[Vipers]

Hi Guys,

I've got a 5 month old 4B SST2 and my original plan was always to add another 4B when funds permitted, ie now, to bi-amp my PMC EB1is, soon to be MB2i's, but I've been advised that I'd be better off selling the 4B and getting 2 x 7B SST2's.

So I thought I'd ask the people who know, putting the money I'll loose on the 4B to 1 side for now as I just want the best solution, will 2 x 7B's help the MB2i's to perform better than 2 x 4B's Bi-amped?

Cheers,

[Napalm]

Depends on what your problem is...

So, what is your complaint? Loose, flabby bass? Or smeared / harsh / grainy treble?

Bi-amping can help only the treble.

For more bass control you just need a bigger amp (i.e. which can deliver more instant current).

Nap.

[95Dyna]

With 2 x 4B you partition off a fixed 300 wpc into 8 ohms each for the high and low pass whereas 2 x 7B provides 600 wpc into 8 ohms that can be used dynamically for the entire frequency range.  To me this is preferable due to the higher demands of the low frequencies.  Furthermore driving the MB2i's is a walk in the park for the 7B SST2's.  They won't break a sweat at any spl.

[Vipers]

Thanks for the repies guys, I wouldn't say I have a particular problem at the moment but earlier in the year I had the chance to try 2 x 4B SST2's on my EB's and it really helped to get the best out of the speakers, really seemed to add to the overall richness, particularly in the midrange, hence my keeness to add another amp, and if I'm honest the treble is fine, its in the mid/low that could perhaps be a little richer and tighter.

Looks like 7B's are the way to go then, anyone else had any experience regarding the original post?

[afblaster]

I have experience of this - I use IB1s which were originally powered by a 4B-SST.  Later on I bought another 4B-SST and connected  one amp per channel, bi-amped, but later on bridged them, see this topic :-  http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=72523.0
Having run them bridged for 9 months or so I then bought a pair of 7B-SST2 (incorporating the latest power supply changes) and haven't looked back since. 
The 7Bs are better still than the 4Bs, which you would expect .  The only other change I have made is to change all the cabling - speaker and analog and digital interconnects, for Chord Signatures.  I used to be a cable sceptic - but not any more - imaging and detail to die for, and the system seems so much quicker.
In view of your intention to get the MB2is, my recommendation would be to sell your 4B-SST get 7B-SST2s, which as 95Dyna says will be a walk in the park for them.
AFB

[1oldguy]

If you do go for the 7's I am selling mine as is factory sealed.

Cheers.

[Napalm]

[...]and if I'm honest the treble is fine, its in the mid/low that could perhaps be a little richer and tighter. [...]

7B.

Nap. 

[Vipers]

If you do go for the 7's I am selling mine as is factory sealed.

Cheers.

Interesting, have you got a link to an add, the only problem is that I live in the UK so shipping could be high.

[Vipers]

I have experience of this - I use IB1s which were originally powered by a 4B-SST.  Later on I bought another 4B-SST and connected  one amp per channel, bi-amped, but later on bridged them, see this topic :-  http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=72523.0
Having run them bridged for 9 months or so I then bought a pair of 7B-SST2 (incorporating the latest power supply changes) and haven't looked back since. 
The 7Bs are better still than the 4Bs, which you would expect .  The only other change I have made is to change all the cabling - speaker and analog and digital interconnects, for Chord Signatures.  I used to be a cable sceptic - but not any more - imaging and detail to die for, and the system seems so much quicker.
In view of your intention to get the MB2is, my recommendation would be to sell your 4B-SST get 7B-SST2s, which as 95Dyna says will be a walk in the park for them.
AFB

Thanks for this AFB, this is exactly what I wanted to hear 

[Vipers]

I've been speaking to my dealer today and another option rose its head which my dealer has at home and highly recommends.

MB2is run active, keeping my 4B for bass duties and using 2 x 3B SST2 for HF and Mid's and using 2 x 10B Bryston crossovers.

Sounds awesome, anyone had any experience of a similar setup?

What are the pro's and cons of passive vs active?

Cheers.

[Napalm]

I've been speaking to my dealer today and another option rose its head which my dealer has at home and highly recommends.

MB2is run active, keeping my 4B for bass duties and using 2 x 3B SST2 for HF and Mid's and using 2 x 10B Bryston crossovers.

Sounds awesome, anyone had any experience of a similar setup?

What are the pro's and cons of passive vs active?

Cheers.

The cons: you still drive the bass with a 4B. To get more tightness, punch and clarity, you need higher instant current delivery capability - i.e. a more powerful amp.

The pros: since you are using active crossovers, you can fine tune the sound tonality. ("tone controls"!).

