burglery!

coke · « **Reply #20 on:** 6 Dec 2010, 05:01 pm »

Google Castle Doctrine if you're not familar with it. Here's a summary for my state.

"HB 2615 simply states that if a criminal breaks into your home, your occupied vehicle or your place of business, you may presume he is there to do bodily harm and you may use any force necessary against him. It also removes the "duty to retreat" if you are attacked in any place you have a legal right to be.

Further, HB 2615 provides protection from criminal prosecution and civil litigation for those who defend themselves from criminal attack. The "Castle Doctrine" bill met with overwhelming, bipartisan support, passing 96-2 in the state House and 83-4 in the Senate. Oklahoma joins eight other states that have signed similar legislation into law this legislative cycle."

satfrat · « **Reply #21 on:** 6 Dec 2010, 05:46 pm »

Quote from: Phil A on 6 Dec 2010, 01:08 am

It's a real shame. It happens everywhere. I can understand someone who is hungry stealing food but beyond that it is out-of-hand.

It's just a wild guess here up I would think the person(s) who went after this high end system wasn't J. Wellington Wimpy whose sole purpose there was to obtain a free hamburger.

I doubt they even bothered looking into the fridge.

The 2nd time I got broke in and had my home ransacked, the meatballs took a half drank fifth of Seagrams 7 that was sitting on the counter yet left behind a fresh half gallon of Crown Royal (an X-mas present to me from me

) that was sitting on the top shelf of my fridge. That alone told me two things, they weren't there trying to find something to eat,,,, and they had no class.

Yet they had enough time to cut most every AC cord on the house along with knifing the furniture & curtains and irinating on the carpet.

Yes, I stand by my 1st post, unless I'm given the opportunity to have some time with them alone, face to face,, then they can keep their wrist (for all the good it'll do them). I never did find out who broke into my home both times, neither did the cops, and none of my possessions where ever recovered. I hope this story has a happier ending,,, but don't bet on it.

Crime does infact pay the majority of the time in this country, even if you're caught. Seems you're apt to spend more time in jail for drugs than you are for B&E. Stop slapping these SOB's on the wrist when they're finally caught and take them off! It's not a logical solution in a civilized world but it sure as hell would nip the problem in the bud,,, I mean wrist.

Cheers,
Robin

sts9fan · « **Reply #22 on:** 6 Dec 2010, 05:56 pm »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LrLLdNuOESk

nonoise · « **Reply #23 on:** 6 Dec 2010, 06:08 pm »

Sounds like high end burglary and probably has nothing to do with drug users. It was stated that other high end stuff was taken so they were probably cased for some time. I'd look for other high end burglaries in the area and hopefully the police have the same sense to do so.
These guys aren't amateurs.
On another note, if the victim lives in a nice, upscale neighborhood, it could also be someone's kids who live a block or two away. Again, the police should know if there were similar acts in the immediate area.

thunderbrick · « **Reply #24 on:** 6 Dec 2010, 06:11 pm »

Quote from: coke on 6 Dec 2010, 05:01 pm

Google Castle Doctrine if you're not familar with it. Here's a summary for my state.

"HB 2615 simply states that if a criminal breaks into your home, your occupied vehicle or your place of business, you may presume he is there to do bodily harm and you may use any force necessary against him. It also removes the "duty to retreat" if you are attacked in any place you have a legal right to be.

Further, HB 2615 provides protection from criminal prosecution and civil litigation for those who defend themselves from criminal attack. The "Castle Doctrine" bill met with overwhelming, bipartisan support, passing 96-2 in the state House and 83-4 in the Senate. Oklahoma joins eight other states that have signed similar legislation into law this legislative cycle."

But it doesn't protect you from civil suit.

satfrat · « **Reply #25 on:** 6 Dec 2010, 06:28 pm »

Quote from: sts9fan on 6 Dec 2010, 05:56 pm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LrLLdNuOESk

, but at the time it wasn't so funny. Go figure,,,,

sts9fan · « **Reply #26 on:** 6 Dec 2010, 06:40 pm »

I bet it sucked!

