N2X model on demo tour...

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Danny Richie

Re: N2X model on demo tour...
« Reply #140 on: 28 Mar 2010, 09:45 pm »
I voiced them with the top end tipped up about 1db so that when you turn the speakers about 10 degrees off axis (typical) then it produces a flat response. This typically gives a more even in room response. But if ones tastes are for a softer presentation then that is easily adjusted. One resistor change and your there. On that pair I mounted that last shunt resistor right to the tweeter so that it would be easy to remove it and make any fine adjustments.

Driver discontinuities? That is a bit of a puzzler. This is one of the speakers stronger areas, and it is partially due to a low crossover point. The low crossover point allows for less phase shift over a wider area and a more even in room response too. These drivers typically blend a LOT smoother than most.

The slower discharge rate of the Auricaps (also somewhat coloring) tend to smear the signal together a little more. This is what the ML1's use and could be what makes the ML1 seem as if they have greater coherency, but it might not really be accurate.

I get the same effect going from the standard kit and Erse caps to Sonicaps. The Erse caps give a nice smooth coherent sound at the expensive of separation of individual details.

The fact that the comparison to the ML1 is even close makes me want to get ahold of a pair and check them out.

Thanks for the feedback.

groovybassist

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Re: N2X model on demo tour...
« Reply #141 on: 28 Mar 2010, 10:41 pm »
Danny:

Thanks for the info.  I did all of my listening toed-in, but off axis a bit as I've found most speakers sound too bright/hard when I listen to them on axis, so I think we're definitely on the same page here.  That tweeter is so clear, I have to wonder if the woofer may not be quite keeping up (not in a timing sense, but a clarity sense), hence my comment on texture of instruments.  Accurate or not, the ML1s produce a slightly more realistic sense of the instrument vs. the sound the instrument produces.  It's not a huge difference by any means, but to my ears, it's there.  I don't think the ML1s are sacrificing details - they're there, but to my ears seem better blended within the whole.  Guess that's why folks like you and Mike Lenehan get paid the big bucks!  Remember everyone, I can just tell you what I hear as an individual - your experience may be the complete opposite of mine.

-Mike

Danny Richie

Re: N2X model on demo tour...
« Reply #142 on: 28 Mar 2010, 11:35 pm »
Again, I appreciate your feedback.

I don't know that Mike Lenehan or I are really making the big bucks yet. Few people in the audio Industry are getting rich right now.

But I have learned how to get a good handle on it. I can make that N2X do just about anything and sound just about any way a person wants. The trick is trying to find the right balance for everyone.

I can drop some Platinum by-pass caps on the Sonicaps and take the whole speaker up another level. I have quite a few order theirs that way and many others add them later.

If I want to drop the sound stage back a little then I just recess the mid-range slightly and it will put it deeper in the sound stage.

If someone likes that speaker but wants more bass from it then they can build it out as a small floor standing speaker. That will actually let it play about 15Hz lower.

There are a ton of little tweaks that can be done with a speaker like the N2X and that is one of the great things about the DIY market. You can build out a pair to look and sound just about any way you want.

I'd still love to hear the ML1's though.

groovybassist

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Re: N2X model on demo tour...
« Reply #143 on: 28 Mar 2010, 11:59 pm »
Now that's what I'd like to hear - taking this design to another level, knowing that it will cost significantly more, but be a real assault on the big buck contenders.  I'd be curious to know what the cost would be for the kit that you think takes the Neo2X to that place. 

It would be great if we each had a formula for what floats our boat.  This would all be so much simpler!  I'm sympathetic on the income front - given how much enjoyment we get from our systems, the folks who develop/build them should be more appreciated. 

Maybe someday you'll run into one of the ML1 variants.  I have the standard model - they how have a Plus version and maybe even others.  Time marches on...

