WTB: Devore Gibbon 9 or Super 8

TheChairGuy · « **Reply #60 on:** 15 Jun 2007, 05:21 pm »

Srajan / Michael Lavorgna (other audio-related journalists),

We now require dealers to have, at the very least, a sign-off that includes their website. I think it would be wise, and in fact we may soon demand, that publishers, writers and other 'journalists' involved in reporting high fidelity, have a short sign-off similarly.

While we realize that you indeed are audio-phools first and foremost and this is why you do what you do, we also realize you now have persuasions and subjective reasoning (much like a politician) regarding audio interests.

So, please, in the interest of fairness and transparency to all, indicate what you do audio-related and a website link in three lines or less in your sign-off here at AudioCircle.

Srajan - I'm Greek of Cypriot descent and know about where you are. So far from civilization on the Western side of the island....but, peaceful. I can't find Keo wines here in San Francisco

Thank you,

John / Global Moderator

Vinnie R. · « **Reply #61 on:** 15 Jun 2007, 05:27 pm »

Quote from: Srajan Ebaen on 15 Jun 2007, 04:12 pm

How it'll come off we'll see but Mike's onboard with the concept and John said he'd make himself available to spend a day or two and let Mike hear various juxtapositions of his models in the NYC metro area - at dealers, perhaps certain key customers, his digs and the factory.

All,

I am picking up a new pair of the DeVore Gibbons Nines next week!

I'd be happy to have Michael over my place to listen to them with some Red Wine amps aa

Michael can even take the train from NYC (Grand Central Station) up to New Haven, CT and I'll pick him up (I am only about 25 minutes North of New Haven).

Or I can bring a Sig 30 and iMod combo to NYC when I pick up the Nines and we can play them on the streets of Brooklyn... off-the-grid, remember? Even better would be the Brooklyn bridge... less reflections:
http://www.6moons.com/showcase/devore/devore.html

-Vinnie

miklorsmith · « **Reply #62 on:** 15 Jun 2007, 05:29 pm »

Is this Universal Law now, John?

What do you mean by "we're like politicians"?

mcullinan · « **Reply #63 on:** 15 Jun 2007, 05:32 pm »

Jeez this forum is heating up, or having a meltdown... hehe.

Maybe we should put a clause in that audio sellers/reviewers must arm wrestle or initiate a king of the hill battle for world audio domination.

I think it would be fun to wear tags like Hi my name is...

All joking aside I know we are trying to have a forum that is objective to a point.. though there is no such thing as a utopia of the mind.

Who knows if that made any sense? Anyways tra lala... now skipping naked through midtown traffic...
Mike

zybar · « **Reply #64 on:** 15 Jun 2007, 05:34 pm »

Quote from: Vinnie R. on 15 Jun 2007, 05:27 pm

Quote from: Srajan Ebaen on 15 Jun 2007, 04:12 pm
How it'll come off we'll see but Mike's onboard with the concept and John said he'd make himself available to spend a day or two and let Mike hear various juxtapositions of his models in the NYC metro area - at dealers, perhaps certain key customers, his digs and the factory.

All,

I am picking up a new pair of the DeVore Gibbons Nines next week!

I'd be happy to have Michael over my place to listen to them with some Red Wine amps aa

Michael can even take the train from NYC (Grand Central Station) up to New Haven, CT and I'll pick him up (I am only about 25 minutes North of New Haven).

Or I can bring a Sig 30 and iMod combo to NYC when I pick up the Nines and we can play them on the streets of Brooklyn... off-the-grid, remember? Even better would be the Brooklyn bridge... less reflections:
http://www.6moons.com/showcase/devore/devore.html

-Vinnie

Can I come over for a listen Vinnie?

This way I can hear three products (70's, iMod, and Devore speakers) I have been interested in at once!!

George

TheChairGuy · « **Reply #65 on:** 15 Jun 2007, 06:01 pm »

Quote from: miklorsmith on 15 Jun 2007, 05:29 pm

Is this Universal Law now, John?

What do you mean by "we're like politicians"?

Nope, Mike - hasn't been broached with JohnR yet - but I think it wise to do and I will shortly.

If you've received any compensation whatsoever audio-related, I would think you would prefer to have a sign-off that includes this included for fairness. It will curtail a lot of explaining later for you.

If I sold or reported on some facet of audio other than being a fully amateur participant, I would do so - or I couldn't live with myself, frankly. Interject - the three Global Moderators are fully volunteers

Okay now, we're not talking POLITICS - only how politicians relate to audio journalists, dealers and manufacturers. But, as Politicians cannot speak fully their minds on issue as there are subtexts to think of (ie, of the next election for them and their associates at risk) so too is there a gentle subjectivity to any point of view expressed by journalists, dealers or manufacturers.

