Diffraction busters

rajacat · « **on:** 4 Dec 2009, 07:45 pm »

These diffraction busters really work.

Since my Omega Hemp Bipoles have wide baffles the effect is very pronounced. I've found that they especially improve the midrange and perhaps they provide the equivalent effect of baffle step compensation without the added complexity and loss of a little efficiency.

I built my own but it may less hassle and small amount of extra $s to have Jim Goulding build some for you. I have 4 drivers so cost was a factor. http://www.diffractionbegone.com/

I did try something unique by cutting the wool in a bevel around the driver thereby creating a little waveguide.

-Roy

mattyturner · « **Reply #1 on:** 4 Dec 2009, 07:54 pm »

Awesome... what is the material, any changes to the sound?

rajacat · « **Reply #2 on:** 4 Dec 2009, 08:16 pm »

Yes, the sound is smoother and whatever harshness in the highs that existed has been dealt with effectively. Imaging has improved too. However the improvement in the midrange was the most significant plus

Made of compressed wool.

-Roy

jimdgoulding · « **Reply #3 on:** 4 Dec 2009, 09:02 pm »

Hey, Roy . . how's it hangin? Does me good to see someone try to be rid of diffraction as you might think it would. And thank you for putting in my site address. You know, used to be thought was given to this by guys like Vandersteen (who still does) and Dunlavy, and companies like PMC and Spendor. When the speaker business got more competitive, guys needed an edge and fine wood finishes became the trend cept for Vandersteen who puts a basket over his individual driver enclosures. Wilson has started putting felt pads on their upscale models if that tells you anything but they don't use wood enclosures. Anyway, good listening my friend and thanks, again. Jim

mattyturner · « **Reply #4 on:** 4 Dec 2009, 10:09 pm »

I might give it a go.. just not sure how much benefit for Super-8 which has much less baffle around the driver.

some young guy · « **Reply #5 on:** 4 Dec 2009, 10:40 pm »

Quote from: mattyturner on 4 Dec 2009, 10:09 pm

I might give it a go.. just not sure how much benefit for Super-8 which has much less baffle around the driver.

They have an excellent effect on my Hawks (see review here http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=74579.0), which have almost no baffle around the drivers. Plus you get a 30 day money back guarantee...

rajacat · « **Reply #6 on:** 5 Dec 2009, 12:43 am »

Quote from: jimdgoulding on 4 Dec 2009, 09:02 pm

Hey, Roy . . how's it hangin? Does me good to see someone try to be rid of diffraction as you might think it would. And thank you for putting in my site address. You know, used to be thought was given to this by guys like Vandersteen (who still does) and Dunlavy, and companies like PMC and Spendor. When the speaker business got more competitive, guys needed an edge and fine wood finishes became the trend cept for Vandersteen who puts a basket over his individual driver enclosures. Wilson has started putting felt pads on their upscale models if that tells you anything but they don't use wood enclosures. Anyway, good listening my friend and thanks, again. Jim

Hi Jim,

Yes it is interesting that a little piece of felt can make such a large difference.

The little pads really helped correct some of my speakers deficiencies. Thanks to you for bringing this tweak to the attention of myself and other music lovers.

Best regards,

Roy

gotspeakers · « **Reply #7 on:** 5 Dec 2009, 03:59 pm »

How does it affect the bass extension created by the wide baffle? Seems logical that it would. I sure hope it is a worthwhile tweek.......cuz it sure is ugly!!!!!

Those speakers look like an old (really old) model with the new hemp driver switched in.

Have you compared what you have to something more recent in the line?

"Close your eyes to enhance sound experience, and to NOT see those ugly things!!!!!"

I'm sure they sound fine........

gotspeakers · « **Reply #8 on:** 5 Dec 2009, 04:04 pm »

FYI

Check out the material used by Legacy Audio in the Whisper Speaker System around the tweeter area. It is not only a waveguide, but a diffraction tool as well, and their material (a special foam) is the best I have experienced for this application. it is soft and black, and slightly moldable. It also does not look like Shite. It can also be removed and replaced if it starts to look like shite.

I'm sure that the Legacy speakers are out of your range, but the material may be available and would certainly yield premium results with MUCH better looks.

rajacat · « **Reply #9 on:** 5 Dec 2009, 04:40 pm »

gotspeakers,

I don't think it looks like sh#t! It looks better in person than in the photo. If the appearance disturbed me I could reshape the felt and reinstall the grills. I'm mostly concerned with sound quality: appearance is secondary.

These are older Bipoles. They sound great especially after installing the diffraction busters. I doubt that the newer Bipoles would sound any better. I haven't heard any of the newer Omega designs but the bipole design has certain sound characteristics that would be hard to duplicate with monopoles.

You're right, I wouldn't want to spend the $$$$ on Legacy Speakers (frankly they look impressive but too much of monster speaker look for me). Looks like Legacy is more into high end HT applications too. I'm sure that I could get more bang for the buck from other manufactures. Too many drivers and crossovers.

-Roy

-Roy

jimdgoulding · « **Reply #10 on:** 5 Dec 2009, 04:42 pm »

Quote from: gotspeakers on 5 Dec 2009, 03:59 pm

How does it affect the bass extension created by the wide baffle? Seems logical that it would. I sure hope it is a worthwhile tweek.......cuz it sure is ugly!!!!!

Those speakers look like an old (really old) model with the new hemp driver switched in.

Have you compared what you have to something more recent in the line?

"Close your eyes to enhance sound experience, and to NOT see those ugly things!!!!!"

I'm sure they sound fine........

