V2 Venuette Build Completed

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Tyson

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V2 Venuette Build Completed
« on: 9 Nov 2010, 07:58 pm »
The other thread on my V2 build was getting a bit long in the tooth, so I thought I'd finish it up here and show the build from start to finish. 



I took advantage of the $1k sale price for the V2 kit from Danny this month.  Everything arrived today, it all looks well packed and everything appears OK.  I'll be starting to build the cabinets this afternoon, hopefully will have them done in about a week.




Getting the basic rips and routing done.  This is Chuck, my helper at the woodshop:










Crossovers assembled (but I lost my Zip Ties, so these will be tied down as soon as I find them).  Thanks to PEZ for his help:








Everything on the table:










My daughter Kira helping with assembly!






Open Baffle vs. Closed Box:







Who really is dominant here?







I veneered the front of the V2's with some paper backed Birdseye Maple first, which I obtained from a local lumber yard on close out.  I quickly ran out.  Looking around online I found some raw Birdseye maple veneer for super cheap.  Bought it and did the back.  Paper backed is the way to go.  The raw stuff is really hard to work with.  Translation?  This step took me a long time.

Veneer Sheet of Birdseye Maple:







The glue for the iron on method of attaching the veneer:






Other tools I will be using:







The veneer with the yellow glue applied:






The MDF with the yellow glue applied:







Veneer applied to the front and top:






Veneer applied to the back:









Getting close to being done w/the Birdseye:







Time to build the side panels - here are the 1.5 inch thick Baltic Birch Panels I glued together:







Not enough clamps, so I pre-drilled screw holes on all the corners, glued them together, and then set the screws.  Finally, I put some VERY heavy pots on top of them to act as the "clamps":









After a trip to the wood shop, here are the side panels cut out:







And here they are attached via screws to my speakers:





The build is not yet done, I will sand the sides down, and do a half inch round over on the side panels.  I will also stain them a walnut color, and I have some walnut veneer to put on the side panels as well. 




Roundovers done on the 1.5" thick Baltic Birch side panels.  I actually like the look of the BB edges, so I'll just stain them with Danish Oil next:






Up till now I'd only had the BB side panels screwed on, so now it's time to get them glued.  I was able to clamp and then screw down the panels, then re-clamp again where there was a bit of flex.  There are more clamps in the back that you can't see here.








Quarter Sawn Walnut veneer arrived, and I've cut it to size and glued it on.  I originally tried using a router to trim this, but it didn't work out too well.  My alternate (and successful) method is to trim the veneer by hand with the box cutter and then use the power sander to smooth/flush the edges:






Finished!












I'll update with listening impressions of the finished V2's later.

sl_1800

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Re: V2 Venuette Build Completed
« Reply #1 on: 9 Nov 2010, 08:12 pm »
You did a great job.  I'm looking forward to hearing your listening impressions. 

murphy11

Re: V2 Venuette Build Completed
« Reply #2 on: 9 Nov 2010, 09:15 pm »
I really like the way the colors used in the speakers compliment the walls and furniture - nice job  :thumb:

PDR

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Re: V2 Venuette Build Completed
« Reply #3 on: 9 Nov 2010, 09:23 pm »
Really nice job Tyson!!

Sometimes DIY can be so rewarding when the project turns out looking outstanding.

Added bonus is that you enjoy them so much..... :thumb:


TomS

Re: V2 Venuette Build Completed
« Reply #4 on: 9 Nov 2010, 09:59 pm »
Very nice and thanks for thoroughly documenting the build process!

My first attempts at iron on veneering with non backed material didn't work out too well.  Yours really looks great, so I definitely need to give that approach a go next time.

Tom

jtwrace

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Re: V2 Venuette Build Completed
« Reply #5 on: 9 Nov 2010, 10:03 pm »
Great job!  Now all you need to do is get the fumes out of the house.   :lol:

Cacophonix

Re: V2 Venuette Build Completed
« Reply #6 on: 9 Nov 2010, 10:07 pm »
Very good work on that veneer!

