new to classical music

zybar · « **on:** 3 Dec 2003, 05:39 pm »

I just picked up some Vivaldi (Four Seasons, Gloria, Stabat Mater) and I love it!!

The question is...what are some must haves as I leap into the world of classical music?

I am way too much of a newbie to say I have a favorite type or style.

Look forward to getting some feedback.

Thanks,

GW

mcrespo71 · « **Reply #1 on:** 3 Dec 2003, 05:43 pm »

Beethoven's 9 Symphonies
Beethoven Violin Concerto in D
Mozart Symphony #40 or #41- Jupiter
Bach- Goldberg Variations

ghersh · « **Reply #2 on:** 3 Dec 2003, 05:44 pm »

check www.classical.net

Tyson · « **Reply #3 on:** 4 Dec 2003, 06:33 am »

If you like vivaldi, I would recommend checking out Bach as well. The Brandenberg Concerto's, Violin Concerto's, French Suites, English Suites, Well Tempered Clavier, Suites for solo cello, Sonatas and Partitas for solo violin.

The beethoven symphonies are also good, especially #3, #5, #7, and #9. Karajan or Gardiner are both great conducters, as is Kleiber, for Beethoven. Also check out the "Razumovsky" String Quartets - I like the Talich Quartet's performances, but there are many others that are good too. Piano Concerto's #3, 4, and 5 are all good, I like Kempff and Fleisher both as the pianists for these works. Violin Concerto - Schneiderhan or Hillary Hahn both excel.

Brahms - the 4 symphones w/Jochum conducting, 2 piano concerto's with Gilels playing, Violin Concerto with Joshua Bell playing, and any of the chamber music with Rubinstein playing are all great.

Chopin - lots of compilation discs out there, I particularly like Ashkenazy and Rubinstein for Chopin.

Mozart - Piano Concertos are a must - Brendel has 3 new cd's with Mackerras conducting, get them they are great. For Symphonies I like Tate conducting the English Chamber Orchestra for #38, 39, 40, and 41.

Orff - Carmina Burana - this is the piece they use as music for all those movie previews and its a lot of fun - Blomstedt is the best conductor I've heard for it.

Rachmaninov - all you need is Ashkenazy - he's got a set of the 3 symphones, and a set of the 4 piano concertos and they are all right at the top of the class, IMO.

Tchaikovsky - Symphony 4, 5, 6 - Mravinsky is the best conductor here - talk about wild, over the top music making, this is it

Piano Concerto is amazing in Martha Argerich's hands. Violin Concerto I still like Kyung Wha Chung the best here.

Vivaldi - any performance by Il Giardino Armonico is worth picking up, they bring a joy and vibrancy to the music that puts a smile on my face every time.

Most of the rec's here are for larger, orchestral type music. If you find that you like chamber music, that's a whole nother post

Tyson · « **Reply #4 on:** 6 Dec 2003, 12:07 am »

Also, a couple I forgot:

Mendelsohnn - Violin Concerto - Kyung Wha Chung again, outstanding performance, good recording.

Dvorak - Symphonies 7,8, and 9 - a 2 for 1 CD set w/Cristopher Von Dohnanyi conducting is quite good, and a very good recording.

Saint Saens - 5 Piano Concerto's - I like Steven Houghs traversal, light and sparkly.

Mozart Violin Concerto's - Huggett with the Orchestra of the Age of Enlightenment is my favorite - doesn't hurt that it's 2 CD's for $11.

zybar · « **Reply #5 on:** 6 Dec 2003, 12:11 am »

Tyson,

Thanks for the suggestions.

Unlike other music, you have to deal with the composer AND who is conducting or performing...

It can all be a little overwhelming at the start...

GW

lonewolfny42 · « **Reply #6 on:** 6 Dec 2003, 12:23 am »

Tyson, Do you have any favorite NAXOS recordings that you like ?

Tyson · « **Reply #7 on:** 6 Dec 2003, 01:29 am »

Naxos, oh yes, there are a few and since Naxos tend to only have a single recording of each work, I can just list the works:

JS Bach:

Piano Concerto's
Well Tempered Clavier books 1 and 2
Violin (and Harpsichord) sonata's

Chopin - most of Biret's performances are good.

Bruckner - Tintner rules! His performances are the best I've heard, period.

The Liszt solo piano series is very good (multiple different pianists, they are all quite good).

