[albee]

Tube designers had better embrace these little IC's tomorrow for the future has done caught up with them!

I just got my Griffin PowerWave  and after listening for three hours I am still slack-jawed at what I'm hearing:  a good EL 34 amp with balls.

Despite the cheesy connectors and such, this little $100 miracle gives you 85 to 90 percent of a good tube amp.  The detail, focus, speed, and imaging may not be the Nth degree like good tube designs but it is CLOSE.  More importantly, the PowerWave has an astonishing tube-like palpablity not heard out of most solid state designs.  And, this I'm saying about a cheese box that NEVER gets warm (except for that annoying blue light on top.)

I run a real cheapskate's two-channel rig.  Using a 2 watt SET, Klipsch RB5's, and Mapleshade connects and cables--it  sounds far better than the retail price.  Now, with the PowerWave, I cannot see a reason to look at tube equipment any further.  I have all the power my 92db, 8 ohm speakers need.  The RB5's are kicking out more bass than the SET and my old Acurus DIA--for real!  (I was concerned where the bass was going to come from when I plucked it out of the box.)

I'm a convert and now waiting for top designers to give us affordable designs that surpass the 90% mark.  It will be done.  Who will be first?

[Rob Babcock]

That blue light is a pain in the ass.  My first mod of that thing should be to disconnect the friggin bulb/LED.

The bass is shocking- it's the first thing that blew me away.  I'm not using my Griffin as a 'home amp' yet, it's hooked up to my PC running a pair of bookshelf speakers that I used to use in my 2nd system.  Back when I used them for music/lite HT, I was running them with a 100 wpc rec.  But they actually have better bass with the little PowerWave.  How can that be!?  The thing feels completely flimsy and cheap, but it sure rocks.

I'm thinking about getting a second on and trying them to biwire my main speakers.  Or maybe I'll skip it and get a "big boy" TriPath instead.

[vpolineni]

the prospeaker breakout cable looks really crappy... how are you guys connecting spades to it?  that's what is preventing me from buying it and trying to bi-amp it with my speakers.

[Zero]

Running good ole fashioned Bare-wire....    the way the Audio Gods intended..

[Mathew_M]

The tripath does have a tubey sound which surprises me.  I don't hear the same out of my Panny XR25 which is just as detailed but more solid state sounding.  It might be more of a single driver vs. ribbons difference.

Has anyone paired a tubed dac or pre to the Griffin?  Does it fully flesh out the tube sound?

[albee]

Mathew:  that was my next question.  How do the current crop of larger, more powerful receivers sound.  Guess, I'll just wait around and see how long it takes for somebody-besides Flying Mole-to come out with a more audiophile-oriented product.

Can anybody share listening impressions of the Sharps?

[Bwanagreg]

Matthew, I've been listening to my tubed RAM CD player through the Pwave, and it does sound even better with upstream tubes. My solid state point of comparison is the DAC in my NAD 752 receiver, which has a very musical sound. Fact is, until I plugged in the Pwave I heard little difference between the NAD and the RAM (using my cheapo AMC el-34 amp). With the Pwave the RAM sounds noticeably better than the NAD. Unfortunately, I like the bass management features in the NAD - I have to run my Omegas full-range when using the RAM, so there is a tradeoff.

I'm running Mapleshades, too. Great combination all the way around.

I agree that for me tubes are dead. Now, who can we find to mod this little sucker to get more out of it (better speaker connections, better power supply,  upgraded analgue components, new case? ...). I might try the Scott-Nixon 12V power supply. Any other ideas?

[Mathew_M]

I wouldn't go as far as to say tubes are dead but it does have me 2nd guessing them.  With the tripath we're getting closer.

[Dmason]

I am using the PowerWave right now with a Joule Electra LA150 MkIII tube pre-amp, which is a stunningly musical design, and very well known to be so, and much sought after. I sold it to a colleague who is on deployment, so I am babysitting it. As to the question posed above: I want it back now.

I can tell you that  as far as I am concerned, these newer generation Tripath amp drivers are way out in front sonically, in contrast to the older ones found in the ZR1000 which was built 2-3 years ago. They have really improved on things. Second, the PW will reflect the quality of signal you give it, and sounds better than it should even with a crappy source. Right now it is being fed the output of a Sony DVP7700, Nixon DACkit, and the Joule Electra. I have it powered by an ultra high grade PSU which is waaay overkill, but was a "gift." This thing complements the aformentioned components, and is in no way out of place in this rig.

I have decided I prefer the sound of the PowerWave to the ZR muscle amp, and have concluded that this preference is a reflection of engineering progress being made at  Tripath.

As far as using the PW with a tube pre: it gives you the best of ALL worlds. Is digital amplification going to kill tubes? No. That would have happened years ago. Solid state didn't. Is anyone noticing that those are a HUGE watts in that little cheesebox?

[Zero]

I only wish I could share the same feelings about the Power Wave.  While this piece of equipment is exceptional, to state its better than good tubes is a tad far fetched.  A little Dynaco ST-35 surely beat out the Power Wave in capturing the emotion of the music.  The NAD is smoother, though more grainy.  

Its a great little unit, but I wouldnt say she is the end-all, be-all.  Ah hell, maybe its because Ive been unable to solve the stupid hiss caused by the power connection *or supply*.

[Bwanagreg]

Just to clarify, I'm not saying it's better than GOOD tubes - it's equal or better than an inexpensive tube amp, and costs much less. The price/performance and hassle/performance ratio is so far in favor of the Tripath (for this humble audiophile) that I will have trouble justifying tube amp purchases for myself in the future. That's why I think tube amps are dead FOR ME. Is a $100 Tripath amp better than an $X000 tube amp? I frankly don't care. I'd rather save for retirement (hell, retire early), send my kids to a better college, and maye upgrade my front-projection system.

