[ecramer]

Ok it breaks it down by the movie hour cost which is ok but why does the bulb cost $450 in the fist place? I don't know a thing about projectors. I'm just starting to look into them.

I've not replaced my bulb yet. After two years I've accumulated about 1,500 nours on the bulb. Just recently I've been kicking around the idea of getting a new bulb (lamp). It'll cost me about $275 when I finally do it.

Regarding that whole "what about the cost of bulbs" disscussion, here's a short article that justifies the cost pretty well:
http://www.projectorcentral.com/replacement_lamps.htm

Bob

And by the way, why do I receive emails for topic replies on every forum and every thread I belong to....except THIS thread? 
And I the freakin' moderator of this board. 
What's up with that?

[Bob in St. Louis]

The actual cost of the bulb varies greatly depending on the model of projector you've got. The least expensive bulbs I've seen are around $250. The most expensive I've seen are $500. {Some of these Xenon/H.I.D. automotive headlight bulbs can reach $250. For a freakin headlight bulb! }
"Why" are they so much?........Because they can I suppose. The bulbs are two or three hundred watt bulbs, have exotic gasses in them and project a huge amount of lumens. Other than that, I don't know why they're so expensive. It does seem kinda expensive. But, if you haven't seen one, they are more than "just" a light bulb.
Here's what you'd get for your money:

[Ed Schilling]

We have always had a "big" TV starting about 18 years ago with  Kloss Nova Beam. I replaced each CRT once and the blue twice.
It had an excellent image when properly converged. The depth of field on the lenses was only about 1/2 inch so needless to say most folks who owned those projectors never had them set up or had the convergence properly set and most of them looked bad as a result. Especially the ones in bars.

We moved on and down a little to a 68" rear projection set. Many do not realize the fluid that cools the lenses gets cloudy and causes people to think the sets are shot because the picture gets blurry and the color faded. The fluid is cheap and easy to replace and in most cases brings the sets back to "as new" in terms of picture quality. Plenty of them ended up in dumps because of this. Or with guys like me who fixed them.

Last Nov. I decided to get something to hold me over......we bought a Epson Powerlite S5. The thing only has SVA (gasp) resolution BUT it has an estimated 4000 (in economy) hour lamp life, and 2000 lumens on high I got an extended warranty that includes one bulb replacement and 4 years. The total was 675 bucks (550 plus 125 svc. contract).

The cheap screen in the living room is 90 inches and cost 85 dollars.

I can say for a fact I am quite happy with this thing.........it is bright enough to use during the day and I seldom even shut the shades.
I NEVER run it on "high" even during the day. I cut it on around 5 or 6 and it runs until maybe 2 am. In other words we use it like a TV.
The image is fine and depending on the program can be spectacular. The only thing about using it with lots of ambient light is the color shift. At night watching with the lights off it is great. I thought it would hold me until I got something "better". I now see no reason and am not in a hurry to replace it, but I will one day because I have a 110" screen in my listening room and moving the projector is a "hassle". I want one for each room so I don't have too.

Bulbs are $199 with overnight shipping from Epson...but I am not concerned since I have one "free" one. The service contract was 125 bucks, so as you can see it was a no brainer to get that.

I am with Bob in the "what are you waiting for" dept. This projector is cheap enough and bulbs are long lasting enough that it makes no sense to me to have a "small screen". Quality is "fine".....after all it is only TV.

Since I REFUSE to pay to watch commercials and have FTA as a result of that, my "home theater" is just great. Every month I don't spend money on cable or Satellite I figure my projector is paying for itself. Of course I only have about 500 channels to watch (991 scanned into memory) and none are High Def.......because I have not bought a HD FTA receiver yet.

I'll take cheap SVA at 90" and free TV over expensive 1080p and pay TV any day! The lamp is not an issue on the S5 and the difference between what they cost and others is more than my FTA receiver.

I suspect too many people think they need HD and to spend big bucks in order to have a big decent set is one reason why so few have them.

My buddy has a 50 inch 1080p plasma and HD cable.....and it costs lots per month and the Plasma was over 2 grand. His "extended warranty" was 400 bucks. And guess what, practically speaking my setup kills his in every way......sure his is sharp and crisp....and tiny. Trying to read the "crawler" on a football game from the couch is pointless. And 10 feet from his TV you need binoculars. He wanted a projector but being PW'd his wife said "no". So they have an expensive little TV with expensive cable in a large room.

I have a huge TV for 1/4 the price, more channels and no cable bill......and it looks better when you are more than 10 feet away.