We now require disclosure for dealers and manufacturers - would think it wise to require journalists to do so, as well. I actually think you should embrace that concept out of fairness to your fellow audio enthusiasts.

miklorsmith · « **Reply #66 on:** 15 Jun 2007, 06:21 pm »

I haven't received any compensation of any kind.

Are the perceived, political subtexts you refer to any different than what happens right here under our AC noses? I think the unspoken rule is to avoid negative discussions of any audio product here, Especially featured manufacturers. There are popular products here that I do not care for. Others do. I don't voice these opinions. For that matter, how many negative posts about products do we see here? This thread is an unfortunately timely example.

Many stones have been thrown from the populous toward reviewers openly wondering why negative reviews aren't written. Sure, more positive examples exist but this is not universal.

The word "political" means literally "of the people". The dictionary does not cast the connotative pall normally associated with the term. But, the same ebbs and flows you attribute exclusively to "compensated" writers exist right here are are omnipresent. It would be naive to think otherwise.

For the record, 6moons' ironclad policy is that NO negotiation for ANY price breaks on ANY reviewed gear may take place until the review is completed. I have not been in position to experience this first-hand but it was one of the few and critically important rules handed down upon my inclusion. The intent is clear - to prevent the uncertainty of appearance intrinsic to this gig.

Furthermore, who here doesn't know these characters you're targeting now? Are they hiding anything?

I don't necessarily disagree with identifying oneself and establishing full disclosure, but I'm not seeing the gaping chasm of (implied) morality between "us" and "them", whereever you draw those lines.

TheChairGuy · « **Reply #67 on:** 15 Jun 2007, 06:39 pm »

Mike, seriously, you have a few things incorrect

There is no unspoken or spoken rule to avoid negative discussions of any audio product here, especially featured manufacturers. None, whatsoever. Keep in mind the manufacturers that have circles here were, by and large, voted on by membership so they have already demonstrated some sort of worthiness in customer service, value and or of the highest fidelity. So, likely negatives are few and far between...you might say the market has already had their say on their worth

If you haven't received any compensation for your writing, then it is fully up to you to disclose your writing or not. Without financial renumeration, you are and can mostly be objective. So, as you seem to see things only in stark black and white context...you are in fact a 'tweener'

Mike, I find your writing to be lucid and a great read and do not have any issues with you...but it seems you do with me and have expressed this on numerous occasions here at AC in the most recent 4 months or so. Other than ticking you off by fully expressing my opinions on the state of compact disc playback, I truly know not why. I do think you have an issue with authority, and perceive me as such

I will re-state for the record that I am a volunteer here and do some much more than many folks see as a public service to audiophiles. I have a business completely unrelated to audio matters to tend to...this is wholly volunteer / without compensation of any kind. Nor, do I expect any in the future, near or far. If you think things are unfair - there are several circles at AC that could use a co-moderator. Please volunteer yourself and 'change the culture' as an insider yourself.

fyi - I didn't know Michael Lavorgna was an audio reviewer until today. I assume there are many others that did not know, either.

The term Insider (that you have used before) is one that you seem fixated on....and is largely nonexistent for all except JohnR...who has the keys to this place.

I'd like you to stop kicking me in the shins as you have of late (it hurts, I'm human I assure you) ...and would like to repair the good relationship we once had together. I'm going to PM you my telephone number as PM's can get tedious and invite you to call me and talk it over. I think you'll find me far less of an ogre than my AC persona may be indicating to you.

miklorsmith · « **Reply #68 on:** 15 Jun 2007, 06:53 pm »

Quote from: TheChairGuy on 15 Jun 2007, 06:39 pm

Mike, seriously, you have a few things incorrect

If I had a nickle for every time I heard that . . . [or]

You'd probably get along great with my wife . . . [or]

Impossible, let me check my figures again . . .

I work in the regulation business as a proponent, so I probably do have a bit of a chip on my shoulder for rules. Early in my hand-wringing career a wise engineer told me "it's not you, they (governmental reviewers) are not commenting on you, it's just a plan". This attitude has allowed me freedom to argue points without being personal and when I see things I disagree with I do just that. There's no animosity toward you John, nor anyone else (unless they're just a twit).

So, from my standpoint I can argue your points and still think you're a swell guy (I do).

If we're trying to foster an atmosphere of freedom, I should be able to express myself as should you. If we agree to disagree, that's OK.

Maybe I expressed myself poorly regarding the "policy" of negative words. I did not mean there is an AC rule, rather that it's considered bad form AND any negativity creates a firestorm of controversy with the commenter being in the center. Not wanting to bring this upon oneself is a powerful motivator.

