burglery!

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Ray Bronk

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Re: burglery!
« Reply #40 on: 14 Dec 2010, 05:47 pm »
The laws in the UK are much tougher on the homeowner. You have to use force proportional to the risk you face. So, if someone tries to punch you and you stab him, that is'nt proportionate and the police will charge you.

  In a well known case 15 years ago or so, a farmer had been burgled several times, attacked 2 burglers with a shotgun, killing one. He got life imprisonment, as far as I remember, because it was felt by the jury, that he had persued and shot his victim in the back. If you face a threat in your home, you not only have to worry how to defend yourself, but what level of response is appropriate, not easy in the heat of the moment, when you are afraid. One advantage we do have, is that very few burglars will have a firearm, as they are only available under very stringent rules. I could not get a pistol or rifle, a shotgun would be easier.

Well, pardon me, that just plain stupidity. If you have been robbed over and over again, and you somehow manage to catch the SOB, just happen to injore or kill theperson committing the crime,   then that's defending your castle. But somehow, I don't understand how a jury would convict someone for defending his house. Now if a burgler is running away, and you don't chase him, how are you gonna catch him? Well, that's slightly off topic, and I'll leave that one alone for now. Don't want to think about that, because it will just piss me off. At least here in Arizona, (one of the States here in the US) someone is robbing your home, you take action, and ask questions later.

Ray Bronk

srb

Re: burglAry!
« Reply #41 on: 14 Dec 2010, 06:02 pm »
Sometimes laws protect criminals when common sense tells you they shouldn't.  Twenty five years ago there was a case, Bodine vs Enterprise High School, where the burglAr (who commited attempted burglAry) fell through a school roof skylight in an apparent attempt to steal some floodlights.  Badly injuring himself, he sued for $8 million and settled for $260,000 + $1200/mo. for life.
 
His story was that he and his friends were playing basketball and were trying to redirect the lights.  But I suppose any burglar could say they were walking past a home or business, tripped and fell through a window.
 
Steve

Bill O'Connell

Re: burglery!
« Reply #42 on: 14 Dec 2010, 06:07 pm »
Our local news in Chicago.
 A guy goes into a tanning salon, sees the cash register girl tied up, sees a guy with a gun ,talks to him and tells the guy he has more money then what is in the cash register, take that and just leave. The guy isn't there for money, had the expression on his face that he could of cared less about cash, the guy bends down for the rope to tie up the guy who just walked in,the guy who just walked in is only thinking about how he can get back home to his 15 month old daughter and her possibly being without a father for the rest of her life.  When the guy bends down for the rope the guy struggles with the armed man and somehow manages to disarm him and shoots him in the stomach. The robber dies. turns out the gun used matches up with the gun that was used 2 months earlier in the killing of ( I believe another couple and a lone farmer) for no apparent reason. The killings were called  The honeybee murders or something like that.

 This guy just did what he was suppose to do, and saved the young girl's life because this mudering creep surely was going to just kill this sales girl.
 A perfect example of true justice. :thumb:
 Just thought you would all like to hear. this uplifting story.

 I'll try and post a link in a bit.

 Here is the link. Enjoy :thumb:

http://www.chicagobreakingnews.com/2010/12/sources-gun-in-tanning-salon-robbery-used-in-honeybee-shootings.html

Ray Bronk

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Re: burglery!
« Reply #43 on: 14 Dec 2010, 06:26 pm »
Our local news in Chicago.
 A guy goes into a tanning salon, sees the cash register girl tied up, sees a guy with a gun ,talks to him and tells the guy he has more money then what is in the cash register, take that and just leave. The guy isn't there for money, had the expression on his face that he could of cared less about cash, the guy bends down for the rope to tie up the guy who just walked in,the guy who just walked in is only thinking about how he can get back home to his 15 month old daughter and her possibly being without a father for the rest of her life.  When the guy bends down for the rope the guy struggles with the armed man and somehow manages to disarm him and shoots him in the stomach. The robber dies. turns out the gun used matches up with the gun that was used 2 months earlier in the killing of ( I believe another couple and a lone farmer) for no apparent reason. The killings were called  The honeybee murders or something like that.

 This guy just did what he was suppose to do, and saved the young girl's life because this mudering creep surely was going to just kill this sales girl.
 A perfect example of true justice. :thumb:
 Just thought you would all like to hear. this uplifting story.