I would suggest that people not get discouraged by "specs"......resolution and contrast ratio numbers sell products. Even SVA and 400 to one contrast ratio is better than small HD if you sit back more than a few feet or have a large room. At least that is my opinion.

Ed

[Bob in St. Louis]

Well said Ed. I've yet to dedicate enough time to researching the FTA. I'm still interested.

What you said about ignoring the manufacturers specs regarding contrast ratio is true in many cases. Lumen output is another load of garbage. Unless you're wanting a "light cannon" that will shine brightly on the side of your Arizona home at high noon in July, lumen output is a useless specification and often over exaggerated my manufacturers. Kind of like buying audio equipment at Walmart and only looking at total system wattage. 

Although, I've never hear of any TV that requires fluid. 
Sounds like you're feeding me some B.S., like my car needs it's "blinker fluid" changed yearly. 

Bob

[Ed Schilling]

Bob, you are the guy that I wanted to buy a rear projection TV and use a couple years! Almost all of the "common" "big screen" rear projection TV's have liquid cooled lenses! And the number of people that thought their sets were no good, when in fact just had burned fluid is very large!

Don't take my word for it! Google....."projection tv coolant"!

Any, I repeat any rear projector with a dark, dull, faded and generally bad picture can be brought back to "as new" by changing the fluid. Sometimes you might have to drill a hole or remove a factory plug but they are almost all able to have the fluid replaced.

See, I am just full of good info!

Ed

[Papajin]

Regarding that whole "what about the cost of bulbs" disscussion, here's a short article that justifies the cost pretty well:
http://www.projectorcentral.com/replacement_lamps.htm

It seems like there's room for improvement here as well.  I know the new Mits I've been eyeing has a 5000 hour estimated lifespan in lower power mode.  That's not half bad.

And by the way, why do I receive emails for topic replies on every forum and every thread I belong to....except THIS thread? 
And I the freakin' moderator of this board. 
What's up with that?

Maybe the moderator has it in for you, and added some sort of special filter to keep you from receiving email updates? 

[Papajin]

"Why" are they so much?........Because they can I suppose. The bulbs are two or three hundred watt bulbs, have exotic gasses in them and project a huge amount of lumens. Other than that, I don't know why they're so expensive. It does seem kinda expensive.

It does seem very much like this may be the reason.  I mean 400 Watt metal halide bulbs for aquarium use aren't exactly cheap, but they maybe max out around $150 or so -- usually for imports, but most for under $100.  Even the 1000 Watt MH's aren't too much more than $150 generally.  Are these projector bulbs that much more sophisticated and hard to manufacture do you think?  I mean the projector bulbs do use a cage of some sort rather than being just a raw bulb, but still.  I wonder if the ballast is built in to that contraption or not.  That could definitely add to the cost.

[Bob in St. Louis]

Bob, you are the guy that I wanted to buy a rear projection TV and use a couple years!

Not sure what you mean by that Ed.  -- I'm puzzled?

But, you may have single handedly restored my 14 year old rear projection Sony, Ed. My wife will be very happy to her that her diminishing picture quality may be repairable after all. 


Papajin - Good point about the ballast being in there. A good possibility based on the size of the "assembly". Definitely more than just a "light bulb".
{and by the way, I AM the moderator of this board. I can't kill anybodys notification, and my 'notify of replies' button is checked by default.} Strange.

Bob

[Ed Schilling]

Bob, I meant "you" as a generalization of a person who bought a rear projection TV and thought it dead after a couple years and decided to "give it away"! It was a "joke".

If the Sony has liquid cooled CRT's you should be able to fix it. Keep in mind the fluid turns nasty and lumpy. It ALL has to be removed and the inside cleaned. Sometimes the drain/fill holes are small and it takes some work with a pipe cleaner to srcape and remove the burned fluid. If that Sony is one (with liquid cooled CRT), it should have been changed years ago! The older it is the more difficult to remove the burned fluid. But it can be done with patience and very little actual "skill".
Also, changing the fluid does NOT fix a dead CRT or one that has been damaged by continually turning the drive up to make up for the cloudy fluid. If there are "retrace lines" then it is being over driven.

It is worth a shot, for sure. The quality of the repair will be how well you clean the inside. every square millimeter must be wiped clean and this takes time if you have to access the inside through a small hole. Removing the lens and risking damage to the o ring is not recommended but certainly is done all the time. Cleaning through the fill hole is harder but safer.

You must have NO air bubbles inside when you finish.
There is lots on the internet about this.

