[Neill]

Hi Folks

Has anybody tried this combo (or any other single driver type speaker) with the Aksa's?

My first post, so forgive me if I've missed something

Thanks

Neill

[andyr]

Hi Folks

Has anybody tried this combo (or any other single driver type speaker) with the Aksa's?

My first post, so forgive me if I've missed something

Thanks

Neill

Hi Neill,

Not the Jordans but a Sydney AKSA owner who, sadly, has left the building (and whose name I have forgotton!  ) used his AKSA with another popular full-range speaker.  He thought it sounded fantastic! 

You should have absolutely no problem unless the Jordan has wildly differing impedances over its frequency range.  Low impedance (3 ohms) will be a problem on some AKSA models and if the Jordans exhibit a pronounced impedance rise with HF, it perhaps will sound better with a Zobel impedance-correction circuit ... various people on this Forum, including Hugh, will be able to advise you further on this.

Regards,

Andy

[E TYPE PHIL]

Hi Neill

I am aware of four Aksa amp owners who have used or currently use single driver speakers in Sydney with no problems.

I have a pair of Diatones in a TWT style box and JohnR did have (maybe he still has) a box utilizing Jordan drivers.

I muck around with lots of single drivers - typically 50's,60's stuff and have not experienced any adverse situations.

Go for it!!

Regards
Phil.

[AKSA]

Thanks Andy, Phil,

There you go, Neill, it's been done with good results, any more questions to help you on your journey?

It's important you cover any issues here amongst AKSA owners, so you know exactly what to expect.

I also have AKSA (and Lifeforce) owners who use their amps with electrostatic speakers, if that is helpful.

Thank you for your inquiry,

Cheers,

Hugh

[JohnR]

Yes I use my AKSA 55N with JX92s. (I'm not really sure what the question is.)

Long time no see, Phil

[Neill]

Thanks guys.

John, sorry it was a bit of a non-question, wasn't it. I guess with what I've read about the Jordans and their ability to really bring the emotion out of the music; I'm really just checking my increasing belief that the Aksa/Jordan combo could really be something special. Could you comment on highlights/weak areas (if any)? I listen to anything and everything other than Hip-Hop and C&W ie everything from major choral/orchestral through rock to single female vocalists. To me imaging, soundstage and accuracy are all-important. I'm aware of the perceived weakness of the Jordan's bottom end, but would anticipate the Aksa would assist in relegating this "lack" into a non-event.

Hugh, thanks for dropping in to this. I've sent you an email via Aspen with a few other queries.

Thanks again.

Neill

[Tliner]

Hi All,

Recently a friend requested me to help him on a reflex box design and a tuning crossover for the expensive Fostex F200A co-axial drivers. The box design is one that Fostex recommend for the driver. So we supposed that the design was basically well sorted out.

I used a Lifeforce 100 to power the speakers whilst tuning them. The result was very acceptable as long as the music was not a complicated full-on orchestral piece where there was a good bit of bass present. At that point the sound lost its definition, sound stage and imaging was very smudgy. This phenomena is evident in most single cone drivers when pushed.  IMHO that is why a lot of the top end speakers have multi way driver arrangements. The tweeter is best at the top end and the mid woofer is best at the mid and bottom end. The Fostex drivers were very acceptable in the mid range performance.

As a reference speaker I used the prototype of Aspen's soon to be released VSonic transmissionline speakers. While the speakers with the single drivers sounded very pleasing but they were no match for the VSonics which is a two way set up with an 8" driver and a 1" tweeter in each box.  With the Lifeforce 100 amp the Vsonics had all the musical bass with the a very realistic chest thumping slam with the mid range and top end is crystal clear at the same time. Basically that is the difference between a speaker with a "one does all" driver and and a speaker with dedicated bass/mid and tweeter set up.

To date I have not heard a co-axial speaker that has a performance of a miltiway speaker. But there are some mighty fine single way speakers available.
If you are fortunate enough to be able to to A/B test a good single way speaker with a similar quality multi way speaker I'm sure that you will pick the multi way speaker.

Have fun y'all,

Cheers,

Laurie

[JohnR]

Hi Neill, after 6+ years I still think my AKSAs (55N) are special, and they will be the foundation of my next project that will replace the Jordans. I'm not sure though that the Jordan drivers will live up your expectations for rock and full orchestral. The fact is they are a small fullrange driver with limited excursion. A TL design might well improve performance in the area of bass performance and reduced congestion when pushed, I can't say - mine are in a passive radiator design. They also have a bit of a peaky response above 10k that (I suspect) enhances the apparent clarity of the driver but can also lead to some edginess if you're not careful with source, room, and the volume control...