Phil A · « **Reply #27 on:** 6 Dec 2010, 06:51 pm »

Quote from: thunderbrick on 6 Dec 2010, 06:11 pm

But it doesn't protect you from civil suit.

Here's some add'l info - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castle_doctrine

thunderbrick · « **Reply #28 on:** 6 Dec 2010, 07:21 pm »

What about the DSAF Doctrine?

Phil A · « **Reply #29 on:** 6 Dec 2010, 07:58 pm »

Quote from: thunderbrick on 6 Dec 2010, 07:21 pm

What about the DSAF Doctrine?

Not sure what that is. The Castle Doctrine has passed the House in VA (where I live) but did not make it through the Senate earlier this year. The debate essentially is that someone who is a victim should not have to guess what the intent of someone breaking into their house or whether or not they are armed. Other than a pellet gun, I don't have a gun permit at the moment. I do use the alarm and the couple of times it went off by accident over the many years, the local law enforcement response was generally not terribly long.

Many years ago in another house, I thought someone was breaking it. I'd hear banging like the back door was being kicked it. It did turn out to be a helium balloon that made its way upstairs in a split level to the bedroom and was hitting against a ceiling fan and then would settle around the bed for a couple of minutes before going back up and making the break in noise again. I did have a nice bar from a weight set to handle whatever the problem was and if it turned out to be a real problem, I don't think I'd hesitate to ask what someone's intentions are.

I think that someone hit the nail on the head earlier that there isn't enough penalty enforced in many cases. I'd expect given the current climate, we will see more Castle Doctrine and more citizens taking action in their homes. I really don't have a problem with what someone does to someone who breaks into their house and I don't think someone should have to dig into their pockets to defend themselves in a civil suit for ensuring their own safety vs. a law breaker with unknown intentions.

Tyson · « **Reply #30 on:** 6 Dec 2010, 08:21 pm »

I agree that more people are having to defend themselves in their home, which I'm OK with. I just think it sucks that it's come down to that. I mean, keeping people safe in their homes, isn't this why we have police and a criminal justice system in the first place?

sts9fan · « **Reply #31 on:** 6 Dec 2010, 08:30 pm »

Quote

more people are having to defend themselves in their home

is this true?

Phil A · « **Reply #32 on:** 6 Dec 2010, 08:32 pm »

Quote from: sts9fan on 6 Dec 2010, 08:30 pm

is this true?

You would have to look at stats - such as - http://www2.fbi.gov/ucr/cius2009/offenses/property_crime/burglary.html

Phil A · « **Reply #33 on:** 6 Dec 2010, 08:39 pm »

Quote from: Tyson on 6 Dec 2010, 08:21 pm

I just think it sucks that it's come down to that. I mean, keeping people safe in their homes, isn't this why we have police and a criminal justice system in the first place?

I totally agree with the above. Unfortunately, the real world, any system of Government is not perfect. For example, I don't know how many of you remember the sniper shootings here in the DC area from several years back. Here in Virginia, we have elected local Sheriffs. Many are not law enforcement officials but instead are politicians looking to enhance their careers above all else. I wonder how many people got shot over in-fighting about jurisdiction for some politician seeing it as a career enhancing move. I'm not picking on law enforcement. Here, we also have elected tax commissioners too. Many are not professionals with an understanding of the business community and where there are holes in the system. They are politicians as well and it doesn't in all cases serve the public interest. It is not unique here, there are local prosecutors, judges, etc., who obtain their living and career potential from items that don't always go in the best interest of the general public.

sts9fan · « **Reply #34 on:** 6 Dec 2010, 08:44 pm »

So nationally it was down 1.3% and in my state over 5% from 2008-2009.

