LONGHORN GOLD1 AND GREEN1 CARTRIDGES NOW AVAILABLE!

Wayner · « **Reply #140 on:** 30 Jun 2011, 06:48 pm »

Quote from: rcag_ils on 30 Jun 2011, 05:38 pm

Use an alignment record that has a blank track (no groove) area for your anti skate setting, no tool is more accurate than this.

The AVA Anti-skating Calibration Tool (ACT) is just that, a completely blank disc, designed to confirm correct anti-skate adjustment thru the entire record playing field.

Wayner

Wayner · « **Reply #141 on:** 30 Jun 2011, 06:54 pm »

If you will notice on my Sony PS-X7, I have also incorporated a pencil erasure size dot of plasticlay about 2 inches down from the pivots. I believe this also helps damp the arm from developing resonance frequencies.

Wayner

Trover · « **Reply #142 on:** 30 Jun 2011, 07:24 pm »

That's a cool looking turntable! Reminds me a little of the early SL1200's. Btw which groove does the right channel correspond to and how does that figure in with the skate setting?

Wayner · « **Reply #143 on:** 30 Jun 2011, 07:40 pm »

The outer groove is the right channel. If the anti-skating is being not so effective, the stylus will be giving the left wall a snuggie and the right wall will be like a skipping stone on the water (in a worse case). In some cases, I've seen the stylus come out of the groove all together and do a nice scratch.

adding more anti-skating will relieve the pressure on the inner groove and allow the outer groove to track as was intended.

If an arm were to have zero anti-skating (not including an AR or VPI arm) and you used a blank disc, the arm would race to the spindle. You could say that the stylus and it's offset angle act like a boat rudder and steer the assembly inward. Logic would make you think that the natural direction would be to go to the outside, as if you were to put a penny on the record and start it up, the penny would go flying off, outwardly.

Anti-skating is accomplished in several different ways. One technique is to use a spring to apply an opposing pressure to neutralize the skating. Another design uses 2 attracting magnets, the adjustment brings them (and their sticking power) closer together. Some arms have a drop weight that can be seen externally, looking like a fishing rod with a weight on the end.

To that end, the little dial on any turntable is simply a reference. your eyes and ears should be the final judge on how much anti-skating needs to be applied. Sometimes a visual indicator might be the stylus assembly appearing to be pulled to one side, tho this is sometimes not so easy to tell.

I know every TTs owners manual says to set the dial of the anti-skate to match how much VTF you have applied, but that is a very vague general rule, it gets you to a starting point, it is not the final word on this adjustment.

When things are all dialed in correctly, your table will let you know. Things will be very open, reverberant and captivating. Of course it helps to start with a good recording, and an LP played many times with the anti-skate improperly set may have created permanent damage to the LP.

One more thought is that a great playback system isn't necessarily one that makes all the LPs sound "pretty". If you have a crappy record, it should sound, well, crappy. If you have a great recording, you should have bliss. The object is to have a collection full of bliss.

Wayner

Wayner · « **Reply #144 on:** 30 Jun 2011, 08:13 pm »

There is a lot of crap on the net talking about which channel is which. Some say that the horizontal movement of the stylus is one channel, while the vertical movement is another.

Here is a nifty photo of a record groove close up.

Wayner

mark funk · « **Reply #145 on:** 30 Jun 2011, 09:28 pm »

Boy does this bring me back. I all ways had trouble setting up my table and most likey never had it right!
When they cut the master it only cuts in one plane, left and right or does it cut up and down too?

Wayner · « **Reply #146 on:** 30 Jun 2011, 09:34 pm »

If I knew more, I'd be cutting the masters. I wish we could all go on a field trip.

Wayner

Trover · « **Reply #147 on:** 1 Jul 2011, 02:05 pm »

"Collection full of bliss", I like that. Troving for used records and getting one of those over worn on one or both groove records messes with my bliss! I have lots of good ones though. I have 3 records containing a blank side so I use those for skate setting and initial suspension run in of new cartridges, when I get a new cartridge I set it to sway around the middle and let it cook for awhile. I'm thinking Grados are more challenged with strong transient stuff, like loud piano notes. I played the same George cables piano solo (from an Art Pepper record) on the Goldring 1042 last night and it did a better job than the Grado, breaking up just a little. Over the weekend I'll be playing a stock Grado gold and a Longhorn gold, so I can find out for myself what the differences are. You seem to know alot about LP playback. I'm always learning. On the forums People sometimes comment on stuff they have'nt used or know nothing about, I always like to find out for myself and even then it would be my experience which is going to be different from anyone else.

