Nearfield monitors for studio

TimWinter · « **on:** 12 Jun 2009, 01:40 pm »

Just wondering if anyone has tried using either the A/V-1, N1X, or the N2X for nearfield monitors? Obviously I am looking for something that is really flat and revealing in the midrange and a top end that won't rip my head off.

I really like the idea of the N1X, reminds me of the Adam line of monitors, but I am wary of the rising top end for nearfield use.

I have MMG's for final mastering tweaking and don't want to spend $800 or $900 to get nearfields.

Thanks.....

Danny Richie · « **Reply #1 on:** 12 Jun 2009, 03:46 pm »

Just keep in mind that the N1X is ported so they need a little room behind them. If the rear porting is an issue then look to the N2X.

An overly hot top end is something I can't stand, and these are not overly hot. I did design them to be listened to at about 10 degrees off axis as that is where you will get the smoothest and flattest response. You can also open them up to about 15 to 20 degrees off axis if you wanted to start softening the top end a little.

EARGASM · « **Reply #2 on:** 12 Jun 2009, 03:55 pm »

Removed by member.

TimWinter · « **Reply #3 on:** 13 Jun 2009, 11:54 pm »

Thanks for the replies.... I have been thinking about the cab options and the bass quality. Elsewhere it is mentioned that the N2X as a sealed monitor, while doesn't go as deep as the N1X, is the tighter of the two. Me thinks that is preferable for mixing in the studio. I am planning on constructing a 1 cu ft ported cab tuned at 35hz. Using WinISD I found the the 165x goes down -3db around 45hz and has a better group delay than the N1X. Kind of a good comprimise between a well controlled low end and extension beyond the N1X ???

Am I off base or on the right track? And Eric if you didn't have another set of monitors for your studio would you consider a ported N2X over the sealed version?

Thanks again.

Danny Richie · « **Reply #4 on:** 13 Jun 2009, 11:59 pm »

Tim,

All of that will work just fine. Good thinking.

TimWinter · « **Reply #5 on:** 14 Jun 2009, 12:17 am »

Thanks Danny..... I really appreciate how fast you reply and take time for us nubies.

Daygloworange · « **Reply #6 on:** 18 Jun 2009, 03:16 am »

Quote from: TimWinter on 12 Jun 2009, 01:40 pm

Just wondering if anyone has tried using either the A/V-1, N1X, or the N2X for nearfield monitors? Obviously I am looking for something that is really flat and revealing in the midrange and a top end that won't rip my head off.

I really like the idea of the N1X, reminds me of the Adam line of monitors, but I am wary of the rising top end for nearfield use.

I have MMG's for final mastering tweaking and don't want to spend $800 or $900 to get nearfields.

Thanks.....

Write this down....

You won't ever monitor on anything else after you've engineered and mixed using anything by GR Research. Nobody I've ever heard, can consistently design speakers with a flatter response. Period.

The only complaint you'll have, is how many late nights you spent re-mixing on your previous monitors...

****************

I can afford virtually any commercially available monitor. I would never put another brand speaker but a GR, in my studio again.

Next up for me? Venue's...

TimWinter · « **Reply #7 on:** 18 Jun 2009, 03:40 am »

Well that's a glowing endorsement now isn't it??? You say any monitor is good...... Which do you use?

Daygloworange · « **Reply #8 on:** 18 Jun 2009, 03:54 am »

Tim,

I've had the A/V 3's, the OB-5's, OB-7's and the PR subwoofer. Haven't had the LS-9's in my studio, but I've had them in my shop playing my own engineered recordings (which at RMAF 2007, one 50k + speaker company was reluctant to continue playing in their 3 way system due to excessively low frequencies and transients).

Check my gallery (below) for all of our builds.

Tell you what. Choose and purchase any (ported) 2-way kit you'd like as near fields ( I recommend the ones with the Neo3 tweeter). I'll build you raw MDF enclosures on spec. You pay for shipping, assemble the speakers, break them in properly, and if you don't like the speakers, I'll buy the kit from you.

I'll put my money where my mouth is.

Good deal or what?

Cheers

TimWinter · « **Reply #9 on:** 18 Jun 2009, 04:10 am »

Great deal. Won't be for a while though..... Still remodeling home and studio takes a back seat for now....

droht · « **Reply #10 on:** 22 Jun 2009, 12:10 pm »

Beyond studio use, I think more and more folks are setting up high quality secondary systems (or primary) on their desktops. Seems like there is a market for "desktop speakers" that has not been tapped yet.

What I'd want, ideally, would be a sealed speaker that is as shallow as possible. Height isn't an issue, unless it gets crazy. Something like 18Hx9Wx6D. The Zu Credenzas come to mind as being the right shape/size. Not so sure about price and performance on those, however. I want to put speakers as close to wall as possible, to minimize lost desktop real estate.

What do you think Danny? Any opportunity?

Danny Richie · « **Reply #11 on:** 22 Jun 2009, 02:11 pm »

Quote

What do you think Danny? Any opportunity?

Want a high end desk top speaker?

Maybe an open baffle design with a separate small sub?

4" full range drivers? 3" full range drivers? Or a two way design.

