Montreal Audio Show 2009

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alexone

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Re: Montreal Audio Show 2009
« Reply #40 on: 6 Apr 2009, 01:01 pm »

...James where are you?? aa


al.

drummermitchell

Re: Montreal Audio Show 2009
« Reply #41 on: 6 Apr 2009, 01:04 pm »
I think he's grabbing a coffee as I'm about to do.

James Tanner

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Re: Montreal Audio Show 2009
« Reply #42 on: 6 Apr 2009, 01:08 pm »

...James where are you?? aa


al.

Just got home from Montreal but my mother had a bad fall while I was away and broke her wrist so I am off to the hospital for a visit - I HATE getting old!

james

predrag

Re: Montreal Audio Show 2009
« Reply #43 on: 6 Apr 2009, 02:08 pm »
James,

We all wish her a quick recovery just like yourself after the trip.

Looking forward to reading your thoughts about the past show!

All the best!

danman

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Re: Montreal Audio Show 2009
« Reply #44 on: 6 Apr 2009, 02:45 pm »
Sorry to hear about that James. Take care of your mother.

I meant I wanted your opinion of how the Brystons sounded with those lovely CLX's. I know the Bryston's are already the best but I want to know your thoughts of the match.

alexone

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Re: Montreal Audio Show 2009
« Reply #45 on: 6 Apr 2009, 06:58 pm »

...James where are you?? aa


al.

Just got home from Montreal but my mother had a bad fall while I was away and broke her wrist so I am off to the hospital for a visit - I HATE getting old!

james


i am sorry to hear that, James. hope your mom is getting well soon.

al.

James Tanner

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Re: Montreal Audio Show 2009
« Reply #46 on: 6 Apr 2009, 07:01 pm »
Sorry to hear about that James. Take care of your mother.

I meant I wanted your opinion of how the Brystons sounded with those lovely CLX's. I know the Bryston's are already the best but I want to know your thoughts of the match.

Hi danman,

OK I will work on a short show review for you.
I will say though what has been extremely positive over the last couple of years is the fact that we have been able to get glowing reports with a number of differerent speakers at these shows. So my question is: "What amplifier company has attained state of the art sound with all these different speakers- Thiel, Magnepan, JBL, PMC, Martin Logan, etc.---- BRYSTON"

james


James Tanner

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Re: Montreal Audio Show 2009
« Reply #47 on: 6 Apr 2009, 07:07 pm »
d

werd

Re: Montreal Audio Show 2009
« Reply #48 on: 6 Apr 2009, 07:08 pm »
Sorry to hear about that James. Take care of your mother.

I meant I wanted your opinion of how the Brystons sounded with those lovely CLX's. I know the Bryston's are already the best but I want to know your thoughts of the match.

Hi Danman,

OK I will work on a short show review for you.
I will say though what has been extremely positive over the last couple of years is the fact that we have been able to get glowing reports with a number of differerent speakers at these shows. So my question is: "What amplifier company has attained state of the art sound with all these different speakers- Thiel, Magnepan, JBL, PMC, Martin Logan, etc.---- BRYSTON"

james



Acoustic Zen too, sorry to hear about your mom.

danman

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Re: Montreal Audio Show 2009
« Reply #49 on: 6 Apr 2009, 07:20 pm »
I would not doubt anything you say. When you make equipment as good as Bryston, there is no surprise to what you said.

Moon Doggy

Re: Montreal Audio Show 2009
« Reply #50 on: 6 Apr 2009, 08:18 pm »
Wishing a speedy recovery for your Mom.

James Tanner

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Re: Montreal Audio Show 2009
« Reply #51 on: 6 Apr 2009, 10:28 pm »
Bryston Montreal 2009 Show Report

Well folks this year we teamed up with our dealer ‘Son Ideal’ to do a show demo at the 2009 Montreal Audio Show.

The equipment used was:
From Bryston:
BrystonBP26/MPS-2 preamp, the BCD-1 CD Player, the BDA-1 External DAC and the two 28B Mono Amplifiers, Bryston interconnect cables
From Martin Logan:
Pair of Martin Logan CLX Full-range Electrostatic Speakers
Two Descent i woofers
From Torus:
Two- RM-15 Power Conditioners (isolation transformers).
From MAC:
Mac laptop computer as music server.

The room was quite large at 18x28x10.

