SongTower setup for 2 channel listening

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zybar

SongTower setup for 2 channel listening
« on: 3 Jan 2009, 07:54 pm »
Just curious how people have theirs setup for 2 channel listening.

How far apart are they?

How far from the side wall?

How far from the front wall?

How much toe-in?

Thanks,

George


evan1

Re: SongTower setup for 2 channel listening
« Reply #1 on: 3 Jan 2009, 09:44 pm »
z
« Last Edit: 4 Jan 2009, 10:07 pm by evan1 »

dogorman

Re: SongTower setup for 2 channel listening
« Reply #2 on: 3 Jan 2009, 09:52 pm »
I'm zero'ing in on the best placement, too, but my room is so wacky (and so bad for this sort of thing) that I doubt it'll be of much use to you.

zybar

Re: SongTower setup for 2 channel listening
« Reply #3 on: 3 Jan 2009, 09:54 pm »
I'm zero'ing in on the best placement, too, but my room is so wacky (and so bad for this sort of thing) that I doubt it'll be of much use to you.

I am just curious...not really looking for help.

George

Kris

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Re: SongTower setup for 2 channel listening
« Reply #4 on: 4 Jan 2009, 06:03 am »
Here is a universal formula for all 2ch speaker placement.
http://www.cardas.com/content.php?area=insights&content_id=26&pagestring
I own 6 pairs of speakers and all of them sound better in that position.  :thumb:

zybar

Re: SongTower setup for 2 channel listening
« Reply #5 on: 4 Jan 2009, 02:35 pm »
Here is a universal formula for all 2ch speaker placement.
http://www.cardas.com/content.php?area=insights&content_id=26&pagestring
I own 6 pairs of speakers and all of them sound better in that position.  :thumb:

Thanks, but as I stated above, I am just curious about how others have theirs setup.

George

dogorman

Re: SongTower setup for 2 channel listening
« Reply #6 on: 4 Jan 2009, 02:45 pm »
You know, I've heard of this Cardas formula before, and the thing I can't figure out is this: How can Cardas claim that the correct placement of a speaker is robust to the speaker's design? Are we to believe that a pair of (aft ported) Audio Physics Spark IIII's, a pair of (front ported) Tyler Acoustics Taylo Reference Monitors, a pair of (sealed box) Linn Ninkas, and a pair of Klipschorns, will *all* sound their best at exactly the same position in the room?

sanlanman

Re: SongTower setup for 2 channel listening
« Reply #7 on: 4 Jan 2009, 07:23 pm »
Hear is an interesting if not unorthodox way of doing speaker set up.

http://www.mintlp.com/wild/taihup.htm

I have bought a used Nat King Cole Mono CD to do this set up with, but have not gotten around to it yet.

Nuance

Re: SongTower setup for 2 channel listening
« Reply #8 on: 4 Jan 2009, 08:21 pm »
Due to no other possible combo in my listening room, I have them two feet from the back wall and just ender three from the left side wall.  The right speaker has an adjacent room to the right, so the right wall is 13 feet away.  If I was going to stay in this home and/or purchase it, I'd put in a movable sliding wall next to the right speaker to even out reflections.  Still, the ST's sound fantastic, even if it's not the ideal config.

dogorman

Re: SongTower setup for 2 channel listening
« Reply #9 on: 4 Jan 2009, 08:35 pm »
That's funny, my *left* speaker has an adjacent room... to its left.  :roll:

oneinthepipe

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Re: SongTower setup for 2 channel listening
« Reply #10 on: 4 Jan 2009, 09:10 pm »
Measurements from center of drivers:

42 inches from side walls
34 inches from front wall
90 inches apart

Toe-in:
if 0 toe-in is the speakers pointed directly at my ears, the speakers are toed-out about 10 degrees, to point the speakers about 12 inches behind my head.  In the alternative, if 0 toe-in is facing straight ahead, the speakers are toed-in approximately 35 degrees.

yooper

Re: SongTower setup for 2 channel listening
« Reply #11 on: 4 Jan 2009, 10:01 pm »
Regarding toe in, I realize personal preference plays a big part, but have you tried less toe in?  The reason I ask is because in my experience, and reading past posts from Jim and Dennis,  Jim's speaker need very little toe in, or perhaps even zero degree of toe in.

