[rahimlee54]

Should I be trying to get a DAC and less expensive cd player now as a opposed to waiting?  Should my question be DAC <500, with a oppo 980? Will this give me a better sounding system then a former flagship CDP?

Thoughts

Yes.  That's the only way I would go.  If something happens to the CD player, you can always get another cheao one and run it through the DAC.  Heck, you can use any old CD player that has a digital output when paired with a DAC.  The DAC in the DAC will render the CD player's useless, so why spend a bunch of money on a CD player AND a DAC?

All transport don't sound alike and digital cables make a big difference in sound Don't kid yourself about that a a good transport is just as important as the dac

ED

Will something along the lines of an Oppo plus a resonalbe DAC sound worse, better, or the same as a 3-4 year old "high end" cd player for around the same price ~700.  In your opinion of course.

[ecramer]

As far as as your  last question goes two many answers for that here's a couple of my suggestion


this would be a couple of my choices

Transport

http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?dgtlplay&1245038036&/ONIX-XCD-99
dac
http://www.cryo-parts.com/music_hall_audio.html



cdp standalone
http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?dgtlplay&1244912109&/Arcam-FMJ-33

http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?dgtlplay&1243046220&/Modwright-Sony-9000es-Signatur

[Nuance]

All transport don't sound alike and digital cables make a big difference in sound Don't kid yourself about that a a good transport is just as important as the dac

ED

I never said they all sound alike.  I said they WILL sound alike if you run them through a DAC (the same DAC).  In that case, any transport will do since it is being run through the DAC. Please re-read what I posted. 

[oneinthepipe]

That looks like a good deal on the Arcam, which I might want to pick up to use as a transport for my other DAC.  

I haven't heard the Music Hall DAC, but I didn't think the Music Hall CD25.2 CDP was anything to write home about, and at that price, I would look at a used AVA DAC.  Jim demonstrates his products with AVA gear, and Jim stated that the AVA DAC "really shines."   Although I am a loyal AVA customer and recommend AVA gear without any reservation, the bargain shopper should note that the PS Audio III DAC is on clearance for $700.00 brand new from the factory.  Again, while I haven't heard the Music Hall DAC, I think that I would scrape up the additional $200.00 and get the PS Audio DAC, based upon others' reviews.

[oneinthepipe]

All transport don't sound alike and digital cables make a big difference in sound Don't kid yourself about that a a good transport is just as important as the dac

ED

I never said they all sound alike.  I said they WILL sound alike if you run them through a DAC (the same DAC).  In that case, any transport will do since it is being run through the DAC. Please re-read what I posted. 

One thing to keep in mind, besides jitter and the like, is the CDP or DVP's noisiness.  There were several of us, who post on the AVA forum, that had varying experiences with a $39.99 Philips DVP.  For me, the switched power supply, most likely, threw so much noise into my system that the entire sound was deteriorated by just having the Philips DVP powered up.  Whether the problem was dirty AC or RFI or something else, the solution was easy.  I took the Philips out of the system and obtained a quieter transport.  In the future, I will always try to ascertain that the power supply, on any component that I purchase, is quiet. 

I can also offer an opinion on another CDP, the Jolida CD 100.  The AVA DAC blows it out of the water.  The Jolida made a nice transport, however.

[toobluvr]

The original Rega Planet is well under $300 and still holds its own.  Ooooodles of reviews can be found on the net, I'm sure.

The Rega Apollo can be had for a bit over your budget.  I believe it is supposed to be better than the Planet.

I had it in my system for awhile.   It is good and deserves its accolades as a great value performer.  It can be had for 600 to 700 used.

If you can stretch your budget to 600 to 800, for one box players, there are others I would choose before the Apollo:

Arcam 23t
Resolution Audio CD55 (or CD50)
Cary 308t

And even cheaper, at around 500 bucks, I would go for:

EE Minimax cdp
Consonance Opera Linear 120

I have owned all of the above players.  As you can see I prefer tubed, or tube-like sound.
And they all have it.  They are all musical and engaging players.  Arcam is probably the most neutral....almost dry compared to the others.