Ed

[Bob in St. Louis]

Ok, good information Ed.
I verified the production date and it's not as old as I thought. It was built in 1996, so it's 12 years old.
Still, having the original fluid sounds like it's going to be a mucky mess in there.
Worst case senario, I wonder if new o-rings are available. Hmmmm.

I've not had a chance to do any searching yet (I've been busy being a moderator  )
But will check when the flames die down.

Bob

[superchad]

 I would like to upgrade from my 720P Projector but I really dont use it that much, we bought it in Dec 2007 and still only have 350 hrs on it..and most of those were when it was on all the time becuae of the cool factor, I do worry about bulb expense so I dont watch it alot but I think its more that I dont care as much as I thought I would. We love it and for a big movie or concert its fantastic but our Sony 34' XBR WEGA tube unit looks awesome and so between hiding in basement, bulb life and a certain lack of interest it just doesnt get much use. When I got it, I solely bought it used simply for the music room so nothing was between speakers and a fireplace limited use of flat panel (not to mention expense) and the Projector just happened to be the biggest pic and cheapest option for audio room. The Projector was sent to service and sent back with brand new bulb from some inside help and screen and Pro cost me $800. The PT-AX1OOU isnt the best, its quite the budget model but it has great Lumen output and a pretty good Contrast ratio so its all I need, when Blu Ray gets cheaper maybe the 1080P would be more attractive but even me HDDVD player shows its strength on 720P.

[oscar]

I'm itching to replace my 720p front projector but I figure I'm spending at least $5k for it's 1080p successor; which is still less than I originally paid for 720p. 

I've already paid $500 twice for replacement bulbs; everytime I think about replacing the bulb, I'm thinking of replacing the FP instead.

[Ed Schilling]

Bob, Call me and I'll be happy to fill you in. It is WAY too much to type but the concepts are easy. I'm sure you can do it, if it is possible. Some aren't and some that are not supposed to be can be! Anytime is fine for a chat.
Ed

[Dan Driscoll]

So........Whatcha' waitin' fo'?

A house where I can have a dedicated media room with light and sound control, 'cause it ain't gonna happen in my condo. 

[Bob in St. Louis]

Ed - Sounds like a plan to me. I've been Googling my butt off, and can't find instructions for this specific model, nor can I find the specific type of fluid that goes in it. I've seen many, many references to rear Projection TV's having fluid and a few tidbits of interesting information, but nothing concrete to go on. Looks like I may need to buy a service manual?

Yea, a phone call would be fantastic. We could take about old school big screens, FTA TV, and ......... guns. 
{Actually, I'd be boring on the subject of guns, I don't know much other than they're cool}. 

Please PM me a number Ed, thanks man! (Thursday - Sunday I'll have lots of time to chat)
Bob

[Rob S.]

Ed, Bob, or someone else:

What is FTA?   I"m new to front projectors.

Thanks,

Rob S.

[Bob in St. Louis]

Hey Rob,
FTA = Free to Air television. Not display device dependant, it's the method of transmission/reception of your new FREE television channels. 
Check here:
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=56586.0

[Papajin]

Papajin - Good point about the ballast being in there. A good possibility based on the size of the "assembly". Definitely more than just a "light bulb".
{and by the way, I AM the moderator of this board. I can't kill anybodys notification, and my 'notify of replies' button is checked by default.} Strange.

I know you're the moderator...  That was the joke!  Sure, my jokes may often be difficult to recognize since by and large I'm the only one amused by them, but still...

[JP78]

So........Whatcha' waitin' fo'?

A house where I can have a dedicated media room with light and sound control, 'cause it ain't gonna happen in my condo. 

dan - why can't it happen in your condo? a lot of automation manufacturers (lutron, control4, etc) replace standard dimmers with theirs and work over radio frequency.  you can always have it now and take the smart dimmers with you when you leave....same sort of idea with sound control too these days.  technology progress is a great thing.

[Dan Driscoll]

dan - why can't it happen in your condo?

Three letters: WAF. She's not thrilled with my 53" RPTV and audio system as it is. Adding a FP would push her over the edge.

To be fair, the size, shape and usage of the room makes installing a FP impractical. It's a long, narrow room, with the dining area at one end and the living area at the other. There is a ceiling fan and light fixture on the dining end which will not be removed, so a rear wall mount is not possible. There is no electrical where the projector would need to be ceiling mounted, so that would have to be run. Also, we're in a downstairs unit, with elephants and a rambunctious pre-teen upstairs, so vibration is would be a problem. Add in the fact that we want to buy a house in a couple of years and a FP just doesn't make sense, especially since I have a perfectly fine Pioneer CRT-RPTV.