Nap.

[James Tanner]

I've been speaking to my dealer today and another option rose its head which my dealer has at home and highly recommends.

MB2is run active, keeping my 4B for bass duties and using 2 x 3B SST2 for HF and Mid's and using 2 x 10B Bryston crossovers.

Sounds awesome, anyone had any experience of a similar setup?

What are the pro's and cons of passive vs active?

Cheers.

Hi Vipers - are you bypassing the internal passive crossover.

james

[Mad Mr H]

I run MB2's in bi amp mode with a pair of 7B SST per speaker.
More information in the image than with 4b's

I also have BB5 running tri amp 4B,4B,7B

Oh and as of today I have BB5 with XBD fully active, thats being powered by 4,4,7,7 per side

Active speaker systems is really what my work has always been - (Pro audio)


So whats best for you...........

I would keep the 4B and let it run mid/hf in bi amp, one side per ch and then add a pair of 7B one for each bass, a 14 is also possible but the 7s allow you to place them close to the speakers,



Active - OK, for me this is an easy route, its what I have spent most of my life as a Pro Audio engineer working on, BUT I would say that thought should be given to adding the XBD in MB2 prior to thinking about active.

I would not stick a 3B on the mids, I used to run a 3B on the HF but thats now a 4B on the BB5 system. Home alone and enjoying things the 3B used to clip (Sorry for that rest of village!) 4 on the mids is amazing, 7 on the mids is just another world.

The active PMC / Bryston system is NOT off the shelf buy it, plug it in sit back and relax, done correctly ALL the bryston equipment is modified by PMC, The PMC kit is specific for the active system as well - So it is possible to go from MB2/BB5 towards an active system but best option is to start with the active system - AGAIN my money would be on the MB2 XBD option rather than MB2 active.

BB5 XBD active being the ultimate system

ALL of the above assumes a 2ch system.

I am in London, UK.

[Mad Mr H]

The pros: since you are using active crossovers, you can fine tune the sound tonality. ("tone controls"!).
Nap.

Thats not what they are meant to be used for!

[Laundrew]

I have never really understood the advantages of using multiple amplifiers for each speaker. Instead of having one separate amplifier for lows, mids and highs - why not just purchase a pair 28B SST² amplifiers and enjoy the music. Fewer components and less cabling would most certainly be a simpler solution. I very much respect that at the end of the day, “to each their own,” and variety is definitely the spice of our audio pursuit.

Be well…

[Mad Mr H]

and then near the final stage into the ring steps another option.................

The mighty 28B pair.

That is the "keep it simple" approach - Which I also like. Quality? no question about it - Loads 

[Vipers]

Hi Vipers - are you bypassing the internal passive crossover.

james

I James,

As I am still running EB1i's and am looking at MB2's very soon, I'm of the understanding that I would buy MB2-A if I go active which would not include the internal crossover and would come with 2 x 10B's instead, I may be wrong of course.

[James Tanner]

I James,

As I am still running EB1i's and am looking at MB2's very soon, I'm of the understanding that I would buy MB2-A if I go active which would not include the internal crossover and would come with 2 x 10B's instead, I may be wrong of course.

Hi

No your correct -I just wanted to make sure you were aware of the differences.

James

[Vipers]

I have never really understood the advantages of using multiple amplifiers for each speaker. Instead of having one separate amplifier for lows, mids and highs - why not just purchase a pair 28B SST² amplifiers and enjoy the music. Fewer components and less cabling would most certainly be a simpler solution. I very much respect that at the end of the day, “to each their own,” and variety is definitely the spice of our audio pursuit.

Be well…

This is exactly what another dealer said to me as he'd rather stay passive due to its simplicity, it's easier to live with as its basically plug and play and he also said that if you get any problems in the future it is easier to pin point as there are less components in the mix.

I guess this is what I'm trying to establish, is active going to be a big step up against passive as I do like the simplicity of passive if i'm honest.

[Vipers]

and then near the final stage into the ring steps another option.................

The mighty 28B pair.

That is the "keep it simple" approach - Which I also like. Quality? no question about it - Loads 

Thanks for the in depth reply Mad Mr H in your previous post, very helpful 
BTW I'm very jealous of you BB5 XBD fully active system, must sound amazing, I'm off to Metropolis studios next month so I'll get to have a listen to something similar 
I'd love to go with MB2 with XBD but due to room size I think it maybe slightly overkill, I live in a very normal 3 bed detatched in Stevenage, so you can imagine the room size 
Quick question, due to budget restaints, would you go MB2i's passive with 2 x 7B SST2 or active using my 4B for bass and 2 x 3B's for HF/Mid?
Cheers.