I think the Linear 120 is excellent and may be the sleeper in the bunch.  It has an engaging and soulful character.  Just a touch flat dimensionally compared to better players.  But this player (and most other Consonance products) is prone to operational glitches.   Its price has been driven down because of this, but purely from a sonic perspective, I think it is tremendous for the $$.

My faves disregarding price are the Cary and Resolution Audio.  The EE minimax is also very nice.

[zybar]

All transport don't sound alike and digital cables make a big difference in sound Don't kid yourself about that a a good transport is just as important as the dac

ED

I never said they all sound alike.  I said they WILL sound alike if you run them through a DAC (the same DAC).  In that case, any transport will do since it is being run through the DAC. Please re-read what I posted. 

Ummm...all transports do not sound the same, but that is for another thread to discuss.

George

[golfugh]

Agreed on both accounts

[Nuance]

All transport don't sound alike and digital cables make a big difference in sound Don't kid yourself about that a a good transport is just as important as the dac

ED

I never said they all sound alike.  I said they WILL sound alike if you run them through a DAC (the same DAC).  In that case, any transport will do since it is being run through the DAC. Please re-read what I posted. 

Ummm...all transports do not sound the same, but that is for another thread to discuss.

George

That topic is highly debatable and subjective, but yes, for another thread.  For what it's worth, though, I assumed a crappy $50 POS wouldn't be being used.  To clarify, most, if not all properly designed/good CD transports (CD Players) will sound the same when level match and run through the same ecternal DAC. in the same room using the same equipment. 

Those that disagree can start a new thread on biasing and ABX tests. 

[Nuance]

All transport don't sound alike and digital cables make a big difference in sound Don't kid yourself about that a a good transport is just as important as the dac

ED

I never said they all sound alike.  I said they WILL sound alike if you run them through a DAC (the same DAC).  In that case, any transport will do since it is being run through the DAC. Please re-read what I posted. 

One thing to keep in mind, besides jitter and the like, is the CDP or DVP's noisiness.  There were several of us, who post on the AVA forum, that had varying experiences with a $39.99 Philips DVP.  For me, the switched power supply, most likely, threw so much noise into my system that the entire sound was deteriorated by just having the Philips DVP powered up.  Whether the problem was dirty AC or RFI or something else, the solution was easy.  I took the Philips out of the system and obtained a quieter transport.  In the future, I will always try to ascertain that the power supply, on any component that I purchase, is quiet. 

I can also offer an opinion on another CDP, the Jolida CD 100.  The AVA DAC blows it out of the water.  The Jolida made a nice transport, however.

Again, for another thread, but jitter in most, if not all consumer electronics has been found to be inaudible, even if it does very from one product to another.  There have been tests performed about this very thing.  But yeah, this is getting off topic.  hehe.

P.S.  Switching power supplies can equal more noise, so I'd recommend staying away from them. 

[rahimlee54]

As far as as your  last question goes two many answers for that here's a couple of my suggestion


this would be a couple of my choices

Transport

http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?dgtlplay&1245038036&/ONIX-XCD-99
dac
http://www.cryo-parts.com/music_hall_audio.html



cdp standalone
http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?dgtlplay&1244912109&/Arcam-FMJ-33

http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?dgtlplay&1243046220&/Modwright-Sony-9000es-Signatur

I was already checking out one of those arcam players, I really like their stuff personally, the couple times I heard it anyway.  Cant decide which way to jump currently a little more researching for me.  I do enjoy the suggestions and picking up a bit of knowledge is always good.  I was going to go mostly HT with my setup but after hearing the ST with music I decided that was worth the expense of adding associated equipment.

My only prob with that is there would be no way to play DVDA or SACD, neither of which I own but would like to try at some point.

Thanks
Jared

[Nuance]

As far as as your  last question goes two many answers for that here's a couple of my suggestion


this would be a couple of my choices

Transport

http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?dgtlplay&1245038036&/ONIX-XCD-99
dac
http://www.cryo-parts.com/music_hall_audio.html



cdp standalone
http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?dgtlplay&1244912109&/Arcam-FMJ-33

http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?dgtlplay&1243046220&/Modwright-Sony-9000es-Signatur

I was already checking out one of those arcam players, I really like their stuff personally, the couple times I heard it anyway.  Cant decide which way to jump currently a little more researching for me.  I do enjoy the suggestions and picking up a bit of knowledge is always good.  I was going to go mostly HT with my setup but after hearing the ST with music I decided that was worth the expense of adding associated equipment.