Randy · « **Reply #35 on:** 8 Dec 2010, 12:17 am »

How about when someone you thought was a friend stays at your house and steals three boxes of collectibles from you, items I' d had since childhood, 60 or 70 English tin soldiers 1950s vintage, a stack of genuine Confederate money in a box with various old coins and stamps, and an old tin box I'd gotten from my grandfather. All the latter had in it was family papers and letters. The guy just grabbed the box thinking something of value might be in it, checked later and probably ended up throwing all of it out. I didn't miss any of it until weeks later, something he was counting on,no doubt, but I know who it was.

david12 · « **Reply #36 on:** 8 Dec 2010, 08:55 am »

Quote from: nonoise on 6 Dec 2010, 06:08 pm

Sounds like high end burglary and probably has nothing to do with drug users. It was stated that other high end stuff was taken so they were probably cased for some time. I'd look for other high end burglaries in the area and hopefully the police have the same sense to do so.
These guys aren't amateurs.
On another note, if the victim lives in a nice, upscale neighborhood, it could also be someone's kids who live a block or two away. Again, the police should know if there were similar acts in the immediate area.

I agree, when I have heard about friends who have been burgled, the HIFi is immune. They walk straight past the $30000 system and steal the TV and other appliances.
There is a logic to this. If you are'nt a profesional, but Drug user, you go straight to a bar and offer the TV for sale. That would'nt work for a HiFi system. you want easily saleable items, regardless of value.
As for punishment, the US locks up more people than most other societies, I am not aware you have less crime. There is a discussion about crime and Jail time in the UK at the moment. Our Conservative(Republican) minister for justice, wants to lock up less peolpe, mainly because it is so costly. The only virtue of prison I can see, is people can'nt commit crimes while they are there. They do the day they leave of course.
The whole issue of guns is a thorny one. A UK tourist knocked on someones door to ask directions in the US a few years ago and the frightened home owner shot him dead on the doorstep. Frightened people do illogical things.

guest1632 · « **Reply #37 on:** 11 Dec 2010, 05:36 am »

Quote from: rollo on 6 Dec 2010, 07:56 pm

It sucks. we were broken into as well while sleeping. They didn't get much. Lucky for us.
Today if they get passed our Shepard they will face the shotgun.

charles

In the mid .70's I owned a Mac MA6100 Integrated amp, and a mR74 tuner, along with a pair of ML1C speakers. Now the mac speakers frankly compared to today's standards were not nearly as good. but They also took my Thorns TD16C table. They left the speakers. No wonder, those beasties weighed in about 50 pounds each. It actually happened to me twice. The first time the amp and Tuner were taken. They both were recovered. The second time this happened, I was taking a nap in the next room. my roommate came home and woke me up, "Ray! you've been ripped off." Yeah, right. This time both amp tuner, and table were gone. they left the Stax phones and speakers. I actually had two tables at the time, the other being the Conneseurtable and arm. So I do know what it's like to be violated. no fun at all.

The first time, I found out who was the crook. He walked. I don't know why. The second time, the stuff was never retreived. I did not have home insurance.

Ray

skunark · « **Reply #38 on:** 11 Dec 2010, 06:22 am »

They really had some time to clean your customer out. Most folks don't even have a clue on what this stuff costs and would have expected the cables to be left behind or perhaps they just took the entire rack...

I agree with the other poster, they probably did case the house. I've always been concerned about registering products, paying with a check at the local dealer or even posting your system on websites that record your IP address (i.e. audiocircle).

david12 · « **Reply #39 on:** 14 Dec 2010, 05:15 pm »

The laws in the UK are much tougher on the homeowner. You have to use force proportional to the risk you face. So, if someone tries to punch you and you stab him, that is'nt proportionate and the police will charge you.

In a well known case 15 years ago or so, a farmer had been burgled several times, attacked 2 burglers with a shotgun, killing one. He got life imprisonment, as far as I remember, because it was felt by the jury, that he had persued and shot his victim in the back. If you face a threat in your home, you not only have to worry how to defend yourself, but what level of response is appropriate, not easy in the heat of the moment, when you are afraid. One advantage we do have, is that very few burglars will have a firearm, as they are only available under very stringent rules. I could not get a pistol or rifle, a shotgun would be easier.

burglery!

guest1632