Mind if i ask how you backed the veneer? I've some raw bubinga veneer, but they are a pain to apply, and i'm 100% sure that they'll split big time  :evil:

Bigfish

Re: V2 Venuette Build Completed
« Reply #7 on: 9 Nov 2010, 10:14 pm »
Wow!  The speakers look fantastic and cannot wait for you to read your comments about the sound quality.

Ken

dvenardos

Re: V2 Venuette Build Completed
« Reply #8 on: 9 Nov 2010, 10:33 pm »
Do you pull them out when listening?
They look awfully close to the back walls.

Great job, BTW.  :thumb:

Tyson

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Re: V2 Venuette Build Completed
« Reply #9 on: 9 Nov 2010, 10:48 pm »
Thanks all! 

dvenardos,
I put them a bit further back to fit them in the picture.  Normal listening is with the speakers 40 inches from the back wall.

Cacophonix,
I bought the veneer pre-backed, from here:  http://www.veneersupplies.com/categories/Veneer/Paper__Backed__Veneer/Paper__Backed__Veneer%3A__4%27__x__8%27/


Tyson

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Re: V2 Venuette Build Completed
« Reply #10 on: 9 Nov 2010, 11:13 pm »
Listening Impressions

I listened to the V2 in stages, and there were 3 things done at different times which made the biggest improvements in sound. 

Stock and no side panels

First I just wanted to build the basic MDF box and use the stock crossover just to make sure the speaker wasn't a dog.  No point in building it out with full finish and expensive parts if it basically sucks as a design.  Luckily these speakers were excellent sounding right away.  I listen near field and off axis most of the time, and the OB nature of the bass and mids allowed me to finally get an even distribution of good sound and good bass in my very difficult room.  Also, I'm particularly sensitive to the physical separation of mid and tweeters, so the coax drivers are right up my alley.  They did a ton of things better than any other speaker I've heard in my home.  They are not perfect speakers, and I don't think perfect speakers exist anywhere, but they are excellent and among the best I've ever heard, even at this early stage.

Upgrading the Crossover
The first significant change I made was to bypass the Sonicap Gen I's in the crosssover with Sonicap Platinums.  It took a while for them to burn in, but the sound was a pretty large leap in quality.  I liked the Platinums so much that I bought more of them to bypass the output caps on my tube amp.  I liked THOSE so much that I bought another pair to use as the input caps on the amp.  Very, very nice caps!

Reticulated Foam Tweak
I started another thread on this, but the speakers were a bit bright for my tastes, and I stuffed a lot of reticulated foam in the tweeter throat to damp it down.  It work, the highs softened.  But, as I put in the Platinum caps and also started to attach the Baltic Birch Side panels, the highs and mids became better balanced.  I ended up with about half the quantity of foam I started out with.  Just enough to line the tweeter throat without the foam being very compressed.  Most aquarium stores will have cheap foam that is used as filters in fish tanks, and it's perfect for this.

Attaching the Baltic Birch Side Panels
The final step in my sonic journey was building out some 1.5" baltic birch no-void side panels.  These add a CONSIDERABLE amount of mass and weight to the speakers.  Sonically, their effect was very interesting.  The bass of the V2's was already the best I've ever had in my room, simply by having 4 of those 12" woofers in an open baffle configuration.  The side panels did 2 things with the bass - cleaned it up even more, and made it much more solid.  Where before, the bass was a solid underpinning of the music, now it growls at you.  It's mean.  Music comes through with a lot more attitude. 

Surprisingly, the lower mids also filled in quite a bit, and that allowed me to increase the frequency setting on the bass woofers while decreasing their volume settings.  Net result is that mids are cleaner and more weighty, PERFECT!

While the bass is meaner, the mids and highs are sweeter and nicer.  How can a speaker be mean and sweet at the same time?  I've wondered the same thing about some of the women I've dated.  But there it is.

