Trying out Vinyl

nrenter · « **Reply #20 on:** 1 Dec 2007, 02:07 am »

What do they do to it compared to a new Technics 1200? From the KAB site:

Quote

Before any upgrades, KAB performs a rigorous inspection and makes corrections as required to ensure that every Custom KAB 1200 performs correctly.

1. Tighten all case screws. Beleive it or not, it is often neccessary.
2. Install cartridge and test wiring for continuity.
3. Balance arm and test bearing friction vertical and lateral.
4. Full operational test.
5. Test platter for proper fit. The platter must not rock on the spindle shaft. KAB will re-machine the platter center hole to ensure a perfect fit. This is always the result of nicks inside the platter center hole. How they get there we do not know, but if they interfere with the proper fit of the platter we will correct it.
6. Test platter for flatness or planarity. KAB will replace a platter that exceeds + - 0.005" planarity as measured with a Mahr runout guage on the platter edge.
7. Check azimuth alignment of cartridge socket. Correct it neccessary.

Again, just my opinion, but I'd much rather have a KAB 1200 than a Music Hall or a Rega. I recommended a 1200 to a buddy back in '87, and he's still using it to this day.

Oh, and don't buy any of those "upgrades" either. Someday you *may* want them, but you don't need them to enjoy the table or the promise of vinyl. I'm not saying they don't make things better, but "upgrades" usually prey on the insecurities of audiophiles - you can quickly outspend your base table on "upgrades". Get the base table and a basic cartridge, have it set up correctly, sit back and enjoy the music.

RawB8figure · « **Reply #21 on:** 1 Dec 2007, 03:40 am »

so is it a technics cartridge and is the needle replaceable.

Jampot · « **Reply #22 on:** 1 Dec 2007, 08:55 am »

You need to 'select' a cartridge - it isn't factory fit - But any dealer worth their salt should fit it for you.

See what Kabusa (if that is still a consideration) has to say on the web site. Look at the prices, decide what you want to spend (it wont be a lot if you are to stay rigidly within budget) and then talk to Kevin on the phone...

Most will have replacement stli available, though very often the need for one is the cue / opportunity to move up to a better cartridge

Jim

Panelman · « **Reply #23 on:** 1 Dec 2007, 04:56 pm »

Also seriously consider a record cleaning machine. They may appear expensive at first but make a major difference in the sound quality and enjoyment of vinyl. There is nothing worse than a tick or pop intruding on a quite moment and bringing you out of the moment, and with good vinyl you will be in the moment quite often.

The Nitty Gritty machines are good and if you go manual they aren't too expensive. If you consider that a machine can make a good record as quiet as a CD and you can buy many good used records the machine pays for itself. I agree with the earlier posts about the Basis, or at least the idea of hearing some quality turntables before setting your budget, you may decide to spend more upfront and not buy a table that you will want to replace in a short time. Good Luck.

RawB8figure · « **Reply #24 on:** 1 Dec 2007, 05:45 pm »

so the technics 1200 doesnt come with a cartridge. what are cartridges worth . I thought I would if I bought the KAB I could pull it out of the box and play.

TheChairGuy · « **Reply #25 on:** 1 Dec 2007, 06:12 pm »

Quote from: RawB8figure on 1 Dec 2007, 05:45 pm

so the technics 1200 doesnt come with a cartridge. what are cartridges worth . I thought I would if I bought the KAB I could pull it out of the box and play.

If you buy everything from KABUSA (or other dealers like Todd the Vinyl Junkie - TTVJ.com) - they usually mount, balance and do everything for you on the cartridge. So, when you get it home, you just plug into a phono preamp and, literally, play.

Enjoy - John

TONEPUB · « **Reply #26 on:** 1 Dec 2007, 06:16 pm »

Go here:

http://www.amazon.com/Audio-Technica-AT-PL120-Professional-Direct-Drive-Turntable/dp/B00012EYNG/ref=pd_bbs_4?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1196533439&sr=8-4

You can get the Audio Technica clone of the SL1200 for 170 bucks. Fit up
a shure M97 for another 75 bucks and start digging vinyl on the cheap. I
love mine!

TheChairGuy · « **Reply #27 on:** 1 Dec 2007, 06:48 pm »

Damn, that deck is impressive for the money, Jeff

It even weighs 23 lbs...about what the Technics weighs: http://www.audio-technica.com/cms/turntables/c2b92193a60be297/index.html

For $299.99, you get a better mat, and LPGear/LPTunes checks and aligns the cartridge thoroughly so it's literally plug in and play with the built-in phono preamp (which I assume can be bypassed if you'd like to use one of your own choosing?)

You can probably even ask LPTunes to upgrade the cartridge to a AT440MLa and the combo won't break $400 - wow, that's good, everything complete, including the phono preamp! It even comes with a dust cover for that price!

