[Xtatik]

Hello Everyone

Has anyone used this http://www.homedepot.com/Building-Materials-Insulation-Cotton/h_d1/N-5yc1vZ1xk3Zbedd/R-100661753/h_d2/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053 product for a tube trap?  I had wondered if a person could merely wrap burlap or similar material around this and have an effective bass trap?  I have not seen the material, just happened to run across it while working on another project.

[jermmd]

I never heard of it but it looks like pretty ideal stuff for traps. If you do try it, post your results.

[bpape]

That's the first time I've seen it in small quantities and in 2" thickness.  Generally, UltraTouch is sold in bales that are either 3.5 or 5.5" thick (R-13 or R-19) and either 16 or 24" wide.  Multiple 94" pieces to a bale. 

The material can work well if used thick enough due to it's light density.

Bryan

[TRADERXFAN]

Bryan,
Thanks as always for your info!

What is it equivalent to in fiberglass?

also, do you think 8# mineral wool is too dense?

[bpape]

It's about the same density as standard wall insulation.  Probably about 1lb/cu ft or a tad less.  For comparison, OC703 is 3lb/cu ft.

I can't say if 8lb is too dense without knowing what it's for, how thick it will be used, etc.

Bryan

[TRADERXFAN]

for bass traps? for first reflection points? 4" or more thick. Just in general, is it a poorer performer than say a 3# or 5# fiberglass for acoustic absorption, all else being equal?

Thanks!

[bpape]

Ah.  But all else isn't equal.

For side wall reflections, 2" 3lb is preferable.  8lb mineral wool will tend to let shallow reflections skip off. 

For bass absorbers, if you're only going 4" thick, then the 8lb is fine.  If you're doing thicker chunks, then 3-4lb density is preferable.

Bryan

[TRADERXFAN]

For bass absorbers, if you're only going 4" thick, then the 8lb is fine.  If you're doing thicker chunks, then 3-4lb density is preferable.

Bryan

thicker is preferable for which parameters? cost, absorption coefficient, lower frequency extension? (I bet you will say all of them  )

Thanks again...

[Xtatik]

Wow, nice responses already.  If a person were to cut these in half, for a 16x24" rectangle, then cut them in half on a diagonal, then alternate top and bottom so that they are stacked evenly, will this be sufficient for a bass trap going from floor to ceiling?  Knowing that the 2 sides coming out from the corner will not be the same length, would you put the long side to the wall going to the back of the room, or inside the 2 corners kind of between the speaker/tv area? 

Many many thanks to you responders so far.

I forgot to add in that the panels were 16x48 inch rolls. 

[Xtatik]

Guys, I don't have a real clue as to what to expect with any sort of traps.  To my knowledge I have never heard a system with traps in place nor seen any except on forums where their virtues are extolled.

I have seen references to wedges of insulation in a corner and also corner tubes.  On a tube, is there any particular diameters that a person should shoot for?  And for the wedge idea, is this a floor to ceiling item, or a particular ratio from floor to ceiling?  Another question or two is... on a tube do you build a frame inside such as chickenwire or say maybe a used carpet tube to roll it up on, and do you need multiple sizes?

[bpape]

For bass absorbers, if you're only going 4" thick, then the 8lb is fine.  If you're doing thicker chunks, then 3-4lb density is preferable.

Bryan

thicker is preferable for which parameters? cost, absorption coefficient, lower frequency extension? (I bet you will say all of them  )

Thanks again...

Thicker will reach deeper.  Denser when going thicker won't buy you anything and could potentially perform worse.

Bryan

[bpape]

Wow, nice responses already.  If a person were to cut these in half, for a 16x24" rectangle, then cut them in half on a diagonal, then alternate top and bottom so that they are stacked evenly, will this be sufficient for a bass trap going from floor to ceiling?  Knowing that the 2 sides coming out from the corner will not be the same length, would you put the long side to the wall going to the back of the room, or inside the 2 corners kind of between the speaker/tv area? 

Many many thanks to you responders so far.

I forgot to add in that the panels were 16x48 inch rolls.

You can do that.  Orient them in a fashion so that the thicker average is facing the length of the room where your modal frequencies are lower.

Bryan

[bpape]

Guys, I don't have a real clue as to what to expect with any sort of traps.  To my knowledge I have never heard a system with traps in place nor seen any except on forums where their virtues are extolled.

I have seen references to wedges of insulation in a corner and also corner tubes.  On a tube, is there any particular diameters that a person should shoot for?  And for the wedge idea, is this a floor to ceiling item, or a particular ratio from floor to ceiling?  Another question or two is... on a tube do you build a frame inside such as chickenwire or say maybe a used carpet tube to roll it up on, and do you need multiple sizes?

Expect a tightening and extension of the bottom end, an increased clarity in the mids, ease of hearing more details at lower levels, etc.

If you want a tube that will perform on par with a 17x17x24" triangle chunk, you're looking at a minimum of 16" diameter - 20" is better.

Floor to ceiling if you can.  If you can't, do what you can.  It's a thickness and surface area game.

Bryan

[Xtatik]

Guys, I don't have a real clue as to what to expect with any sort of traps.  To my knowledge I have never heard a system with traps in place nor seen any except on forums where their virtues are extolled.

I have seen references to wedges of insulation in a corner and also corner tubes.  On a tube, is there any particular diameters that a person should shoot for?  And for the wedge idea, is this a floor to ceiling item, or a particular ratio from floor to ceiling?  Another question or two is... on a tube do you build a frame inside such as chickenwire or say maybe a used carpet tube to roll it up on, and do you need multiple sizes?

Expect a tightening and extension of the bottom end, an increased clarity in the mids, ease of hearing more details at lower levels, etc.

If you want a tube that will perform on par with a 17x17x24" triangle chunk, you're looking at a minimum of 16" diameter - 20" is better.

Floor to ceiling if you can.  If you can't, do what you can.  It's a thickness and surface area game.

Bryan

I sincerely thank you for your time and effort Bryan. (bpape)  I'm learning my way through these forums and didnt realize the caliber of expertise here.  I am in awe here at AudioCircle and think I may have found a new home to lounge in. 

[planet10]

The manufacturer's website http://www.bondedlogic.com/

We have used the 3.5" stuff as volume fill, and are now using the slightly denser 1/2" for inside panel lining.

Gary Pimm has gotten really good results in his cardiod OB woofers.

Haven't seen any feedback on use for traps.

It should be noted that the research Floyd Tool shows in this recent books indicates that killing 1st reflections is usually a bad idea.

dave