Schubert Piano Trio's

Verdi - Requiem

Feeney - Dracula

Shostakovich - String Quartets and Cello Concerto's

I'm sure I'm forgetting some, but that's most of the good ones I have.

Now, there are also some to avoid, IMO.

DO NOT BUY:

Beethoven or Brahms symphonies or any of the Concerto's

Mozart Piano Concerto's

Mahler Symphonies

Tchaikovsky or Rachmaninov Symphonies or Concertos

Schubert - Piano Sonata's

Shostakovich - Symphonies

All of this is just my humble opinon, of course

Tyson · « **Reply #8 on:** 6 Dec 2003, 01:58 am »

Sorry ghersh, I've gotta put in a serious reservation about classical.net - reading through their reviews is, uh, amusing at the least. I would use the search capability of Gramophile on the Gramophone.co.uk site or the reviews from classicstoday.com long before I would use classical.net. Another good resource is to search the music archives at audioasylum.com - sure there's a lot of rec's for old mono recordings, but there is also a lot of good rec's for more modern recordings too.

For just a couple of examples of the badness of classical.net, turn to the overview reviews of Beethoven's complete Piano Sonatas - they pick Goode as the best modern version (I'm not arguing this, I agree), but who do they have as the comparison - Jando ?! Pommier???!!!! And of the historical sets, only Schnabel???? Where is Gilels, where is Kempff, where is Barenboim, Ashkenazy, Arrau, Kovacevich????? These are all "giants" and each had something important to say with their sets. No mention at all!!!

Then turn to the overview of the Beethoven complete Symphonies - at least they cover a lot of the major cycles here. But anyone that thinks the laserlight set can compare to the Karajan 1963 cycle is smoking crack. AND the reviewer is hopelessly biased against anyone using original instruments. You see this view point expressed often by people that have grown up with Beethoven performed in a certain style and they simply cannot get past their own prejudices to recognize good performances (Gardiner) from bad performances (Norrington and Hogwood).

lonewolfny42 · « **Reply #9 on:** 6 Dec 2003, 11:34 am »

Thanks Tyson ! !

I'll swing by Tower after I dig out from the snow. Now where's my dogsled ?

jcoat007 · « **Reply #10 on:** 6 Dec 2003, 12:41 pm »

Tyson:

That is a great list. Over the past few years I have collected maybe 50 discs and 30 LP's of classical music. A lot of it is hit 'n miss. I am saving a link to this thread in my Favorites so the next classical urge I get will be more informed.

Thanks

elektratig · « **Reply #11 on:** 6 Dec 2003, 12:58 pm »

Zybar,

The other thing I'd recommend is to go out and get a copy of the Penguin Guide to Classical Music.

Although there may be some dissent here, I found the Guide extremely useful when I first got into Classical music and found myself utterly intimidated and overwhelmed by the choices. OK, I think I want to get some Brahms symphonies . . . yikes, there are RACKS of these things!

Sure the Guide is not perfect -- the authors are Brits and are decidedly Anglophile -- they never met a Simon Rattle recording they didn't like. But let's put it this way: their first choice may not be my first choice (although many times it is) and more important, their top choices are never "dogs" -- you will avoid the experience of buying an expensive cd containing a performance that is just terrible.

Moreover, the Guide is well written and it's often fun (and funny) just to flip through, find a name, and read some of the reviews.

I'm sitting here in NW NJ wondering whether I'm going to be able to get out the door. This snow is beyond belief, and I think it's supposed to fall for close to another 24 hrs. Oh well, I'll just have to listen to music all day.

elektratig · « **Reply #12 on:** 6 Dec 2003, 01:01 pm »

Zybar,

The other thing I'd recommend is to go out and get a copy of the Penguin Guide to Classical Music.

Although there may be some dissent here, I found the Guide extremely useful when I first got into Classical music and found myself utterly intimidated and overwhelmed by the choices. OK, I think I want to get some Brahms symphonies . . . yikes, there are RACKS of these things!

Sure the Guide is not perfect -- the authors are Brits and are decidedly Anglophile -- they never met a Simon Rattle recording they didn't like. But let's put it this way: their first choice may not be my first choice (although many times it is) and more important, their top choices are never "dogs" -- you will avoid the experience of buying an expensive cd containing a performance that is just terrible.

Moreover, the Guide is well written and it's often fun (and funny) just to flip through, find a name, and read some of the reviews.

