Do you go for the exotic, esoteric?

Niteshade · « **on:** 22 Jun 2010, 12:15 pm »

Looking through the web over the years, I have seen tons of exotic/esoteric audio gear. There is plenty of stuff that has 5 & 6 digit price tags. Question is: Are there any benefits to spending at least $10k on any single item? I am being over generalized on purpose.

What will going from a $5k to a $10k price tag bring to the table?

decal · « **Reply #1 on:** 22 Jun 2010, 01:14 pm »

Do you go for the exotic, esoteric?What will going from a $5k to a $10k price tag bring to the table?

More lap dances?

OMG,you're talking about exotic audio equipment,my bad!!

rollo · « **Reply #2 on:** 22 Jun 2010, 01:19 pm »

The differences are small for the return. However to some well worth it. It is in the eye of the beholder. If we compare say an all out NAD system against an all out MBL system would the MBL system reproduce better sound. Most likely. how much better is in the eyes of the buyer. If he or she can afford the MBL system they buy it.
Then the other scenario is that the difference does not warrant the price difference. I have a inexpensive DAc that costs $600. My reference CDP was $3300. The DAC comes close and at times very close. At the end of the day the $3300 CDP is superior in every way by a small margin. If I did NOT hear the $3300 player all would be well. Even that small difference was enough for me to spend the extra money.
Better is better if there is such a thing. I say just different. My advice do not listen to the expensive stuff set up correctly. Ignorance is bliss.

charles

Wind Chaser · « **Reply #3 on:** 22 Jun 2010, 01:28 pm »

I've learned to live within my means so I don't consider anything outside of my budget. I've given up on sitting in the sweet spot and serious listening, but still can appreciate 'good sound'. These are good days for audio. A few thousand dollars well spent can buy a pretty decent sounding system; thus the esoteric has become less relevant and more about status and ego IMO.

No matter how fussy one is, anyone can easily build a completely satisfying system for under 20K. Anything more is ridiculous.

BobM · « **Reply #4 on:** 22 Jun 2010, 01:43 pm »

Very often the difference can also be attributed to mass market or large number of units produced vs boutique or individually built units from the manufacturer. There are certainly economies of scale and profit vs time invested. Quality hand work and time spent on looks and appearance and style are also not cheap.

Parts play a role, and high priced Audioiphile parts, which are already expensive to begin with, get market up significantly again.

Basically, you can find good sounding inexpensive units. You can find great sounding expensive units. You can also find just good sounding expensive units. And we all know you can find units that just don't sound good at all at any price point.

*Scotty* · « **Reply #5 on:** 22 Jun 2010, 02:21 pm »

If I had the funding to purchase equipment that cost 10s of thousands of dollars it would still have to perform better than less expensive alternatives. In the final analysis I am performance driven not price driven.
Scotty

werd · « **Reply #6 on:** 22 Jun 2010, 02:25 pm »

Before buying an expensive piece i thinks always a good idea to dabble around with their cheaper gear first.

Helps get an idea of what the manufacture is trying to accomplish. Its a good place to start to in order to get a feel of how the brand sounds and where the improvements lie. After you can decide if the big price is worth it...

BobRex · « **Reply #7 on:** 22 Jun 2010, 03:04 pm »

Quote from: Wind Chaser on 22 Jun 2010, 01:28 pm

I've learned to live within my means so I don't consider anything outside of my budget. I've given up on sitting in the sweet spot and serious listening, but still can appreciate 'good sound'. These are good days for audio. A few thousand dollars well spent can buy a pretty decent sounding system; thus the esoteric has become less relevant and more about status and ego IMO.

No matter how fussy one is, anyone can easily build a completely satisfying system for under 20K. Anything more is ridiculous.

Getting a little arrogant there aren't cha?

Keep in mind that for some percentage of the population buying a 10-20K single piece of electronics IS within their means. And for most of those people status and ego have absolutely nothing to do with it. They don't really give a damn what the "small people (to paraphrase BP execs) think. Do you seriously think that people buy audio equipment to impress? Sounds like you're taking the Acura commercial a little too seriously.

Sorry, making claims about living within one's means and then stating something over that is ridiculous is just wrong. To many people anything over 1K for a system is ridiculous.

BobRex · « **Reply #8 on:** 22 Jun 2010, 03:12 pm »

Quote from: werd on 22 Jun 2010, 02:25 pm

Before buying an expensive piece i thinks always a good idea to dabble around with their cheaper gear first.

Helps get an idea of what the manufacture is trying to accomplish. Its a good place to start to in order to get a feel of how the brand sounds and where the improvements lie. After you can decide if the big price is worth it...

Werd, do you realize that most people don't just wake up one morning, decide to become an audiophile, and then drop a hundred grand on a system? Anybody spending big bucks on a system has already "dabbled around with cheaper grear first" and is working his (or her) way up from lower priced gear, quite possibly in the same brand. Visit a B&M store and talk to the sales people. Back when I sold equipment, most of my cj Premier customers were moving up from the cheaper gear and just wanted the greater refinement that came with the more expensive stuff. And yes, they could hear a difference.

werd · « **Reply #9 on:** 22 Jun 2010, 03:16 pm »

Quote from: BobRex on 22 Jun 2010, 03:12 pm

Werd, do you realize that most people don't just wake up one morning, decide to become an audiophile, and then drop a hundred grand on a system? Anybody spending big bucks on a system has already "dabbled around with cheaper grear first" and is working his (or her) way up from lower priced gear, quite possibly in the same brand. Visit a B&M store and talk to the sales people. Back when I sold equipment, most of my cj Premier customers were moving up from the cheaper gear and just wanted the greater refinement that came with the more expensive stuff. And yes, they could hear a difference.

yes but the OP was asking if it merits it. The point had not been brought up so i mentioned it.....