The Martin Logan’s are a 2-way full-range electrostatic speaker (if 55Hz is enough of a full-range for you).  In this large demo room we had to augment the lower frequencies with two of the Martin Logan ‘Descent i’ woofers. (http://www.us.martinlogan.com/speaker_intro/descent_i.html ) The integration worked quite well and other than a bit of a bump around 50-60 cycles it was hard to tell where the woofer/panels overlapped. The speakers were about 8 feet into the room and about 10 feet apart edge to edge with the mid/tweeter panels on the inside and the speakers slightly tilted towards the listening position. The woofers were behind about 3 feet and slightly to the inside of the main left/right panels. The speaker is a 2-way design crossed over at 360Hz with a flat bass panel and a curved mid/tweeter panel.  (http://www.us.martinlogan.com/speaker_intro/clx.html )

The speaker absolutely disappeared in our demo room as long as you were relatively centered between the speakers. As you moved off axis the mid/top frequencies start to fall off rather rapidly to the point where the speaker starts to sound bottom heavy.  Martin Logan even recommends that the listening axis be about 1/3rd of the way in on the curved panel section of the speaker.  As with any large panel the image is more diffused than a typical point source but it’s an intoxicating bigger than life presentation. The front to back soundstage was deep and wide and the ability to throw an image off to the side and forward or back was excellent. In a smaller room you might be able to get away with just the panels and not require the dynamic woofers but only if your listening taste does not require the last two bottom octaves. A smaller room will have a certain amount of ‘room gain’ so sometimes this lack of very low frequency capability is not as big an issue as you might assume.  The Quad 2905’s in my small room at home actually sound reasonably powerful in the 40-50Hz region but in my big room they simply can not pressurize the room in the same way.

Their ability to play at loud levels for a panel with relatively limited driver excursion surprised me. Usually panel type speakers can sound good at low to medium sound pressure levels but become constricted and hard as you push the levels up – (dynamic compression). The CLX’s easily filled the large demo room with concert hall levels and unless you got nuts about it and wanted 110dB plus levels everything sounded very realistic.  This was really apparent on some recordings where the vocalist would go from a whisper to a crescendo and the power and control in the voice never approached the dreaded ‘strain factor’. The upper bass region does not have the punch or visceral impact of some of the more traditional dynamic woofers but certainly better than many of the other electrostatics I am familiar with.

The main strength of the Martin Logan CLX’s in my opinion is their incredible ability to reproduce the initial transient in the music that almost makes the Quad 2905’s sound slow!  I have some reservations here though as sometimes that ability to reproduce the initial ictus in the transient gets compromised by the overshoot (ringing) that occurs in large panel diaphragms due to lack of damping. So the ear loves the initial attack but there is a bit of an after-shoot that causes some instruments to sound a little ‘twang-y’.  It seems like the CLX has minimized this to a large degree though so kudos to a job well done.

Warning:  bad recordings will sound bad! The CLX resolves very well indeed and over compressed poorly mastered recordings will be ruthlessly exposed by this speaker. It reminds me of the Thiel 3.7’s in that regard.  One of the issues that constantly come up at these shows is whether to take or not take requests. That gentleman or lady sheepishly hands you their favorite CD and with pleading eyes says “please sir can you play this”? You cure it up being very careful with the volume and pray that this person’s taste in quality reproduced music matches your own. Sometimes you get lucky and the selection request highlights the attributes’ of the demo system and sometimes you play the selection at as low a volume and as short a time as you can get away with so as not to insult the customer. So be warned this is not a speaker for compressed mp3 iPods.

Some speakers have the ability to place the performance in the room with you as opposed to just allowing an open window on the performance.  That quality where the resolving ability of the component allows you to hear the space and nuances of the recording venue. The CLX’s have the ability to put the performers and instruments in the room with you. You can feel their presence and the ability to move you emotionally is extraordinary. If you have the room – highly recommended.

james

danman

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Re: Montreal Audio Show 2009
« Reply #52 on: 7 Apr 2009, 03:15 pm »
Great write up James.

I have attended a few of these shows in Montreal and I know that the conditions are less than ideal in a hotel room. The Martin Logans don't really like that kind of environment so if you were impressed than it goes to show that overall, the total unit you put together work well as a whole.

As good as the Martin Logan sub is, I can only imagine if the CLX would have been paired with 2 JL Audio units that I had the privaledge of listening to last year! These were by far the best subs I have ever heard! Extremely fast and probably the best match for panels but that is my personal opinion. I am not even sure if they distribute them in Canada!

I would of loved to have heard this system as I am both a Martin Logan owner and Bryston lover and this would be my dream kit. I will have some regrets for a while I am sure!

werd

Re: Montreal Audio Show 2009
« Reply #53 on: 7 Apr 2009, 03:30 pm »
Great write up James.

I have attended a few of these shows in Montreal and I know that the conditions are less than ideal in a hotel room. The Martin Logans don't really like that kind of environment so if you were impressed than it goes to show that overall, the total unit you put together work well as a whole.

As good as the Martin Logan sub is, I can only imagine if the CLX would have been paired with 2 JL Audio units that I had the privaledge of listening to last year! These were by far the best subs I have ever heard! Extremely fast and probably the best match for panels but that is my personal opinion. I am not even sure if they distribute them in Canada!