I really don't have it in for you, John. I thought we buried the digital hatchet deep in the cyber dirt and I frankly haven't thought about that chapter in some time.

So, bygones be, do what you wish regarding affiliation-disclosure and we'll catch ya on the flip side.

TheChairGuy · « **Reply #69 on:** 15 Jun 2007, 07:20 pm »

I think I've been intoxicated by your words again, Mike

Let love rein and peace be on earth....

Ciao, John

(tvad4, glad two things came of this sordid DeVore post. It seemed innocent enough at the start, eh?)

miklorsmith · « **Reply #70 on:** 15 Jun 2007, 08:10 pm »

Peace, love, and happy Friday!!

Srajan Ebaen · « **Reply #71 on:** 16 Jun 2007, 03:15 am »

None of my writers is compensated. They all do this as enthusiast hobbyists. Giving certain statements further up, I thought this relevant to add.

Needless to say, if this forum adopts the rule that writers/publishers have a signature identifying them as such, including a weblink (which other forums might view as self promotion), we'd be happy to comply, of course. In which case, I assume you'll have an auto feature during log-in that captures that information the way you want it displayed.

lonewolfny42 · « **Reply #72 on:** 16 Jun 2007, 03:25 am »

Quote from: Srajan Ebaen on 15 Jun 2007, 03:53 pm

To be sure, I know of Michael's friendship with John DeVore which is precisely the reason why he doesn't write formal reviews on this brand for us. You'll notice the Nines are bound for Cyprus. However, for the same reason, a factory tour by Michael seemed very much on the ball as such a relationship opens doors and gets access to information and opportunities someone else might not get - and that serves the reader. It was actually my idea that, if John deVore was amenable, Michael should attempt to compare all DeVore models side by side to give readers an idea what more money up the line buys. This wouldn't be something any reviewer anywhere could possibly do. Needless to say, Michael's RoadTour Format isn't a formal review environ by a long shot (nor shold it be) so this would be a very informal thing, of hearing various models in an unfamiliar environment and coming to certain conclusions with regards to value, bass, SPLs, room size and such.

Just as an aside.

Thats a good idea...an all model comparison !!

eric the red · « **Reply #73 on:** 16 Jun 2007, 04:56 am »

Quote from: miklorsmith on 15 Jun 2007, 06:21 pm

Furthermore, who here doesn't know these characters you're targeting now? Are they hiding anything?

Right on Mike-nicely put

C'Mon TCG-two channel internet audio is a very small world where most of the characters in question are pretty well known and whose motives I suspect are only to add enjoyment to this wacked hobby of ours. And if a rave review ever steers you wrong, there's always Audiogon...

JohnR · « **Reply #74 on:** 16 Jun 2007, 06:58 am »

Quote from: Srajan Ebaen on 16 Jun 2007, 03:15 am

Needless to say, if this forum adopts the rule that writers/publishers have a signature identifying them as such, including a weblink (which other forums might view as self promotion), we'd be happy to comply, of course.

OK, well, since the topic comes up, we have the rule, and have had for a while now:

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=41871.0

In the case of someone who is not paid, I guess you could say the rule doesn't apply, but even so I think it's better if affiliations are disclosed up front. It will only take a minute of your time to do.

Thanks

JohnR

Srajan Ebaen · « **Reply #75 on:** 16 Jun 2007, 07:54 am »

I'm looking at your registry window and I don't see a provision for a permanent signature coming up. You're suggesting to type it in with each post? Or is there an electronic way to register a signature and weblink permanently, to automatically appear in the 'reply' window for posts?

JohnR · « **Reply #76 on:** 16 Jun 2007, 08:07 am »

Hi, click on Profile in the menubar, or click here. In the menu at the left, click on "Forum Profile Information." Towards the bottom is a text box called Signature -- enter the information and click "Change Profile."

Thanks

(I'll add this info to the guideline...)

JohnR

Srajan Ebaen · « **Reply #77 on:** 16 Jun 2007, 08:43 am »

You're prince. Instructions for dummies. Now I'm all set.

michaelavorgna · « **Reply #78 on:** 16 Jun 2007, 03:54 pm »

I should be all set as well.

Quote

Thats a good idea...an all model comparison !!

We're in the process of nailing down the details. It's looking like I'll get to hear gibbon 3s, 7.1s, super 8s, The Nines and Silverbacks (possibly a few different pair). It also means I'll be hearing as many different systems in as many different places (all in NYC which makes this possible). A whirlwind for sure but I have high hopes of making some sense of it all.

kyyuan · « **Reply #79 on:** 16 Jun 2007, 09:28 pm »

Back to topic...

Tvad -- did you pick-up that pair of Super 8 on Audiogon? They were gone in a flash.