Maybe I can offer some insight. It doesn't actually improve bass extention. It's a quality issue. When diffracted waveforms rearrive and sum in with the pure signal, they will cause an elevation in the frequency domain where this is the most prevalent. Remove them and the frequency response is more linear and truer sounding as the ear isn't drawn to any pronouncement and what is subsequently obscured. Additionally, the late arriving diffracted info is out of time and phase, hence, removing it allows for the improvement in clarity, depth of field, and focus in general. Speakers, for which this is a benefit, more perceptibly disappear from the music.

satfrat · « **Reply #11 on:** 5 Dec 2009, 05:55 pm »

Quote from: rajacat on 5 Dec 2009, 04:40 pm

gotspeakers,

I don't think it looks like sh#t! It looks better in person than in the photo. If the appearance disturbed me I could reshape the felt and reinstall the grills. I'm mostly concerned with sound quality: appearance is secondary.

These are older Bipoles. They sound great especially after installing the diffraction busters. I doubt that the newer Bipoles would sound any better. I haven't heard any of the newer Omega designs but the bipole design has certain sound characteristics that would be hard to duplicate with monopoles.

You're right, I wouldn't want to spend the $$$$ on Legacy Speakers (frankly they look impressive but too much of monster speaker look for me). Looks like Legacy is more into high end HT applications too. I'm sure that I could get more bang for the buck from other manufactures. Too many drivers and crossovers.

-Roy

-Roy

Just a headsup Roy, the woolie surrounds can be hand dyed (Do NOT use washing machine ) to better blend in with the veneer. Jacquard acid dye for wool in many different colors can be purchased online, I used Golden Ochre on mine to blend in with golden oak veneer. It's worth the efort Roy, I personally couldn't stand the gray look myself but now mine don't stand out whatsoever.

Cheers,
Robin

rajacat · « **Reply #12 on:** 5 Dec 2009, 06:56 pm »

Hi Robin,

It seems to me it would be difficult to get the woolies to blend in with maple cabinets. I could dye them to get within the vicinity but perhaps it would be easier to just dye them black. Sure I could dye them lighter but maple is maple and very hard to approximate. However black is the color of most grills so if the woolies were dyed black they may be less noticeable than if they were just lighter in an attempt to look like maple. The drivers are black.

Another possible option would be to search for wool in a lighter color. It may not be as high percentage of wool content. I'd have to do a search but I'm fairly certain that I've seen lighter shades in my extensive searching for the right wool that has the correct density so as not to droop.

-Roy

ed. I could also cut them round and dye black.

Do you have pic of your woolies?

Maybe I could paint the cabinets gray to match the woolies?

satfrat · « **Reply #13 on:** 5 Dec 2009, 07:57 pm »

Quote from: rajacat on 5 Dec 2009, 06:56 pm

Hi Robin,

It seems to me it would be difficult to get the woolies to blend in with maple cabinets. I could dye them to get within the vicinity but perhaps it would be easier to just dye them black. Sure I could dye them lighter but maple is maple and very hard to approximate. However black is the color of most grills so if the woolies were dyed black they may be less noticeable than if they were just lighter in an attempt to look like maple. The drivers are black.

Another possible option would be to search for wool in a lighter color. It may not be as high percentage of wool content. I'd have to do a search but I'm fairly certain that I've seen lighter shades in my extensive searching for the right wool that has the correct density so as not to droop.

-Roy

ed. I could also cut them round and dye black.

Do you have pic of your woolies?

No Roy, no pictures after I dyed them but I do have a picture here before I dyed them. Just clcik onto the picture to blow it up for a better view. Because of the base gray, any color dye will be shades darker than the actual color shown on the Jacquard page. My woolies are darker than the oak but they still blend together much better than black would have,,, unless you're more concerned about matching the drivers instead of blending with the veneer. That's a personal choice, 1 that I did consider btw. For me tho, anything was better than gray.

Cheers,
Robin

jimdgoulding · « **Reply #14 on:** 5 Dec 2009, 10:43 pm »

The Satman hath spoketh and he be a righteous dood. I have begun dying them for customers, BTW, when asked (for the price of dye and the gas to go get it).

satfrat · « **Reply #15 on:** 5 Dec 2009, 10:51 pm »

Quote from: jimdgoulding on 5 Dec 2009, 10:43 pm

The Satman hath spoketh and he be a righteous dood. I have begun dying them for customers, BTW, when asked (for the price of dye and the gas to go get it).

Just DON'T use the washer method if you're doing it yourself,,, right Jim?

jimdgoulding · « **Reply #16 on:** 5 Dec 2009, 10:55 pm »

Quote from: satfrat on 5 Dec 2009, 10:51 pm

Quote from: jimdgoulding on 5 Dec 2009, 10:43 pm
The Satman hath spoketh and he be a righteous dood. I have begun dying them for customers, BTW, when asked (for the price of dye and the gas to go get it).

Just DON'T use the washer method if you're doing it yourself,,, right Jim?

That would be correct. They will shrink. Air dry. I use a special dogwood tree myself.

Louis O · « **Reply #17 on:** 17 Dec 2009, 11:10 pm »

Hi rajacat,

The wool does make a difference and I have heard it myself. As far as the look black would be best. The driver cutout is can be done with a die. I have a company that can do this. The felt on my drivers are done by them and they look perfect. I can make a call and see what can be done. Maybe an accessory.

Thanks,
Louis

mattyturner · « **Reply #18 on:** 17 Dec 2009, 11:19 pm »

I would buy a pair as an official accessory if not too expensive for sure.

Louis O · « **Reply #19 on:** 17 Dec 2009, 11:44 pm »

Hi mattyturner,

I should have seen that jimdgoulding makes these. If he's willing to make them that would be great if not I will look into it.

Thanks,
Louis