Something to experiment with if you have not done so.

Mark

rydenfan

Re: SongTower setup for 2 channel listening
« Reply #12 on: 4 Jan 2009, 11:44 pm »
35 degrees from straight ahead seems like an excessive amount of toe-in. 15 degrees is generally the most I have ever seen.

oneinthepipe

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Re: SongTower setup for 2 channel listening
« Reply #13 on: 5 Jan 2009, 12:03 am »
35 degrees from straight ahead seems like an excessive amount of toe-in. 15 degrees is generally the most I have ever seen.

I appreciate the suggestions.

The speakers would point to a foot behind my head with this toe-in (or toe-out, depending on terminology).  I have a room configuration problem on the right side, where there is an 30" indentation into the room (the room narrows for 3') about 5' from the front wall.  If I straighten the speakers a significant amount, the right speaker will be pointed to a greater degree into the corner that forms where the room width decreases by 30".  I will straighten the speakers somewhat and compare.  I can also move the speakers closer together, and reduce the toe-in, which will increase the right speaker's distance from that corner.  Possibly, I can demo the indentation and make the room 15' wide the entire length. Currently, the room is 15' wide for the first 5', then 12.5' wide for the remaining 10.5', although there is a 4' wide entry way at the end of the right side wall.

rydenfan

Re: SongTower setup for 2 channel listening
« Reply #14 on: 5 Jan 2009, 03:21 pm »
Could you possibly treat that wall with room treatments to try and negate it further?

oneinthepipe

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Re: SongTower setup for 2 channel listening
« Reply #15 on: 5 Jan 2009, 03:52 pm »
Could you possibly treat that wall with room treatments to try and negate it further?

I did.   There is a 2" panel angled across the corner, which is first reflection point, and about 17 other panels throughout room.  I moved the speakers, and there isn't any toe-in (the speakers point straight front to back).  I think that the soundstage is wider, although I wasn't sure that the instruments' locations were as easily defined, and I moved the speakers a few inches closer together, which seemed to improve the instrument/voice placement.  Sounds good.  I'll keep it like this for a while.  Thanks.

Art_Chicago

Re: SongTower setup for 2 channel listening
« Reply #16 on: 5 Jan 2009, 07:35 pm »
I have my ST's 11 feet apart with 15-25 degrees toe-in (if 0 is directly forward).  They point a couple of feet behind me. I did not notice a difference if the angle is more than 5 and less than about 35 (depending how far I am sitting). They are 16 inches from the back wall for casual listening (rock and jazz) and ~ 20 inches for classical music. The room dimensions 20x15x17 (LxWxH).  The speakers are placed against the longest wall.
I did not like when they were set directly forward, there was a hole in the stereo panorama, maybe because they are far apart. I was surprised to see that  some body else came to the same conclusion  :D
http://www.audioholics.com/reviews/speakers/floorstanding/salk-songtower-qwt/songtower-setup-and-measurements

oneinthepipe

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Re: SongTower setup for 2 channel listening
« Reply #17 on: 5 Jan 2009, 07:49 pm »
When measuring distance from the front wall, are you measuring from the front of the driver or the back of the speaker?

Art_Chicago

Re: SongTower setup for 2 channel listening
« Reply #18 on: 5 Jan 2009, 08:32 pm »
I measure from the back of the speaker, and 16" is the shortest distance. I believe Jim's recommendation is at least 18" from the back.

charmerci

Re: SongTower setup for 2 channel listening
« Reply #19 on: 5 Jan 2009, 11:19 pm »
Posted by: Art_Chicago

"I did not like when they were set directly forward, there was a hole in the stereo panorama, maybe because they are far apart. "

That's because you haven't cranked them up loud enough. Ya gotta do the wall of sound, baby!