Trover · « **Reply #148 on:** 23 Jan 2012, 09:21 pm »

I had some time to compare the stock Grado gold to the longhorn gold. I didnt have 2 same tables, headshell's were same and TF same, used same passage and about 2 minutes in between comparisons. The longhorn does make the Grado sound "More neutral", just like AVA says. The imaging and tonality become marginally more even. In the end I preferred the stock Grado. The longhorn did improve some high fi performance attributes but in so doing also loses some of the characteristic Grado sound or Grado colorations. By making the stock Grado "more neutral" I missed a bit of what I go to Grados for in the first place. I would urge anyone curious to try a Longhorn out for themselves and decide which they prefer. It is a good cartridge.

Wayner · « **Reply #149 on:** 23 Jan 2012, 10:09 pm »

I certainly appreciate the candid comments about the Longhorn. Comparison tests of this nature are difficult, especially when both tables are not identical. Influences can be made by such a simple thing as the difference in cable capacitance between the 2 TTs. VTF, VTA and anti-skate behavior can also have an influence if both are not set identical, and without identical decks, this is not possible.

In the end, it's about personal preference. We believe the Longhorn improves tracking and all around performance, as we also treat the internal coils and stylus. However, we have no control on the performance of "up-stream" components, tonearms, bearings or other table related assemblies.

We do know that there are lots of influences to any cartridge, good or bad, from variances in these mechanical devices, all having a total and summed impact on the overall sound.

Perhaps that is what makes vinyl so fun. Sometimes improvements can be made with just a little tweak on what is already there.

Spin away!

Wayner

rcag_ils · « **Reply #150 on:** 24 Jan 2012, 02:03 pm »

He didn't mention if he cross-swapped the two cartridges onto two different turntables when doing the listening test. Also improvement can reveal the deficiency of the source materials. He said he clearly hear the improvement but preferred the sound before the improvement, I have hard time reasoning it.

Wayner · « **Reply #151 on:** 24 Jan 2012, 03:47 pm »

If he cross-swapped the two cartridges, he would then have to re-align them. Lots of work!

Wayner

Otis · « **Reply #152 on:** 24 Jan 2012, 04:08 pm »

Wayner, a quick aside.. have you ever heard one of your Longhorns with an 8MZ stylus?

Trover · « **Reply #153 on:** 24 Jan 2012, 04:18 pm »

To clear up. I used 2 identicle headshells on a Technics SL1200, so my comparison was by switching headshells on same table, and resulting time to do that, rather than the instant comparison 2 identicle tables would have allowed. I liked both cartridges, and said the longhorn is a good cartridge. I slightly prefered the sound of a stock Grado, as AVA claims the mod makes the Grado "more neutral", that is what I found, the long horn has a bit less of the characteristic Grado warmth, which may actually be the result of whatever resonances a stock Grado has- however the cartridge is tuned initially at the factory. Whether the slight loss of Grado warmth is the result of the plastecine damping or the longhorn fitting I don't know, you'd have to listen to a dampened only, and a longhorned only to know. The AVA Longhorn does have an slight improvement in imaging and bass "tightness" along with the increase in "neutrality", it is not quite as sweet in the mids as a stock Grado, but that's only my take, What I was trying to say is some people listen to stock Grados FOR THEIR COLORATIONS, making its tonality more "neutral" while improving it in other areas is a mixed bag IMO. Both the stock and the longhorn have something special to offer.

Wayner · « **Reply #154 on:** 24 Jan 2012, 04:23 pm »

Very good. The Longhorn mod does add weight to the cartridge so I'll assume that your test included a re-adjustment of VTF.

Otis, no I have not.

Wayner

Delta Wave · « **Reply #155 on:** 24 Jan 2012, 04:26 pm »

Would there be any benefit of damping the cartridge with just the silicone and not the actual longhorn?

Wayner · « **Reply #156 on:** 24 Jan 2012, 05:48 pm »

The Longhorn itself needs to be damped so as not to add micro-vibrations to the playback.

Again, thanks Trover for your efforts and insights.

Wayner

Trover · « **Reply #157 on:** 30 Jan 2012, 05:27 pm »

Quote from: Wayner on 24 Jan 2012, 04:23 pm

Very good. The Longhorn mod does add weight to the cartridge so I'll assume that your test included a re-adjustment of VTF.

Otis, no I have not.

Wayner

Hey wayner I have a digital thingie I use for the VTF. Swapping the cartridge headshell and resetting the tracking force accounted for the 2 minute pause between the comparison. Both cartridges are very good. I'd also be curious about what each part of the mod does individually as the other poster mentions.

Wayner · « **Reply #158 on:** 30 Jan 2012, 06:20 pm »

I can't say it any better then Frank did on the website:

http://www.avahifi.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=258&Itemid=247

Wayner