I would of loved to have heard this system as I am both a Martin Logan owner and Bryston lover and this would be my dream kit. I will have some regrets for a while I am sure!
Hey Danman

i am sure your  new 4b that will be arriving today will alleviate any grief....

danman

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Re: Montreal Audio Show 2009
« Reply #54 on: 7 Apr 2009, 03:40 pm »
Still not here yet! Can't wait to see the FedEx guy or at least he better show up!!!

werd

Re: Montreal Audio Show 2009
« Reply #55 on: 7 Apr 2009, 03:51 pm »
Still not here yet! Can't wait to see the FedEx guy or at least he better show up!!!

surprised he hasnt showed yet. What colour did u get on the 4b?

James Tanner

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Re: Montreal Audio Show 2009
« Reply #56 on: 7 Apr 2009, 11:36 pm »
STEREOPHILE REPORT MONTREAL AUDIO SHOW 2009

MartinLogan meets Bryston
Posted Mon Apr 6, 2009, 1:41 PM ET — By Robert Deutsch
 


Asked to name the top three drawbacks of electrostatic loudspeakers, the knowledgeable audiophile will list—not necessarily in this order—restricted listening area, inability to play loud, and limited bass extension. Although the last criticism can still be applied to the new MartinLogan CLX (its claimed bass –3dB point is 56Hz), the speaker's design has gone a major way toward addressing the other two criticisms.
Introduced as the successor to the famed CLS (or CLZ), the CLX strikes me more like an altogether different speaker. It's quite a bit wider than the old CLS, but it's not as big as I thought it would be based on pictures I've seen. It follows the curvilinear driver design of the original CLS, the consequent wider dispersion creating a wider sweet spot.

The CLX certainly delivers on the promise of being more than a one-listener-in-the-sweet-spot speaker, but what but what really blew me away were the dynamics. Aided and abetted by a pair of Descent 1 subwoofers ($3000 each), the rest of the system made up of Bryston components (BCD-1 CD player, BD-A1 DAC, BP26 preamp, 28B SST2 power amps), this system kicked ass in a way that was difficult to credit to electrostatics. I suspect the Bryston amps (1000W!) were a major contributor here. I understand that, in typical electrostatic fashion, the impedance of the CLX goes very low in the treble, a characteristics that many amps have trouble dealing with—but not the Brystons. The sound was loud and clear, with a tremendous "punch."

Criticisms? Well, I would expect a speaker that costs CN$22,000/pair (about to be increased to $25,000) to be full-range, or, if not full-range, the price should be lower to allow budgeting for a pair of subwoofers





Reader Comments 

Posted Tue Apr 7, 2009, 9:44 AM — By Shawn

I'm now forced to examine my preconceptions regarding the "Bryston" sound.

This system really surprised me in that the 1000W 28SST^2 mated with the Bryston pre, dac, and transport were able to sound delicate even timid and tremulous when the music called for it. Often times big power amps can't play the blushing virgin very well. The presentation was also not particularly forward, it was confident relaxed and the sound came effortlessly instead of with an under current of "need to impress".

However, I wasn't particularly taken with the speakers. There were several parts in the music I had played which I've heard on many many speakers. On these ones every once in a while a certain note (midrange frequency) would "blurt" a little. Not sure how better to describe it. The mechanics behind the sound could be clearly heard to interfere with it. The bass in the room was not over done and integrated nicely.


danman

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Re: Montreal Audio Show 2009
« Reply #57 on: 8 Apr 2009, 12:31 pm »
Well Werd, my amp is stuck in Quebec City for some reason and has been there for a couple of days. Could be because of the weather since we had a freak winter storm yesterday! I am the unluckiest guy with things like this and it seems to happen to me often! Hopefully tommorrow it will arrive because Easter is Friday and if I don't get it by then the boys in lttle white suits will have to come and get me!!!!!!!! I don't think I could survive until Tuesday!
  :cry:

danman

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Re: Montreal Audio Show 2009
« Reply #58 on: 8 Apr 2009, 03:08 pm »
AMP JUST SHOWED UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: aa aa aa aa aa aa

FEDEX NEEDS TO UPDATE THEIR TRACKING SYSTEM MORE OFTEN.

WILL GIVE FEEDBACK WHEN I CAN LISTEN!

alexone

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Re: Montreal Audio Show 2009
« Reply #59 on: 8 Apr 2009, 04:45 pm »
AMP JUST SHOWED UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: aa aa aa aa aa aa

FEDEX NEEDS TO UPDATE THEIR TRACKING SYSTEM MORE OFTEN.

WILL GIVE FEEDBACK WHEN I CAN LISTEN!



cool! enjoy :thumb:!!!

al.