My only prob with that is there would be no way to play DVDA or SACD, neither of which I own but would like to try at some point.

Thanks
Jared

That is a gorgeous piece, but like you said, no DVD-A or SACD.  That's why I think getting an Oppo 980 or 983 and pairing with a nice DAC would be ideal (check out the PS Audio Digital Link III.  There are a few for sale through audiogon).  You could always get the new Oppo too, and pair that with a DAC.  That would probably be quite the winning combo IMO.

Whatever you go with, listen first if possible.  Oh, if you want to try out gear with 30-days to ensure you like it, you can find good stuff from Audio Advisor.  Their "open box" stuff is a steal.

[ecramer]

All transport don't sound alike and digital cables make a big difference in sound Don't kid yourself about that a a good transport is just as important as the dac

ED

I never said they all sound alike.  I said they WILL sound alike if you run them through a DAC (the same DAC).  In that case, any transport will do since it is being run through the DAC. Please re-read what I posted. 

The problem is,  I don't believe that's true, I can hear a difference between my opera consonsance cdp and my Onix cdp when they are both hooked up to my northstar dac but that just might be me. Ive heard it several times at raves

ED

[ecramer]

I heard the Music Hall dac at Shadowlights mini rave a couple of weeks ago most of us agreed it was better than Levis PS audio dac and cheaper I thought it sounded good for the money.

That looks like a good deal on the Arcam, which I might want to pick up to use as a transport for my other DAC.  

I haven't heard the Music Hall DAC, but I didn't think the Music Hall CD25.2 CDP was anything to write home about, and at that price, I would look at a used AVA DAC.  Jim demonstrates his products with AVA gear, and Jim stated that the AVA DAC "really shines."   Although I am a loyal AVA customer and recommend AVA gear without any reservation, the bargain shopper should note that the PS Audio III DAC is on clearance for $700.00 brand new from the factory.  Again, while I haven't heard the Music Hall DAC, I think that I would scrape up the additional $200.00 and get the PS Audio DAC, based upon others' reviews.

[Nuance]

All transport don't sound alike and digital cables make a big difference in sound Don't kid yourself about that a a good transport is just as important as the dac

ED

I never said they all sound alike.  I said they WILL sound alike if you run them through a DAC (the same DAC).  In that case, any transport will do since it is being run through the DAC. Please re-read what I posted. 

The problem is,  I don't believe that's true, I can hear a difference between my opera consonsance cdp and my Onix cdp when they are both hooked up to my northstar dac but that just might be me. Ive heard it several times at raves

ED

I'd bet you couldn't tell which was which under double blind/bias controlled level match tests.    Seriously, lets create a new thread if we're going to continue this debate. 

[Nuance]

I heard the Music Hall dac at Shadowlights mini rave a couple of weeks ago most of us agreed it was better than Levis PS audio dac and cheaper I thought it sounded good for the money.

You heard it at a rave?  And you heard a difference under those conditions?  Uh uh...

[ecramer]

NO debates, useless to have any discussion on transports or cables,  not interested at all in discussing if anybody thinks they make a difference to a system

Ed

[Nuance]

Okay then.  lol.

[JLM]

One option is an Oppo DV-980H ($170) and let Ric Shultz at Tweakaudio.com mod it ($450 and up).

Another option is an Oppo DV-980H with a Behringer DEQ2496 and let Shultz or Scott Endler at mysite.verizon.net/vze4c5pt mod the Behringer ($245 - 475).  This would add room/speaker EQ.

Or just get the Oppo DV-980H and add a DAC later on if you feel the need.

I'm "slumming" with an old 970 (actually am most impressed for the price) and found that adding a 2x8x16 concrete paver on top with a towel inbetween does wonders for it (have never been a believer that feet/weights/platforms/racks helped the sound).  I'll be trying 1/2 inch birch with and without thin foam for a more professional solution.

[charmerci]

To me, it seems like a waste of time not to get at least a decent DAC, i.e. under 1K, even if it means waiting a while or putting it on a cc. I'd personally pair it with a 100-250 CD changer. (Though I'm not so sure about the reliability of the multi-changers.)