Mike B. · « **Reply #10 on:** 22 Jun 2010, 03:44 pm »

There is a small group of people who must have the latest and greatest pieces. They tend to change systems like we change underware

For most of us, we look for pieces that we can live with for years, not days. It is my experience that good performing equipment can be taken to a higher level through a variety of mechanical and acoustical tweaks. Good cabling, good AC filtering, careful placement, etc. will get you very close to the ultimate IMO.

Wind Chaser · « **Reply #11 on:** 22 Jun 2010, 03:45 pm »

Quote from: BobRex on 22 Jun 2010, 03:04 pm

Sorry, making claims about living within one's means and then stating something over that is ridiculous is just wrong. To many people anything over 1K for a system is ridiculous.

The reason I mention living 'within my means' is there was a time when I didn't. I don't have anywhere near 20K in audio now, nor will I, but I came shamefully close. Not one of my smarter decisions considering how much money I've lost.

lcrim · « **Reply #12 on:** 22 Jun 2010, 04:03 pm »

I own fairly modest gear yet I had to learn the hard way what it is I liked and also not to let "earth people" know how much it costs. On my last job, my colleagues appreciated good gear, it was an IT department after all and they sought my opinion but busted my balls unmercifully about it at the same time.
There is gear that can provide musical insight and joy that simply can't be realized at lower price levels. There are other cultures that view these costs through a different set of values. The prices for some, particularly Japanese "bespoke" equipment does hold a fascination for me. The beauty of a Yamamoto hand-built amplifier utilizing cherry wood and ebony is undeniable and yet at the same time I am also drawn to the Wyred4Sound gear that has an almost Bauhaus look to it and offers terrific content for cost.
Yes, I am drawn to the esoteric and exotic.

Berto · « **Reply #13 on:** 22 Jun 2010, 04:21 pm »

If you want a helluva system for the money the best bet is to be a internet junkie , make firends , read up on end user reviews, hear lots of different stuff, etc.

If you are patient (which i'm not) you can make a pretty calculated choice and buy all used in great condition for 1/2 msrp or alot less. Best bet if you are a sharp buuyer, you will lose lil to nothing if you descide to change gears for the better.

Personnally I do enjoy my equipment to look nice as well as sound divine, care less on buying b/c something is considered exotic.

konut · « **Reply #14 on:** 22 Jun 2010, 05:08 pm »

Esoteric
1.Understood only by a chosen few or an enlightened inner circle.
2.Having to do with concepts that are highly theoretical and without obvious practical application.
3.Confidential; private.

Exotic
1.Foreign, with the connotation of excitingly foreign.
2.Non-native to the ecosystem.

Neither of these terms have any reference to expense. WRT esoteric, anything more complicated than a receiver would seem to qualify if only raw numbers were the criterion. By that standard an estimate of 90%, or greater, of Audiocircle membership would qualify if taking the general public as the sample set.

Many here have a mix of both foreign and domestic gear. How excited should I be about that?

Quiet Earth · « **Reply #15 on:** 22 Jun 2010, 05:46 pm »

Man,,,,,, Niteshade, you are one persistent dude.

lcrim · « **Reply #16 on:** 22 Jun 2010, 06:35 pm »

Gentlemen:
The sarcasm and put downs need to cease.

turkey · « **Reply #17 on:** 22 Jun 2010, 07:03 pm »

This is probably one of those topics that has a different answer for each person.

I don't see any real reason to spend $10K on one component. YMMV.

Elizabeth · « **Reply #18 on:** 23 Jun 2010, 12:07 am »

The price of a component only matters if one cannot afford it. The problem of discussing 'expensive' equipment as a 'luxury or boutique item only occurs when it is out of reach of ones' wallet.
Being 'relatively' middle ground (my stuff is now in the $5 grand major stuff, $2 grand minor stuff each range) I can appreciate the person with modest investments in a system who , just like the wealthy, wants to maximize the quality of sound he/she can afford, And, can also see why folks with expensive systems can and do spend hundreds of thousands to find that SAME goal of musicality in a system they can afford.
We all want a nice system that can actually play music. Better to agree on that as a first principle. Than to argue whether expensive stuff has a 'value'.
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Added: then the idea if esoteric: Having unusual or obscure equipment is a personal thing. i tend to want mainstream products, from companies that have a long and proven track record because i value the safety that represents.
However I DO appreciate the unusual, and exotic. Being lower middle class monitarily i feel I cannot 'afford' to indulge my whimsy. I wish I could be braver!
Since the desire for the exotic or unusual is a personal idiosincratic one, I guess it does NOT depend as much on one bank account. (though, it certainly could help to have more money available)
many audiophile LIKE having an unusual product they 'discovered'. This used to be more important BEFORE the internet levelled the playing field for new and unusual equipment. Now, as soon as YOU discover a new, exciting chunk of equipment, so does EVERYONE else!

lcrim · « **Reply #19 on:** 23 Jun 2010, 01:18 am »

"Give me the luxuries of life and I will willingly do without the necessities." Frank Lloyd Wright