-Mike

oz_audio_todd

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Re: N2X model on demo tour...
« Reply #144 on: 29 Mar 2010, 12:03 am »
Hey Groovy,
Thanks for ur thoughts on the comparison between the Gr's and probably the best bookshelves I have ever heard (recently heard the Dynaudio X-12's, which were also really nice thou!).
Having said that, considering the GR's are literally a fraction of the price and seem to be a solid compeditor, then I think that speaks for itself, if someone feels they can cut and glue MDF  : )
Thanks again  :)

groovybassist

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Re: N2X model on demo tour...
« Reply #145 on: 29 Mar 2010, 12:17 am »
oz_audio_todd:

No doubt about it - at the price the Neo2X's are a great deal, especially if you have the woodworking skills.  Glad I could give you some food for thought.

-Mike

m-fine

Re: N2X model on demo tour...
« Reply #146 on: 29 Mar 2010, 01:13 am »
I'd be curious to know what the cost would be for the kit that you think takes the Neo2X to that place.

If you go all out and get the listed upgrades plus Sonicap Platinum bypass caps, foil inductors and no-rez, you should be just under $800 plus the cabinet cost.  You can do a cab for $30 if you don't care what it looks like (raw mdf?).  If it has to look as good as it sounds, someone else has to build it for you, and you also want someone else to build the crosovers and install them for you, the price can go way up.

LenehanAudio

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Re: N2X model on demo tour...
« Reply #147 on: 29 Mar 2010, 05:10 am »
Hi Mike

sounds like your ML1's are still running well stateside ! great to hear from you ! and Danny the N2X looks like a nice speaker . Very high quality parts ! what does the kit sell for ?

We will be releasing a kit speaker soon also. 6.5 inch two way with soft dome tweeter. The entire enclosure will be CNC'd out and will include fully built Xover . For economical freight the drivers could be sourced locally so you'll just need to order the ready to go flat pack enclosure and Xover network.

The Xover also will be available in levels 1,2 and 3 .  Where hoping for around USD$750 sans drivers. This will be a genuine Hi performance loudspeaker. you'll just need to build it yourself. There will be a very comprehensive instruction sheet as well .Also it's such a low buy price it probably wont attract customs and import attentions.         Best Regards Mike Lenehan
                                                                                                   LenehanAudio


groovybassist

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Re: N2X model on demo tour...
« Reply #148 on: 29 Mar 2010, 01:52 pm »
Mike:

My ML1s are indeed running well.  I just switched from Naim amplification to a Wyred4Sound STI-500 Integrated Amp and the ML1s are loving it.

The Neo2X is a nice speaker and sounds great for the money (kits start about $350USD with some parts upgrade options available from there).  It's great there are so many options out there for the DIY enthusiast to get great sound on a budget.  Your kit will be an intriguing new entry in the fray!

-Mike

Danny Richie

Re: N2X model on demo tour...
« Reply #149 on: 29 Mar 2010, 03:11 pm »
Quote
Now that's what I'd like to hear - taking this design to another level, knowing that it will cost significantly more, but be a real assault on the big buck contenders.  I'd be curious to know what the cost would be for the kit that you think takes the Neo2X to that place. 


The least expensive way to take the whole thing up a level across the board to by-pass the caps with Sonicap Platinum's. It is a Teflon composite film and foil cap. By-passing all six caps with a .033uF Platinum will cost $120.

This slightly improves sound stage depth and separation between instruments, vocals, etc. Low level details are better and resolution across the board.

Several here have posted comments after adding the Platinum's to their speakers. You'll just have to do a little searching for it.

Hello Mike Lenehan,

Thanks for dropping by and welcome to AC.

It sounds like you have a really nice product. Maybe the next time you are at RMAF I will come by to give them a listen.

The kit market is a pretty good market. I ship quite a few of them to your big island over there on a regular basis. Shipping cost is a bit of an obstacle though. There is just no getting around it and the bigger the kit and the heavier it is then the harder it is to land the overseas sales.

You never know though, if the speakers are really good the people seem to be willing to cover the shipping cost. I have shipped about 15 pairs of our Super-V and V-1 kits overseas, and all the drivers, parts, and pieces that come with the kit weigh about 170 pounds and that does not include any cabinets.