Conclusion
There are very few areas that the V2's are not excellent-to-world-class in quality.  They sound big.  Bigger than my previous VMPS RM40's did.  They image like crazy.  I love their tonal balance.  Dynamics are excellent.  Placement and ease of setup in a room is outstanding.  Transparency and that sense of "realness" is world class.  If you couldn't already tell, I love these speakers :)


Update on Sound

I did 2 more tweaks to my setup with the V2's.  As I mentioned previously, I had bought Sonicap Platinums to bypass the tweeter caps in the crossovers, and I put a Sonicap Gen 2 cap bypassing the big 20uF midrange cap.  I had also bought a quad of Auri-T caps to do a little comparison.  But, the Platinums were so good, the Auri-T's never came out of the bag. 

Line Level High Pass Filter
After a while, I decided to build a line level high pass filter between my preamp and amp, so that my amp would not get any signals below 60hz.  The .01uf values I had already with the Auri-T's was perfect for this.  Got some male and female RCA's and some extra wire and built them several days ago.  Inserted them in the system and I was.... underwhelmed.  Almost no difference in sound, at least none that I could detect.  Of course, I listen at only moderate levels and my amps are pretty strong, so I guess it's not "that" surprising.

Auri-T Midrange Cap Bypass
Well, I still had an extra 2 Auri-T's and nothing to do with them.  So I figured "what the hell", and soldered them into the V2 crossovers across the 20uF midrange cap.  Now THIS was a nice improvement!  I don't know why it would make this much difference, but in my case it really does clear up the midrange quite a bit, particularly the lower mids.  Even the bass seems cleaner and "faster", probably because of that lower mid/upper bass cleaned presentation.  Of course there's still a long burn in process ahead of me, but right now I'm very happy!

Going Active
OK, I kicked the passive crossovers to the curb and went active with a stock DCX2496.  There's a bit of a drop in response between 10khz and 20khz that a 6db per octave boost on the DCX addressed quite nicely.  There's also a 4 db bump between 1khz and 2khz that the DCX can dial in a small drop to get the upper mids very smooth indeed.  I also got rid of my SA-1 amps because I just didn't have the space to build a box for them.  They were actually pretty darn good amps.  I ended up getting a Crest CA9, which is 900 watts into the V2 bass load, and I hear no difference in sound quality between it and the SA-1 at all.  Of course, the SA-1 has a built in bass boost to compensate for the OB deep bass roll off of the V2's, but the DCX has a 12db per octave boost I can dial in to deal with it nicely too. 

Going fully OB!!!!
OK, I had some problems with the original V2 tweeters - the shipping company does a poor job with the drivers when they pack/ship them (P. Audio, it's the BM8XCA coax driver).  The problem is that the tweeters are easily damaged in transit.  But, luckily, dealing with Danny is awesome.  He let me upgrade to the V1 tweeters and I have to say that going from the direct radiating tweeters (stock) to the OB V1 tweeters (upgraded) made a HUGE, HUGE difference.  IMHO, the stock tweeters should be kicked to the curb, the OB tweeters make that much of a difference.  I suppose it's the fact that the mids are radiating much more energy into the room than the stock tweeters, while the upgraded V1 tweeters match much the total energy of the OB mids.  Anyway, I'm not sure if Danny will make these a standard option on the V2's, but IMO he should.  They make a giant difference for the better, creating a more cohesive sound from top to bottom.
 
« Last Edit: 22 Feb 2011, 04:52 am by Tyson »

rajacat

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Re: V2 Venuette Build Completed
« Reply #11 on: 9 Nov 2010, 11:45 pm »
Very nice review! :thumb: I really appreciate how you noted your perception of the SQ at the various stages in the build.

 Hmmm....I think OB bass will be the direction I'll be heading if not actually ordering the whole V2s and commencing construction. All thing considered, the V2s aren't a very difficult build when compared to many box designs. I mean some of these line source speakers such as the LS9 could take months to complete as well as requiring a large stock of clamps. I'll be interested in hearing your impressions when you have the direct comparison to the Nathan/Abbeys. I like that you thought that the V2s sounded large because I've recently torn down a wall in my audio area and the room has doubled in size (16'x35') which is the main reason I'm considering new/larger speakers.