That's my take on it anyway. It's been a long time since I compared speakers/amps/whatever. That's not to say they aren't very enjoyable, within their limits.

[Neill]

Thanks, Laurie & John

Hmmmm... It may be better then to build myself the Aksa's and then find suitable speakers (VSonics????)

Its the delicacy of the mid/treble that appeals with the Jordans. I used to own a pair of speakers that IMHO nothing would touch for rock but were very fatiguing for everything else...sigh! It's all a compromise, I guess.

Maybe my question should have been "what's a great speaker system worthy of the AKSA?" and it sounds like Hugh is about to burst out with something interesting in terms of his speaker development.

Thanks for your comments, guys - I appreciate your responses

regards

Neill

[AKSA]

Hi Neill,

Yes, indeed, thanks Laurie, a new speaker is about to become available.  It is an 8"/1" two way transmission line using easy to obtain Peerless drivers, not long now......

Neill, if you have sent me an email, for some reason it has not arrived.  Do please resend to aspen1 -at- people.net.au, you may have used an obsolete address!

Cheers,

Hugh

[andyr]

Thanks, Laurie & John

Hmmmm... It may be better then to build myself the Aksa's and then find suitable speakers (VSonics????)

It's the delicacy of the mid/treble that appeals with the Jordans. I used to own a pair of speakers that IMHO nothing would touch for rock but were very fatiguing for everything else...sigh! It's all a compromise, I guess.

Maybe my question should have been "what's a great speaker system worthy of the AKSA?" and it sounds like Hugh is about to burst out with something interesting in terms of his speaker development.

Thanks for your comments, guys - I appreciate your responses

regards

Neill

Hi Neill,

You will always get interesting responses here ... we may have different speakers but we all lurve our AKSAs!  

IMO, so-called "full-range" drivers certainly deliver unmatched mid-range (as Quad 'statics do) because they have no XO screwing up the sound ... but they miss out at the frequency extremes.  

So, to get the "delicacy of the mid/treble" plus "rocking bass" (ie. deep & punchy) and "not fatiguing" ... well, mate, you want the f'ing universe!  

There are many great speaker systems which are "worthy of" AKSAs - ie. AKSAs drive them exceptionally well!  

If you buy the Vsonics then you have a superlative sounding speaker which only needs 1 AKSA - basic 100N+ module, LF100 or Soraya - to give you eargasms at a relatively low cost!  

If you have more money at your disposal and are happy to embark on a much more complex journey then an active Magnepan (2- or 3-way) will give you "mid/treble delicacy" to die for ... but not the last word in bass punch!  

Alternatively, if you want bass which is deeper and punchier, and are happy to shell out for 3 x AKSA 55s or LF55s plus the drivers ... get hold of some Orions (however, these are DIY!).

Regards,

Andy

[JLM]

Neill,

I own Fostex F200A based TL speakers (Bob Brines designed/built model FTA-2000, Martin King inspired) and drive them with 40 watt chip based monoblocks (Channel Island Audio from here in the States).  The F200A are single driver, not co-axial (they have an aluminum dust cap, no whizzer, and are 20 cm across) so they may appear to be coaxial.  They carry a huge AlNiCo magnet and so are very musical (and quite "dark" compared to most extended range drivers that are better termed midrange/tweeters).  Other single driver fans have been dumbfounded by the deep bass possible from these speakers.

I'm a "speaker guy" and an amateur "theoretical purist", so the single driver approach really appeals to me.  My first audio ephiphany occurred while hearing mass loaded transmission lines in the 70s.  The depth, speed, power, and musicality of the bass amazed me.  The coherent sound and simplicity of single driver designs combined with the advantages of direct amp/driver (active) coupling covered the other two audio ephiphanies I've experienced.  So I shopped quite a bit for these "destination" speakers and ended up commissioning Bob to "invent" and build the first pair.  At 20 cm and no whizzer they beam, but they are in my "man-cave" with all serious listening done nearfield from "the" chair, so no worries.  IMO nearfield listening almost requires single driver speakers (or headphones  ).

Yes, ultimate output is more limited in most single driver designs, but the bigger/more efficient drivers provide quite servicable sound pressure limits (at least for these 50 something ears).  The Jordan 92 have been around for decades and used in nearly every imaginable type of speaker design.  Their aluminum foil cone (intended to flex to provide improved high frequency response) is unique.  But many have been critical of the published specifications as overly optimistic.  And they're not inexpensive, especially here with the weak USD.