I have also been sticking with kits because it keeps me out of the retail market. I do a lot of design work for various companies and if I launched my own retail products (fully completed speakers) then I'd be competing with some of them. So I really wouldn't want to jeopardize any reduction in those monthly royalty checks.  :eyebrows:

Many of my commercial designs have done real well over the past few years. I posted most of the awards that they have won on my services page: http://www.gr-research.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWCATS&Category=14  Then the awareness of the awards and publicity from the awards has brought good awareness to our kits.

This one is one that I just designed the crossover only for, but they kind of set a bench mark for mini-monitors here in the states: http://www.usheraudiousa.com/products/loudspeakers/dancer-series/Be-718 They won an industry award just about everywhere. Stereophile still has them in the class A recommended list too. If you can get ahold of US model then it can be a good benchmark for you. It sounds like you are already at that level and at a good price point too. You just have the hard part ahead of you. Marketing! That's the hardest part.
« Last Edit: 29 Mar 2010, 08:01 pm by Danny »

magic12kenneth

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Re: N2X model on demo tour...
« Reply #150 on: 29 Mar 2010, 07:42 pm »
Danny, is the demo pair coming to California, soon? If so I'm interested in demo one.

groovybassist: Thanks for the write up. Very impressive. I have a quite question for you. How is the sweet spot when comparing N2X and ML-1? One of the best monitor regarding sweet spot is the NXT XD (http://www.audioholics.com/reviews/speakers/satellite/nht-xd-loudspeaker-system-review). The sweet spot is as big as the soundstage and fills the room. Another one is Gallo Reference 3.5 or Gallo Strada.

Ken

groovybassist

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Re: N2X model on demo tour...
« Reply #151 on: 29 Mar 2010, 09:13 pm »
I've found with most speakers, the real sweet spot is typically pretty small.  Small movements from one side to the other will typically demonstrate how small that central sweet spot really is.  The ML1s and Neo2X's are very similar in terms of sweet spot - I didn't notice any real difference.  Both will sound really sweet when you're in it, but lose some of the magic if you're off-center.  Mind you, both speakers still sound good off-center, but for me, the sweet spot is typically in a relatively narrow central location.

oz_audio_todd

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Re: N2X model on demo tour...
« Reply #152 on: 29 Mar 2010, 11:01 pm »
What the....??? There's gonna be a Lenahan Audio kit now??? Seriously, Mike and Danny, cant u 2 make it just a little bit easy for me to chose my next set of speakers??????

groovybassist

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Re: N2X model on demo tour...
« Reply #153 on: 30 Mar 2010, 02:12 pm »
Danny:

Any word on next N2X destination?  Thanks.

-Mike

NeilT

Re: N2X model on demo tour...
« Reply #154 on: 30 Mar 2010, 06:12 pm »
So Cal?

Danny Richie

Re: N2X model on demo tour...
« Reply #155 on: 30 Mar 2010, 08:12 pm »
Well the other guy in WA has not responded so I have contacted the next guy that is in CA to see if he is ready.

Neil, there are two more CA guys, counting this one, ahead of you right now. Hang in there.

NeilT

Re: N2X model on demo tour...
« Reply #156 on: 30 Mar 2010, 08:29 pm »
Thanks Danny

magic12kenneth

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Re: N2X model on demo tour...
« Reply #157 on: 1 Apr 2010, 04:03 am »
Danny: Thanks for the update. Check your PM. Interested in demo the NX2.

Danny, maybe you can enlight us on this subject. The NHT XD is such a small size monitor but it can produce a sweet spot as big as the soundstage itself. The speaker basically fills the room and disappear. Walking around the room, it almost sounds as you are in the sweet spot. How is that possible?

Kenneth

groovybassist

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Re: N2X model on demo tour...
« Reply #158 on: 1 Apr 2010, 05:16 am »
No offense to you CA guys, but I'm rooting for WA - I could meet the Orting guy half-way - a lot cheaper than shipping this heavy box!  Well, I guess we'll see where they're headed soon enough...

magic12kenneth

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Re: N2X model on demo tour...
« Reply #159 on: 1 Apr 2010, 05:28 am »
Ahh...  :duh: I almost forgot to thank you groovybassist for answering my questions.  :thumb: Big thanks!!!

Yeah, that makes more sense. You can ask Danny to do that to save some shipping cost. I'm not in hurry here...