$$$Power cords and $100 outlets, do they make a difference?

darredon · « **on:** 19 Dec 2007, 07:27 am »

This is my first posting, so if I’m in the wrong area just let me know. Recently I’ve been considering purchasing two Oyaide SWO-XXX-U wall outlets at $85 each and maybe in the future switching out the power cords that came with my CD player and Amp for some “high-end” power cords. I've been told if you do purchase a power cord anything below the $500 range really is just a waist of money. Do wall outlets and power cords really make a difference or is power treatment all voodoo and fairy dust stuff. I’d be interested in hearing what other member’s experiences and advice is on the subject.

System:

Avatar Super
Integrated Tube Amplifier
Gamut CD3
Speakers Von Schweikert VR-1 Reference Studio Monitor System & VR-S/1 High-speed MiniSub

musicman06 · « **Reply #1 on:** 19 Dec 2007, 08:24 am »

I'd be more inclined to go with the "fairy dust" answer. That said the only way to find out is to try them out in your setup and hear for yourself. There are quite a few people that swear they work. I did spend about $350 on a Transparent power conditioner though it also serves as a good surge protector.

lonewolfny42 · « **Reply #2 on:** 19 Dec 2007, 08:32 am »

You might read this....

satfrat · « **Reply #3 on:** 19 Dec 2007, 09:55 am »

Quote from: darredon on 19 Dec 2007, 07:27 am

This is my first posting, so if I’m in the wrong area just let me know. Recently I’ve been considering purchasing two Oyaide SWO-XXX-U wall outlets at $85 each and maybe in the future switching out the power cords that came with my CD player and Amp for some “high-end” power cords. I've been told if you do purchase a power cord anything below the $500 range really is just a waist of money. Do wall outlets and power cords really make a difference or is power treatment all voodoo and fairy dust stuff. I’d be interested in hearing what other member’s experiences and advice is on the subject.

System:

Avatar Super
Integrated Tube Amplifier
Gamut CD3
Speakers Von Schweikert VR-1 Reference Studio Monitor System & VR-S/1 High-speed MiniSub

Your Oyaide outlet will only be as good as the power going into it. An outlet on its own won't give you cleaner power. Now if you ran a dedicated circuit first, then put a good duplex outlet like an Oyaide, the sonic gains would be much more noticable. You can get sonic improvements with reasonable priced power cords when compared to your stock power cord, VH Audio is an excellent example of this but more sonic improvements cost more money,,,like everything else in audio. All depends on whether those little audible gains are worth $$$$$ bucks, hense the phrase "point of diminishing returns." Fortunately most businesses offer a trail period for the cost of shipping charges. unless you have a brick n' mortor place that offeres the same audtion period, shipping charges seems like a reasonable request so you can hear for yourself if indeed those sonic improvements suit your wallet. But be forwarned, don't do it if you're really not willing to spend the money cuz after you've heard what your system could really sound like, it's gonna hurt like hell to settle for what you got by sending them cables back.

That's why it'll be a cold day in hell before I try that $2999 Bybee "Super Effects" power cord or Speaker Bullets. I know how good they'd be and I'm just not willing to spend that type of money so I don't want to know what they'd be like in my system. If you're not willing to spend $500, 4600, $700 or more on a simple power cord, then I'd suggest not finding out how good your system can actually sound with 1 in it.

Cheers,
Robin

JLM · « **Reply #4 on:** 19 Dec 2007, 10:10 am »

Welcome darredon,

Robin and I disagree on this subject. I'm just too old school to budget more than 10% on cabling and the like. I've tried power conditioning and even full battery power to little advantage, but IMO grungy AC (the technical term is power abberations) are very location specific. Like Robin says, in this case cords/outlets aren't going to help.

But just to be thorough I did buy cryogenically treated Hubbell receptacles for my audio man cave (spent a total of $100): cryo-parts.com

Volex power cords ($14 each) are supposed to be killer bang for the buck power cords. I've found worthwhile improvements with Element Cable's Red Storm power cable in my $500 monoblocks.

Hospital grade outlets (available at big home improvement stores) are the real value products (hospital grade, especially red ones, grip harder).

I wouldn't spend $500 on a power cord until your system well exceeds $10,000.

jkelly · « **Reply #5 on:** 19 Dec 2007, 12:19 pm »

Everything makes a difference!

satfrat · « **Reply #6 on:** 19 Dec 2007, 12:34 pm »

Quote from: jkelly on 19 Dec 2007, 12:19 pm

Everything makes a difference!

Damn straight it does!

boead · « **Reply #7 on:** 19 Dec 2007, 12:37 pm »

Quote from: jkelly on 19 Dec 2007, 12:19 pm

Everything makes a difference!