With extended range drivers efficiency typically goes up with size.  My F200A are an exception, but OTOH they are rated "raw" down to 30 Hz.  While rated at about 90 dB/w/m and to handle 27 watts constant, 80 watts peak, a pair in a "normal sized" room should reach 104 dB constant and 109 dB peaks which is plenty for me.  Bob Brines is a lover of the Baroque so they do acoutical and small ensembles, but also handle symphonic and rock (without that fatiguing edginess).  In fact Led Zep was amazing a few days ago with deep/forceful bass and many newly discovered nuances in the music. 

Transmission lines have several other advantages.  The typical sloping interior vents internal reflections away so they that don't re-emerge back through the driver(s) to smear the sound.  The normal internal baffles provide cabinet bracing.  They recognize and take advantage of the pipe resonances created by typical floorstanding cabinets with their relatively long/skinny internal chambers.  Internal pressures (and therefore cabinet colorations) are reduced.  The bottom end impedance rise is smoothed out and with bass response is extended deeper and power amps "see" an easier load.  Bass roll-off is at a 6 dB/octave rate that matches natural room gain to optimize performance.

So if you have the Jordan 92 VTLs, I'm sure any of the AKSA amps would do fine for "civilized      "     ening (no block parties).  If you don't have the Jordans yet, you might want to shop around.  BTW, Bob Brines offers plans, panelized (pre-cut) kits, assembled raw (unfinished) cabinets, or fully assembled speakers at very reasonable prices.  OTOH I'd love to hear the new AKSA speakers.

[bhobba]

Its the delicacy of the mid/treble that appeals with the Jordans. I used to own a pair of speakers that IMHO nothing would touch for rock but were very fatiguing for everything else...sigh! It's all a compromise, I guess.

If you like the Jordon's then the following may appeal:

http://www.audioroundtable.com/SingleDriverSpeakers/messages/950.html

Maybe my question should have been "what's a great speaker system worthy of the AKSA?"

I recommend the Timpiece Mini
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=48470.0

and it sounds like Hugh is about to burst out with something interesting in terms of his speaker development.

Sure is.  and it is fully worthy of consideration as well.  AKSA amps are fine products that deserve fine speakers.  You have many to choose from - enjoy the journey.

Thanks
Bill

[Neill]

Thanks for all the helpful comments, guys.

A few comments have stood out concerning the Jordan's abilities suitability as a near field speaker and the things they do well. Unfortunately, (and especially after a a few glasses of the fermented grapejuice) the things they don't do so well would become a concern as the music gets a little rowdy!

Just to clarify: I don't have the Jordans - I'm just trying to plot out a direction.

I will definitely be going the DIY route; I will probably be committing to the AKSA; most of my music is PC based, so will eventually go the SqueezeBox way; and am now trying to identify suitable speakers. The Orions look do-able, but I'll leave the final decision re speakers till later.

The one thing that really stands out on this forum is the passion people have about Hugh's offerings.

So, thanks again for the assistance, and I'll be in touch when things are underway.

Regards

Neill

PS "eargasms" - love it!

[kyrill]

my 1 cent
the Aksa's or Lifeforce will blossom more with at least a 2 way speaker

the Jordan an all crossover less speakers are not a solution but a cure, a medicine.
a medicine to un natural sounding 2way or 3 way speakers because of not good enough
xovers. 2 reasons
1) a crossover need good parts. parts that up until a few years ago did not exist  A few years is , ehh well roughly 5-7 years. Now with the new generation capacitors and coils X cross overs sound a MAGNITUDE more audiophile than in the former century. However a single Jordan has its charms compared to those 2 or 3way speakers.
2) a single driver CANNOT defy the laws of physics. By design a single driver have to sacrifice  a LOT compares to specialised drivers for a certain band. In my opinion TOO much

BUT i prefer a Jordan over many 2 or 3 way "mainstream hifi" speakers.

If you want to go with a very a good amp in my opinion a single driver will DEMAND from you, you ONLY focus to the midband, upper bass and ehh  specific highs,  all in sync with each other but ehh specific not really natural overtones in the highs.
ah well use single band speaker with the most refined 1-6 watts SET tubes who excels in the midband
mostly because in history SET tube amps had the best refined sound ,, but ehh  in history, not anymore