A seriously decent value that combo is. 135 good reviews on Amazon is pretty reliable evidence that it ain't shabby, at all

http://lptunes.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=696&HS=1

RawB8figure · « **Reply #28 on:** 1 Dec 2007, 08:39 pm »

so if get the technics 1200 which cartridge should i get. Also do I have to buy the stylus separate or is it included in the cartridge.

TONEPUB · « **Reply #29 on:** 1 Dec 2007, 08:47 pm »

It's way better than it should be for that kind of dough!
Im using mine with a Shure M97 and love it! I haven't
sold the SME yet, but as an entry level table that should
be able to serve a vinyl lover well, it's the way to go.

I bought this instead of an SL1200 for a couple of reasons.

A: Price, it was 1/3 the money.
B: It plays 78's
C: It actually had a more open sound than the SL1200 we
had in for review. Im sure it was a diff in cabling that
could be easily cured, but compared side by side, we
all preferred the sound of the AT... (I know this
will open a huge can of worms...)

Again, as a budget table, this is an awful lot of value!

Wayner · « **Reply #30 on:** 1 Dec 2007, 08:49 pm »

New set-up discovery.................

I didn't want to start a new subject, so I'll jump on this one. I have figured out how to adjust VTA with a mirror. Simply place an old junkie record on the platter, place one of those frame-less 3/32" think mirrors on top of the record (under the tone arm shaft) and lower the stylus onto the record (yes, with the platter not running). Then view the image of the tone arm shaft with the tone arm...closing the gap as you raise your field of vision, you will be able to tell if the arm and the image are parallel. This will work great for shaped tone arms as well. If yours is tapered, this will not work.

Wayner

Jampot · « **Reply #31 on:** 1 Dec 2007, 09:21 pm »

TRYING to stay on topic....

RawB'

There really isn't any 'should' about the choice of cartridge. The examples That Jeff (Tonepub) and John (TCG) cite in there exchange about the AT clone are valid starting points - i.e. the Shure M97 and the AT440MLa respectively. There have been discussions about their relative performance before in these pages - use the search facility. I expect either of these would be just fine in aTechnics.

This thread -

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=44808.0

follows the adventures of 'young' Charles Calkins in his return to vinyl after a long lay off and has loads of relevant comment including the topic of cartridge choice.

A new cartridge will always come with the stylus. Unless you are particularly unlucky AND hamfisted it should be sometime before you need to be concerned with stylus replacement.

Incidentally, if Jeffs proposal for the Audio Technica clone piques your interest check out the entry level packages at Kabusa. In all seriousness, you won't get a lot of customer support at Amazon!

(Damn, I sound like a Kabusa pimp and I have a rega planar3 and vintage Denon DD in my systems right now

)

RawB' - that last comment was for everyone else's benefit, not yours

Wayner, I like the mirror idea- I'll try it on the Denon, as you well know the Rega ain't well endowed in that department

Jim

Wayner · « **Reply #32 on:** 1 Dec 2007, 09:49 pm »

As the official pimp of the AT440MLa, I will throw in my hell ya for that cartridge. I just re-shoed a couple of tables here (The Empire and the VPI Hw-19) with a new stylus. Listening to Roy Orbison's Mystery Girl last night turned me in to a teared up blurried eye dope. When you actually forget about the equipment and just hear the music is where I'm at.

Now get out there and give someone your VISA card number. The vinyl is waiting.

Wayner

RawB8figure · « **Reply #33 on:** 1 Dec 2007, 11:38 pm »

so I think I will go the the SL1200MK5SE. But kind of over whelmed with the cartridges. How do i know what fits and are these stereo?? Also what brands are desent?

nrenter · « **Reply #34 on:** 2 Dec 2007, 12:35 am »

When you call KAB and order your SL-1200 MK5SE, ask him what he'd recommend in your price range. You will never get a consensus on this site (expecially since you didn't list a price range - your new SL-1200 MK5SE has already taken you over your initial budget). IMHO, don't spend more than $100 on your first cartridge.

RawB8figure · « **Reply #35 on:** 2 Dec 2007, 12:38 am »

also what am I looking at for life span on a cartridge,

nrenter · « **Reply #36 on:** 2 Dec 2007, 01:01 am »

Don't worry about it.

RawB8figure · « **Reply #37 on:** 2 Dec 2007, 07:15 am »

are there any places online for cartridges or vinyl in canada

TONEPUB · « **Reply #38 on:** 2 Dec 2007, 07:39 am »

I second the notion of the "starter" cartridge. Buy something, get used to doing set up and see how you like it. There are a ton of cartridges in the 100-1000 dollar range these days, so you have a ton of things to choose from!

I like the Shure primarily for playing older records that I've bought used for relatively cheap. It tends to overlook the small flaws in those records, but I was surprised at how much it offered. Not the best rig I own, but that , an AT or a grado, perhaps even a Sumiko blue point are all good places to start your journey.

Gotta start somewhere! Good luck

RawB8figure · « **Reply #39 on:** 2 Dec 2007, 08:06 am »

how is the Shure M97xE . I can get one on amazon for 67$.