Yes it does and more $$ doesn't always = better

woodsyi · « **Reply #8 on:** 19 Dec 2007, 12:49 pm »

Quote from: darredon on 19 Dec 2007, 07:27 am

This is my first posting, so if I’m in the wrong area just let me know. Recently I’ve been considering purchasing two Oyaide SWO-XXX-U wall outlets at $85 each and maybe in the future switching out the power cords that came with my CD player and Amp for some “high-end” power cords. I've been told if you do purchase a power cord anything below the $500 range really is just a waist of money. Do wall outlets and power cords really make a difference or is power treatment all voodoo and fairy dust stuff. I’d be interested in hearing what other member’s experiences and advice is on the subject.

System:

Avatar Super
Integrated Tube Amplifier
Gamut CD3
Speakers Von Schweikert VR-1 Reference Studio Monitor System & VR-S/1 High-speed MiniSub

They make a "difference" if you hear a difference. I doubt, however, that you will hear a $500 improvement from the cables and outlets if you don't spend at least that in room treatment. Power cables do make a difference in sound but you can't hear any changes that small in bad rooms.

AliG · « **Reply #9 on:** 19 Dec 2007, 02:00 pm »

This is very true. First you need to identify your weakest link in your system. For most people it's the room. Cables upgrade should come last.

But to answer your question, whoever that's telling you that you need power cords > $500, that is a pure B.S.

I have power cords much less than that and they made huge difference in the sound, I haven't even upgraded my outlet yet and I have no plan to do so.

Quote from: woodsyi on 19 Dec 2007, 12:49 pm

They make a "difference" if you hear a difference. I doubt, however, that you will hear a $500 improvement from the cables and outlets if you don't spend at least that in room treatment. Power cables do make a difference in sound but you can't hear any changes that small in bad rooms.

TheChairGuy · « **Reply #10 on:** 19 Dec 2007, 02:54 pm »

On outlets (to JLM's point)....the hospital grade 8300 outlets at Lowe's for $9.00 was a quality step up (one that you can hear) from the $0.39 outlet there originally. Since moving on to PS Audio and Porter Port fancier outlets....I hear no further benefits

On power cords....the benefits are even more difficult to define or assign value based on money sent on them. If you're near a significantly busy source of Radio Frequencies (RF) and ElectroMagnetic (EM) Interferences (I)....well shielded power cords are a great upgrade. As time goes on in life, with the proliferation of radio, tc, cell towers, cordless phones, bluetooth, home/business routers and your equipment itself, good shielded power cords are probably more and more beneficial than they were 10/20/30 years ago.

But, you don't have to pay $500 for good shielding, high purity copper, and a low inductance design. Cryo'ed, teflon tubes, silver, and fancy connectors may indeed improve the signal transfer further...but you pay a lot more for these fancy add-ons.

Good luck - it's quite a cable jungle out there

John

Jon L · « **Reply #11 on:** 19 Dec 2007, 03:15 pm »

Power cords and outlets all *change* sound, some more preferable to certain listeners. Don't go crazy with expensive outlets. For example, the Oyaide SWO-XXX outlet was touted as the best thing since sliced bread, but these same users have lately been admitting perhaps it's very flawed ("POS" per some) after they have moved on to the newer and "better" Oyaides.

And yes SWO-XXX is a very colored outlet IME.

Just try some solidly-engineered cords, outlets and find ones that fit your system/tastes...

vman71 · « **Reply #12 on:** 19 Dec 2007, 03:32 pm »

Darredon,

It has been my experience that the cleaner the power you feed your equipment, the better they will operate and sound. That being said, I think you have a number of good options to consider/explore:

1. Dedicated circuits (at least 2 - one for digital and one for amps)
2. Power conditioning (I would never go back after using my Audio Magic power conditioner)
3. Power cords (you don't spend more than $250-300 per power cord)
4. Power tweaking devices (e.g., Ridge Street Audio Z-Der Blok, Audio Magic Pulse Gen ZX)

Although I haven't done this myself yet, I think that room treatments can make just as much of a difference.

goldlizsts · « **Reply #13 on:** 19 Dec 2007, 03:48 pm »

Quote from: satfrat on 19 Dec 2007, 09:55 am

Quote from: darredon on 19 Dec 2007, 07:27 am
This is my first posting................................ ...................