 I'll try and post a link in a bit.

 Here is the link. Enjoy :thumb:

http://www.chicagobreakingnews.com/2010/12/sources-gun-in-tanning-salon-robbery-used-in-honeybee-shootings.html

Yep, that is how it should be. Well, Bill you have excellent products, to go along with an excellent story.

Ray Bronk

nonoise

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Re: burglAry!
« Reply #44 on: 14 Dec 2010, 07:32 pm »
Sometimes laws protect criminals when common sense tells you they shouldn't.  Twenty five years ago there was a case, Bodine vs Enterprise High School, where the burglAr (who commited attempted burglAry) fell through a school roof skylight in an apparent attempt to steal some floodlights.  Badly injuring himself, he sued for $8 million and settled for $260,000 + $1200/mo. for life.
 
His story was that he and his friends were playing basketball and were trying to redirect the lights.  But I suppose any burglar could say they were walking past a home or business, tripped and fell through a window.
 
Steve

This is just a variation on the principle of 'what would happen to an innocent..' It all boils down to the reasonableness of a situation (and person) and efforts taken to make it safe. Lets say you've been robbed recently so you lay a trap in the backyard, say a hole with a cover by the back door or you glue some broken glass on the brick fence or your roof/skyline is not sufficiently reinforced. Whatever. Now, say, some kid is going after his ball that went into your yard or on your roof. You get the picture. So does the law. This has been rehashed ad nauseam for millennia and all the talk about a 'man's castle' doesn't add up. Making laws that accommodate  the fringe and phobic amongst us (it seems to be regional) can only lead to some deadly, and  irreversible consequences.

Oh, and don't forget that juries, sometimes, do stupid things. Like the burglar who fell through the skylight, there was a case that involved Bell helmets where the motorcyclist broke his neck and was awarded so much that it almost bankrupted the company. Juries do stupid things. Its no excuse to overcompensate.

david12

Re: burglery!
« Reply #45 on: 15 Dec 2010, 08:45 am »
Well, pardon me, that just plain stupidity. If you have been robbed over and over again, and you somehow manage to catch the SOB, just happen to injore or kill theperson committing the crime,   then that's defending your castle. But somehow, I don't understand how a jury would convict someone for defending his house. Now if a burgler is running away, and you don't chase him, how are you gonna catch him? Well, that's slightly off topic, and I'll leave that one alone for now. Don't want to think about that, because it will just piss me off. At least here in Arizona, (one of the States here in the US) someone is robbing your home, you take action, and ask questions later.

Ray Bronk
   Not saying I am agreeing with it, that's just the way it is. I am comforted though, by the stupidity of most criminals. There was a wonderful book published here called "The book of heroic failures", listing really dumb things people do;

  Car thief not only tried to steal a police car, but with 2 cops sitting in it at the time!

  Burglar in a stately home, hid in a a suit of armour till the home closed. Then started clanking around the house, in the armour!

  Cat burglar trying to break into a factory in winter. He could'nt get through the roof skilght, so threw all his clothes through it, it squeeze through. He still could'nt get in so he was on a factory roof in winter, stark naked.

  Recently, a bank robber filled out an account application with his real name and address, whilst casing the bank and was suprised to find the police waiting for him, when he got home with the loot.

  No, want can'nt underestimate the depth of stupidity of the average criminal mind.

Daedalus Audio

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Rob S.

Re: burglery!
« Reply #47 on: 15 Dec 2010, 05:24 pm »
Anyone know what the victim can recover from his homeowners insurance?  I wonder what the limits are for electronics?   Anybody here buy additional coverage or a special "rider" for their system?

Rob S.

Rob S.

Re: burglery!
« Reply #48 on: 17 Dec 2010, 03:13 pm »

Marco Prozzo

Re: burglery!
« Reply #49 on: 27 Mar 2011, 06:42 pm »
Interesting topic that caught my eye because I was just thinking I ought to check with my insurance company to make sure I'm covered for my system.  Has anyone actually had to make a claim for high-end, high-value items that are covered on a renters or homeowners policy?  Regarding the use of lethal force:  Anyone who protects their home with a firearm, or carries one with or without a permit, should take the time to read some of the articles and books by Massaad Ayoob. His book, In the Gravest Extreme, is mandatory reading for anyone who owns a gun in the United States.