDIF converter.  Also, and this may be a completely wrong assumption, but I'm thinking on my limited budget I might get more audio quality for my money since an S/PDIF converter doesn't have to include DACs and an analog output section.

As to the Cable length question, I'd be careful about trying to get USB cables much longer than 15ft, as that is the limit of what the USB specification allows for... (yes longer active cables exist, but for keeping things simple to get started let's assume they don't exist)

With that caveat, I'd just use whatever cables you might already have around the house to get things setup and running, and down the road you can adjust and see if you hear a difference.

I'm not much of a computer geek, so I don't have any USB cables/extenders.  I'll have to purchase one once I figure out what I need.  I do have extra audio cables, so I may not need to purchase those, at least not at first.  So do you think it's the safer bet to keep the USB cable shorter rather than the audio cable?

Will the laptop sit with you, or will you use something else like a phone to control the music? If the laptop will be moving with you every time you get up and down, I'd make sure the cables are long enough to avoid any unwanted tugs and yanks on the rest of the equipment.

The laptop will sit with me.  No "high tech" phone for me.  I still use my original 1st gen Razor phone I got when I first got cell service.

have fun!
todd

Thanks.  Sometimes I need the reminder this is suppose to be fun and not a chore.

[HAL]

Foobar2000 with the Kernel Streaming or WASAPI component plug-ins for Vista or Windows 7 have worked very well with the M2Tech HiFace and Evo that I have used.  No problem playing any rates up to 24bit/192KHz with either unit. 

Just for reference all my digital files are either WAV or FLAC files.   This includes the Reference Recording HRx WAV files they sell.

Good luck with the search.  It has been very good on my setup.

[Saturn94]

Foobar2000 with the Kernel Streaming or WASAPI component plug-ins for Vista or Windows 7 have worked very well with the M2Tech HiFace and Evo that I have used.  No problem playing any rates up to 24bit/192KHz with either unit. 

Just for reference all my digital files are either WAV or FLAC files.   This includes the Reference Recording HRx WAV files they sell.

Good luck with the search.  It has been very good on my setup.

Thanks Hal.  I appreciate you sharing your experience.

I do have a couple more question for anyone.

I'm guessing that when I set the USB converter as my audio device, that the built in laptop computer speakers will not work.  Is that right?  If so, does that mean when I don't have the computer connected to the USB converter (I'll only have it connected when I want to hear music through my main audio system) I'll need to manually change the audio device back to the computer's built in soundcard to hear anything through the computer's built in speakers?

Also, in my original post I mentioned some information about my laptop computer;

...I also have an HP laptop I bought about 4 years ago (1.6ghz AMD Turion 64x2 dual core processor, 2g RAM, Windows Vista service pack 2).  I mostly use Windows Media Player 11, but recently downloaded Foobar....

Does it look like my computer is up to the task?  Does my computer have a sufficient processor and memory to use a device such as the hiFace?  If it matters, I found my Anthem processor's digital inputs only accept up to 24bit/96khz, so that's the highest my computer would be set to.

Thanks again.

[HAL]

I leave the normal soundcard settings on the PC and just mute it when using it as a Music Server.  It would still play program sounds if not muted via the PC speakers.

I setup Foobar2000 to use the USB audio device via KS or WASAPI and it works well.

[avta]

you might consider a Squeezebox Touch. This is the newest iteration of the Squeezebox now made by Logitech. It's a very unique product in my view. It allows you to play music files of all sorts up to 24/96 resolution either wired using an ethernet cable or in wireless mode. It would connect your computer to a digital input of a dac or by connecting it's analog output via rca connectors to your preamp or amp ( it has it's own digital volume control ) as it has it's own internal dac which is of very good quality. Free software is available from Logitech. In addition the Touch allows you to access internet stations allowing one to listen to an almost unlimited number of music and information stations. I have owned and enjoyed almost all versions of the Squeezebox and currently have a Touch. By the way I have no connection with the company.

[toddbagwell]

Does it look like my computer is up to the task?  Does my computer have a sufficient processor and memory to use a device such as the hiFace?  If it matters, I found my Anthem processor's digital inputs only accept up to 24bit/96khz, so that's the highest my computer would be set to.

Thanks again.

I'd say yes, it should work. You'll want to pay attention to what else is running while listening to music, if you notice things not working (slow, stuttering, other things) look at the task manager and stop whatever programs which are using too many resources.

I've been running an AMD Athlon 3800 X2 on my music computer, and with cd and hirez files it rarely hits 10% CPU load, most often it is ~5%.


todd

[Saturn94]

HAL - Thanks again for sharing your experience.  It's very helpful should I choose the hiFace.

avta - Thank you for the suggestion.  I'll take a look at that.

Todd - Thank you again for your help.

 

[HAL]

Todd,
I use an ASUS Netbook with an Atom processor and Windows 7 and it works well as a music server with my setup.

[TF1216]

This link shows nearly all options for USB to SPDIF converters.
http://thewelltemperedcomputer.com/HW/USB_SPDIF.htm

[Saturn94]

This link shows nearly all options for USB to SPDIF converters.
http://thewelltemperedcomputer.com/HW/USB_SPDIF.htm

Great link.  Thanks.

[avta]

just saw this  "Touch for $230 + free shipping @ Crutchfield "