I'm sitting here in NW NJ wondering whether I'm going to be able to get out the door. This snow is beyond belief, and I think it's supposed to fall for close to another 24 hrs. Oh well, I'll just have to listen to music all day.

PhilNYC · « **Reply #13 on:** 6 Dec 2003, 01:28 pm »

Quote from: zybar

Unlike other music, you have to deal with the composer AND who is conducting or performing...

It can all be a little overwhelming at the start...

GW

I agree...I like classical music, but am totally a neophyte with it...can tell when I like something, but am not so knowledgeable about it to be able to look at a composer/performer/conductor combination and anticipate what I'm going to hear.

One of the things I'd suggest when getting into classical music is this...pick up some sampler/collection CDs by "name" performers (eg. Yo-Yo Ma, Isaac Stern, Wynton Marsalis, Midori) and see what you like. At least this way, you are somewhat assured that the performance will be half-way decent, and you get to hear some different styles.

Two of the ones I've got that I like are:

Yo Yo Ma - Great Cello Concertos (Dvorak, Elgar, Haydn)

Wynton Marsalis - Baroque Music For Trumpets (Vivaldi, Telemann, Pachelbel, Haydn)

Tyson · « **Reply #14 on:** 6 Dec 2003, 09:09 pm »

Also, check your local library - you can usually check out CD's for free for a week, and they have lots of stuff you might not have explored, and did I mention the FREE part

And a lot of times they have several libraries listings on-line at a web site, and you can search for a particular recording or conducter/player. Very useful.

audioengr · « **Reply #15 on:** 7 Dec 2003, 05:22 pm »

Zybar - one really good reference is the public radio PT-50. (Performance Today). Here is the link:

http://www.npr.org/programs/pt/features/pt50.html

Here are a some winners that I have gotten from this list:

Handel Water Music/Fireworks Music (John Eliot Gardiner)- Philips 289 464 706-2

The Planets - Gustav Holst (John Eliot Gardiner) - Deutsche Grammaphon 445 860-2

Gershwin - Rhapsody in Blue/An American in Paris - (Bernstein) - CBS Masterworks MK 42264

All of these are extremely dynamic and well-recorded.

zybar · « **Reply #16 on:** 7 Dec 2003, 05:25 pm »

Thanks Steve.

GW

zybar · « **Reply #17 on:** 7 Dec 2003, 06:42 pm »

OK, I order this to start with from Public Radio MusicSource:

The Vivaldi Album
Bartoli,Cecilia
PLG466569.2 1 CD $15.98 $15.98

Beethoven: Symphonies Nos. 3 & 5
Beethoven / Concertgebouw Orch / Kleiber
PLG467125.2 1 CD $11.98 $11.98

Beethoven: Symphonien Nos. 5 & 7
Beethoven / Kleiber / Vienna Philharmonic
PLG447400.2 1 CD $9.98 $9.98

Gershwin: Rhapsody in Blue; An American in Paris; Grofé: Grand Canyon Suite
Bernstein / Gershwin / Nyp / CJZC
SNY90393.2 1 CD $11.98 $11.98

Handel: Water Music / Fireworks Music
Handel / Ebs / Gardiner
UNIV464706.2 1 CD $11.98 $11.98

Holst: the Planets/Grainger: the Warriors
Holst / Grainger / Gardiner / Phil Orchestra
PLG445860.2 1 CD $14.98 $14.98

Thanks again for the suggestions.

audioengr · « **Reply #18 on:** 8 Dec 2003, 12:39 am »

I have all of these except for one of the Beethovens. I think you will like them.

spectralman · « **Reply #19 on:** 8 Dec 2003, 05:07 am »

I agree with the gentleman who put forth the Penguin Guide. It is like The Bible of classical music. However, it will not help the novice with making selections for starting a new library. One book I found extremely helpful in this regard was Classical Music: The 50 Greatest Composers and Their 1000 Greatest Works by Phil G. Goulding (Publ: Fawcett Columbine). This author goes through, in general terms, classical music periods, the organization of music, the composers, the author's starting recommendations for each composer as well as recommended recordings. While I don't always agree with his recording recommendations (realistically, this would be an impossibility), they are a good starting point. I read this book in its entirety, then went to the Penguin Guide. Also, it's nice to look at some of the mags for new recommendations. As always, AC contributors also have great recommendations, probably the best when recording quality is being considered.