Thanks,

Roy

-Roy

Wind Chaser

Re: V2 Venuette Build Completed
« Reply #12 on: 10 Nov 2010, 12:27 am »
Those look beautiful and your DIY skills are enviable. :thumb:

Tyson

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Re: V2 Venuette Build Completed
« Reply #13 on: 10 Nov 2010, 12:37 am »
Thanks!  They are not "quite' finished, the walnut veneer needs another coat of Tung Oil, and a couple of coats of poly to get it to match the glow of the Birdseye Maple.

I also bought some rare earth magnets, which are tiny, and I'll spray paint them brown and attach them on the lower half of the speaker, so I can attach some speaker cloth to cover those big woofs and that ugly No Rez.

Wind Chaser

Re: V2 Venuette Build Completed
« Reply #14 on: 10 Nov 2010, 12:40 am »
I think they look better with out grills. 

Nick77

Re: V2 Venuette Build Completed
« Reply #15 on: 10 Nov 2010, 12:41 am »
Very nice work Tyson, I spent only 5-10 minutes listening to these at LSAF back in the spring. My feelings were they are very easy to listen to and possesed a great sense of authority but with finesse. Very balanced from top to bottom and not needing any extra subwoofer support. You have totally confirmed my first impressions and if I didnt already enjoy my GR speakers i would be looking to purchase a pair of these V2's. Great work!!  :thumb: :thumb:

Tyson

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Re: V2 Venuette Build Completed
« Reply #16 on: 10 Nov 2010, 12:56 am »
Windchaser, the grill will only cover up the foam/woofer part, the rest of the speaker will still be visible.  In fact, if I can finesse it, even the Birdseye maple trim on the sides and bottom will still be visible. 

Nick77,
The crazy thing is that my last speakers were fully phase coherent active DIY speakers with a DEQX, and the V2's are actually much more revealing of recordings that are done out of phase, or upstream equipment that inverts phase.  I'm getting a phase switch added to my preamp to address just this issue.  Most other speakers I've heard (even very good ones) tend to gloss over pretty much anything that's phase related.

rajacat,
OB bass is da bomb!!   I really like that the V2's are very compact yet the sound huge!!  From a swept volume standpoint, they have more air moving capability than my old RM40's.  Of course, for the extreme low end (down to 16hz), you really do need a proper subwoofer.  But anything above that and the V2's handle it with aplomb.  On the other hand, if you really want bass that is in a higher class than ANYTHING else out there, the V1's with the servo subs are the ticket.  The V2's are pretty badass in the bass, but the V1's are holy f'ing sh!t amazing in the bass!

corndog71

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Re: V2 Venuette Build Completed
« Reply #17 on: 10 Nov 2010, 01:43 am »
The V2's are pretty badass in the bass, but the V1's are holy f'ing sh!t amazing in the bass!

That's my goal in the coming months. :wink:

kp93300

Re: V2 Venuette Build Completed
« Reply #18 on: 10 Nov 2010, 05:10 am »
Hi Tyson and Danny,
Thank you for the informative thread.

can you post some pictures of the back portion of  V2. I have placed my order already .

A few questions please :

1)What is the weight of each speaker ?
2) What the thickness of the front and side baffle?
3)Is there any advantage in having the front and side panels  flushed against each other ?I do not intend to have grill ?
4) If the front panel is strong enough, is there any advantage in making the area around the PA speaker more rounded and less surface area ?

Thanks
kp93300

Guy 13

Re: V2 Venuette Build Completed
« Reply #19 on: 10 Nov 2010, 06:51 am »
Hi Tyson.
Nice work, my Vietnamese cabinet maker could not have done any better, well, that's why I fired him.
Your listening impressions are very well written, I wish I could have a wide vocabulary like yours to put in words what I heard with my V2.
The V2 are not perfect, I could say the same for some Wilson speakers that cost 50,000 USD but that are no better than the V2 or V1. I know I've heard them once. Of course, as usual the hotel room acoustic sucks...
I will make some test on my V2 as per Danny's recommendation, because according to what you wrote in your thread, my V2 don't sounds as good as yours.
Have fun and fill your ears of V2 music.
Guy 13.