Now, when Wayne gets done modifying the amp I just sent to him, we'll see how much of a giant-killer it is, just for kicks.  

[Hantra]

A little Dynaco ST-35 surely beat out the Power Wave in capturing the emotion of the music.

Almost exactly what I was about to say.  

I agree that a good Tripath (ZR) and a great Tripath (Evo2) sound "tubey" and probably if one compared most frequencies side by side, they even look like tubes sound.  The issue here is what tubes have you heard that you are comparing them to.  

Having owned a great Audio Note tube amp, I can say that the Evo2 beats this, even disregarding the extra power.  Having heard the Bel Canto 845 amp, I would say the Tripath has all the flavor and tube sound of that amp with more power.  But. . .   Having listened to a few great 300B's and some Art Audio, I can say that the Tripath stuff does not connect on the same emotional level as these.  OTOH, these are not as transparent, and dead quiet as the Evo.  The solution?  Get a superbly emotional preamp, and pair it with the Evo.  Ahh. . Very nice.  

While the latest Tripath stuff is super impressive, and tubey, it cannot extract as much emotion on its own as can some other amps out there, tubed, and SS.

[Zero]

Out of curiousity, what work does Wayne intend on doing to this little unit? Due to its restricted size, I'd imagine only so much can be done.

I will concur, its value is completely out of this world......    I may order myself a Klipsch DD5.1 pre amplifier and revel on this 200 dollar pre/amp combo.

[Bwanagreg]

Since this will be the first time Wayne has a look at the amp, neither one of us is exactly sure what should or could be done. He might put it in a new case with a new power supply and new RCA and speaker jacks for starters. Then it's a question of what can be done to upgrade the internal components. I would expect the power supply upgrade to be the biggest single improvement.

I think we are all saying roughly the same thing regarding tubes. I still have an emotional attachment to tube technology. What impresses me about the Tripath is that it is the first non-tube amp that I have tried in recent years that I can listen to for long periods of time without missing tubes. For me that is a milestone. I still miss my old VTL amp that died a fiery death - I doubt my wife does though.  

[Dmason]

I believe you! The reason I advocate the Tripath sound is because it REMINDS me of what I like best about tubes, but no, it doesn't quite have that lit-from-within aspect, that "glow," and the reason is only because the lack of tubes means the lack of synthetic generation of even order harmonics. Thus, the Tripath route is more musically accurate, more "natural,"  but still maintains some of the magic, no doubt.

I myself have been a virtual Pentodist Preacher of the Thermionic Gospel since I was about 14 and into Hammond organs and Leslie speakers. My ears are conditioned to tube amps, and this stuff gets the job done without 'em.

The Tripath comes close to what I know in this respect, and at $100, it is as close to a really, really good EL34 amp, (which max out at about 35 watts,)  that many will come, and all without the hassles, expense, heat, and yes, some danger.

 Done right, IMHO, the PW is a fabulous candidate for use with the best single ended tube pre one can justify buying, the Foreplay would be PERFECT, mated with some reasonably high efficiency speakers, preferably full range, and be done. For awhile...

[cjr888]

Curious -- when using a good tube pre -> PWave, how much of that internal glow do you find in the sound vs. say just using a tube amplifier w/volume control?

Interested to hear comparisons with anything..  Just a curiosity.

[Dmason]

You only get two tubes glowing if single ended! tee hee.

The sound you refer to is generated by power tubes so it's chalk and cheese here. The pre amp with tubes gives order to it all, soundstage, separation, attack, decay, sustain, release, --all the sonic delights. It gives the amp a nice hot signal with mo' betta information. I'm not kidding, the PW with the mighty Joule Electra LA150 MkIII is just astonishing, bass from the cellar, and the $150 Foreplay and other less expensive designs would be just as good.

As I mentioned in another thread, the chips in the PW are a couple generations newer than the ones in my big dog amp, and the evolution of the sonics is apparent. These things take 60 days to fully burn in, plenty of time for us to figure out what to give them, starting with a really good aftermarket PSU. shouldn't have to spend more than about $15 for the Atari, or Motorola.

[Rob Babcock]

I'm pretty curious to see what Wayne of Boulder Cables does to the PWave.  Certainly moving it to a slightly larger chassis with room for real binding posts would be nice, as would adding a better PS and nicer input jacks.  I definately wouldn't miss the Blue Light, either.

The big question will be how much it will cost- at the $90 the PW costs, there's room to sink some $ into the amp and still have a pretty cheap unit.  If the mods are reasonable, price wise, then using two of them to biamp a pair of speakers would look pretty attractive.

[albee]

My intial excitement is over the sound/dollar ratio.  Plus, I've never heard a sand amp that I could afford to sound so "tubey".  So far, I have found this this to be musically "involving" which is more than I can say for most transitor devices.

When this thing gets it comeupance, designers will be tuning these things to just what they/you want.  I'm excited.  Think of what this could do for powered speakers.

Yes, I do have a low level hiss from my PW.  I've done what I can to marginalize it except try another power supply.  Fortunately, I'm sure most of us listen well beyond the residual level.     Besides, this thing was initially designed for computer speakers which are notriously inefficient.

I sure want to hear about any modding though!

[Mathew_M]

The real magic kicks in when you turn out the lights, sit back and veg out with the iTunes visualizer at 60fps.   I did this with Sonic Youth's The Diamond Sea last night and it was about as trippy as you can get without pharmaceuticals.  Like tubes, the tripath allows you to see into the music.