The problem is that is will be tough to do a good two way or two driver design and it not wind up at near the $200 a pair range.

droht · « **Reply #12 on:** 22 Jun 2009, 02:22 pm »

Quote from: Danny on 22 Jun 2009, 02:11 pm

Quote
What do you think Danny? Any opportunity?

Want a high end desk top speaker?

Maybe an open baffle design with a separate small sub?

4" full range drivers? 3" full range drivers? Or a two way design.

The problem is that is will be tough to do a good two way or two driver design and it not wind up at near the $200 a pair range.

I would think that $1000 assembled for a high quality 2.1 would work.

Danny Richie · « **Reply #13 on:** 22 Jun 2009, 02:26 pm »

Quote

I would think that $1000 assembled for a high quality 2.1 would work.

Actually with a price point that high I can get real creative and come out with something really good.

woofersus · « **Reply #14 on:** 22 Jun 2009, 04:08 pm »

I definitely think high end desktop speakers are a niche that should be attacked. I also think that some more attention should be paid to the project studio market. I'm using a pair of Ninja Master AV123 ELT525M's powered by a TCA Gizmo along with an AV123 ULW-10 in my studio. It's certainly not perfect, but my total investment in the setup is ~$725 (got pretty good deals on every component) and it blows away anything you can buy at guitar center for that kind of money. I think ID or DIY designers should go after that market. I'm looking forward to my n2x demo so I can compare. I want to try out the ribbons because I've always liked Adam monitors.

I don't know if high end desktop speakers and something designed to be a studio monitor are necessarily the same thing here, but the diminutive size of the ELT525m's is one of the things that attracted me. Nice studio monitors tend to be pretty huge (I assume because the buyers of <$1k studio monitors frequently don't use subs and they want to squeeze all the extension out of those 6-8" drivers that they can) and I needed something that would fit in a relatively small space and stay coherent at <4' listening distances. The ELT525's are great at both.

I think a really great sounding, relatively compact monitor in the $700-$1000 range would be fantastic. A powered version would be even better, but I'm not totally sure who makes an affordable plate amp that could be used for such a thing. I suggested to Craig over at TCA that he look into modifying the gizmo to create a plate version for just such a purpose. It already creates very little heat, it sounds decent (could be better with some component upgrades) is fairly small, and while low power it would be fine with relatively high sensitivity speakers. It gets my 83.5 db/w/m speakers plenty loud with the ulw-10 helping out on the lows. I just think a powered monitor, while not totally in tune with standard audiophile tastes, would allow you to tailor the speaker to ensure the combo will give the flattest possible response as well as making the whole setup as compact and simple as possible - great for project studios AND desktop listening systems.

Anyhow, just wanted to throw that out there. I've been thinking about that one for a while and this seemed a relevant thread in which to do so.

stevenkelby · « **Reply #15 on:** 23 Jun 2009, 07:32 am »

I think $1000 for a couple of very small, boxed, coaxials or a 2 way system, plus a sub, all powered (Virtue?) would sell great for desktop use.

srlaudio · « **Reply #16 on:** 23 Jun 2009, 01:06 pm »

My recommendation is this monitor http://www.slsloudspeakers.com/content/view/81/111/

It is a great value, and requires an amplifier. They also make a powered version.....

woofersus · « **Reply #17 on:** 23 Jun 2009, 02:37 pm »

Those look pretty nice. SLS makes some really nice looking stuff. Unfortunately I haven't ever gotten the opportunity to hear any of it. (that I know of) I like the S8R, although it is a bit large to be considered a desktop speaker. They seem to be a decently good deal at the $900 they appear to be going for. The $1800 for the powered versions may be less of a good deal, but I'm sure it's top notch amplification, so maybe it still is.

I'm a little curious how close something like the N2X is to that, and could Danny design a stepped up version for a little more money. Of course he may have completely different ideas about a great compact desktop speaker/reference monitor for $1k, but I'm attached to the ribbon concept a little, and I'm not sure OB would be suitable for the application, so this does seem like the general direction.

Another thing to consider is that even those would ultimately need to be accompanied by a subwoofer. 44hz is pretty good for a speaker that size, but I have to get a little lower than that to mix drum tracks. Considering the the goal of compactness in order to facilitate the dual purpose of being a high end desktop system AND good bang-for-your-buck studio monitors, it might be necessary to assume a 2.1 system from the start. All that aside, I'm curious what Danny would do with a $1k assembled price target for a compact monitor. There are some really good speakers available in that price range. It's a crowded segment, all except for the compact desktop part.

EARGASM · « **Reply #18 on:** 23 Jun 2009, 02:43 pm »

Removed by member. Contact GR RESEARCH for flat pack info.

Danny Richie · « **Reply #19 on:** 23 Jun 2009, 03:04 pm »

I'd really question that accuracy of the SLS model, and at $900, the quality of the components. I really don't see it as making much of a comparison to the N2X. Also for a little more money I don't see the N2X getting much better aside from by-passing the caps with Sonicap Platinum's. That speaker already has top level drivers and crossover parts.

And for a desk top system to play even close to full range, a sub is going to be a given.