System:

Avatar Super
Integrated Tube Amplifier
Gamut CD3
Speakers Von Schweikert VR-1 Reference Studio Monitor System & VR-S/1 High-speed MiniSub

Your Oyaide outlet will only be as good as the power going into it. An outlet on its own won't give you cleaner power. Now if you ran a dedicated circuit first, then put a good duplex outlet like an Oyaide, the sonic gains would be much more noticable. You can get sonic improvements with reasonable priced power cords when compared to your stock power cord, VH Audio is an excellent example of this but more sonic improvements cost more money,,,like everything else in audio. All depends on whether those little audible gains are worth $$$$$ bucks, hense the phrase "point of diminishing returns." Fortunately most businesses offer a trail period for the cost of shipping charges. unless you have a brick n' mortor place that offeres the same audtion period, shipping charges seems like a reasonable request so you can hear for yourself if indeed those sonic improvements suit your wallet. But be forwarned, don't do it if you're really not willing to spend the money cuz after you've heard what your system could really sound like, it's gonna hurt like hell to settle for what you got by sending them cables back. That's why it'll be a cold day in hell before I try that $2999 Bybee "Super Effects" power cord or Speaker Bullets. I know how good they'd be and I'm just not willing to spend that type of money so I don't want to know what they'd be like in my system. If you're not willing to spend $500, 4600, $700 or more on a simple power cord, then I'd suggest not finding out how good your system can actually sound with 1 in it.

Cheers,
Robin

I was writing something similar, Robin, in replying to Chris's post. Glad I changed my mind and read yours. Ah, the law of diminishing returns. It applies to Hi-fi as well. My experience has been that even with the wall outlet change (I did it with the PS Audio one) you can hear a difference, the question is how much you'd want to blow, and risk the ungratifying results sometimes (no improvement, or worse due to mismatch). Like any hobby, it can get costly, when you get no satisfaction from the money spent.

Wind Chaser · « **Reply #14 on:** 19 Dec 2007, 03:56 pm »

This power cord will make a HUGE difference.

But hurry! The half price sale ends in two days.

BrianM · « **Reply #15 on:** 19 Dec 2007, 04:05 pm »

Quote from: TheChairGuy on 19 Dec 2007, 02:54 pm

Cryo'ed, teflon tubes, silver, and fancy connectors may indeed improve the signal transfer further

Signal transfer?

Stercom · « **Reply #16 on:** 19 Dec 2007, 04:08 pm »

Hi, from my experience power cords make a dramatic difference and doesn't have to be in $10,000 systems as some have indicated. My office system I listen to at least 8 hours a day is well under $3,000. Based on the quality of equipment you listed I would definately say you will hear an improvement over the usual stock power cords. Changing to silver based cords on the sources and copper based on the amp and power supplies made a big difference in the overall sound. All aspects of the sound "relaxed" yet became more dynamic. Check out the Black Sand, VH Audio, Mr. Cable and PS Audio power cables if you want good quality and good sounding power cables for under $500 each at retail and much less used. An upgraded power outlet will also make an improvement and is recommended - I've only used PS Audio's so no comment on the other outlets mentioned.

AliG · « **Reply #17 on:** 19 Dec 2007, 04:09 pm »

Wind Chaser,
I didn't realize that you're VD fan too!!

Yes, I can wholeheartedly recommend VD - it makes a hell of a difference, especially when you're using digital source and have very transparent sounding speakers (with ribbon tweeter), some may not like it, but that's beside the point!

I would actually recommend picking up a power-3 on Audiogon for $130-$150 to get a taste of it. If you order it from VD directly, you have to pay about $34 shipping!

Rgds
barry

Quote from: Wind Chaser on 19 Dec 2007, 03:56 pm

This power cord will make a HUGE difference. But hurry! The half price sale ends in two days.

Wind Chaser · « **Reply #18 on:** 19 Dec 2007, 04:34 pm »

Quote from: AliG on 19 Dec 2007, 04:09 pm

Wind Chaser,
I didn't realize that you're VD fan too!!
Yes, I can wholeheartedly recommend VD - it makes a hell of a difference, especially when you're using digital source and have very transparent sounding speakers (with ribbon tweeter), some may not like it, but that's beside the point!

I would actually recommend picking up a power-3 on Audiogon for $130-$150 to get a taste of it. If you order it from VD directly, you have to pay about $34 shipping!

I've met Rick at his shop and spent an afternoon chatting it up with him. I wanted to exchange my 6' P3 to an 8' P3. He must have liked me because he exchanged my PC for an 8' Nite with no extra charge.

AliG · « **Reply #19 on:** 19 Dec 2007, 04:40 pm »

What???

Can I send you my Nite PC, and you go into his shop and ask him to change it to Master PC??

You are one lucky man.

Quote from: Wind Chaser on 19 Dec 2007, 04:34 pm

I've met Rick at his shop and spent an afternoon chatting it up with him. I wanted to exchange my 6' P3 to an 8' P3. He must have liked me because he exchanged my PC for an 8' Nite with no extra charge.