[Mad DOg]

thanks to Randytsuch, i had the opportunity to spend the last 3 days comparing the Onix Ref 1 speakers to Danny Ritchie's GR Research Criterion speakers.

since i had the speakers for the weekend, i decided to host a listening session today. some of the LA locals showed up as expected...those in attendance were John Casler, sa-dono, Mike of Cryotweaks, and Jon L (audiocircle member). always good to see John, Sa-dono, and Mike as they are some great folks! special thanks to Mike for bringing along some bybee interconnects and a bybee power cord! btw, he makes a nice cryo'd power cord as well!



Criterion Specifications

    * 2-way bass reflex design
    * Series crossover network using the best available components.
    * CSS ARG2 ribbon tweeter.
    * Latest Eton 5-880/25 HEX-b woofer
    * Frequency response is +/-1.2dB
    * -3dB is 55hz
    * Sensitivity is 85dB (1watt/1m)
    * Recommended amplification is 50 to 100 watts and no more than 200 watts.
    * Impedance 8 ohms nominal and 5 ohms minimal.
    * Dimensions: 12" x 7.5" x 11.75" hwd
    * Price fully assembled: $1,429/pair

after having read so many positive comments on GR-Research products, I had high expectations for these touted ribbon monitors...

please note that these impressions are MY OPINIONS.  i arrived at them using MY GEAR and listening to them in MY ROOM.

the GR Research Criterion speaker is a solidly built speaker. build quality and cabinet finish is quite good. while the binding posts aren't the WBT type, they are quality pieces that held the banana plugs of my Onix SP-200 speaker wire very snugly. the Crit's nice, real wood veneer is definitely something i can live with. not quite as posh as the high gloss BEM of the Ref 1s, but still very good. since many of you have already read about my impressions of the Onix Ref 1s, my impressions will mainly focus on the GR Research Criterions.

so how do they sound? it depends on the gear...we tried them with a solid state preamp and a tube preamp feeding solid state amps...what a case of Jekyll and Hyde! with the solid state preamp, the Crits sounded nice, but certainly not what i'd expect from a $1.4K monitor. compared to the Ref 1s, the Crits sounded very dark, VERY laid back and generally unengaging at lower volumes. At lower listening levels, music from the Crits sounded like they were beaming out of 2 spots. Soundstage was not very big, wide or deep. Imaging was ok. The ribbon was indeed smooth but at the expense of intricate detail. Characteristic of most ribbons I've heard, these have a very limited dispersion as well which results in the narrower sweet spot, smaller soundstage width and a more focused sound. However, as the volume knob was turned up the ribbons sprang to life. I found that the louder the Crits played the more they began to engage the listener. I unconsciously found myself tapping my toes. Unfortunately on Natalie Merchant's Ophelia (test disc used at this point), the woofers of the Crits began bottoming out clearly showing signs of distress and compression at a mere 92-95dBs measured at the listening position. In comparison, the Ref 1s at the same volume show no signs of breaking down.  The bass from the Crit Eton woofers were not up to the task of producing tight, clean, and extended bass that my Ref 1s are capable of. With my solid state gear, the Ref 1s and Crits are very different speakers. While I normally listen between 70-85dBs, the choice for me is clear. The Ref 1s offer much more clarity, detail, soundstage width and depth, and far better bass than the Crits...(the difference was SO great that I'm beginning to think that the Crits I listened to were defective? i'm not sure)

replacing the solid state preamp with a tube pre gave the Crits new life! WOW what  difference this makes! the Crit became an entirely different speaker. mids were more forward. the treble was less recessed and dark. bass was still the same but overall the speaker had more life. the Refs responded very favorably to the tube pre as well! mids while very good w/ the solid state pre, were now SOOOO luscious and liquid! the realism the tube pre added to the vocals was amazing. while the tube preamp improved the Criterion's presentation, they still were not my cup of tea. in retrospect, the sound and presentation of the GR Research Criterions is very reminiscent of the $~500 Aurum Cantus Leisure 2Ds.

i can see the Crits work well with brighter electronics and brighter room. i have heard my refs w/ brighter electronics and in brighter rooms where the resulting treble was simply too hot for my tastes but in my room with my gear, it's an easy choice to go with the Ref 1s simply because they are sooo smooth, SOOOOO detailed, have AMAZING bass response (Mike asked if the sub was on as did Jon L from AudioCircle when the Refs were playing), image like there's no tomorrow, present a soundstage SOOO wide and deep (better than any monitor I've heard to date) and have that oh so beautiful gloss BEM finish and only cost $75 more than the Crits.

once again, these are MY IMPRESSIONS, arrived at in MY ROOM using MY GEAR...YMMV...thanks for reading...happy listening...

[lonewolfny42]

Nice review - could you tell us about your room and equipement used-THANKS !!

[Mad DOg]

Nice review - could you tell us about your room and equipement used-THANKS !!

thanks....

preamps: sim audio celeste p-5003(cryotweak $49 cryo'd power cord); wright audio WLA12A
amps: aragon palladium II monoblocks; ati at2505
CD transport: rotel RDD-980
DAC: perpetual technologies modwright level 1 p-3/a and p-1/a upsampler, jitter reduction
cables: onix sp-200 speaker cables, onix blue IC from pre to amp, zu cable disco from DAC to preamp, onix grand master II digital coax cable
parallel line filter: quantum symphony pro, electroclear QRTs

room: approx 12' W x 14' D x 8 1/2' H

placement: speakers placed about 8' apart on 24" stands 3' away from the back wall and away from the corners. listening position is approx 6-7' triangulated from the speakers and 4-5' from the back wall. right side of the room has a sliding door that is covered by drapes. left side of the room opens up into the dining area. floors are carpeted. ceiling has popcorn treatment.

forgot to mention music used during listening session.

Dire Straits Private Investigations; Money For Nothing
Natalie Merchant: Ophelia
Diana Krall: Live in Paris
Sa-dono's special audition track
Kasey Chambers Sampler (thanks Jon L)
John Casler's special audition tracks + Tin Pan Alley

since i had the speakers for a few extra days, i threw a bunch of classical music at the Crits as well to arrive at my conclusions.

[lonewolfny42]

On your speaker stand height,couple inches short - best around 28".This height brings these mini-monitors into better ear range. IMHO I'll agree  about bass , impact a little short, but overall  nice speaker.I had these on home audition last week and I'm working on my review.

[Mad DOg]

On your speaker stand height,couple inches short - best around 28".This height brings these mini-monitors into better ear range. IMHO...

we all agreed on this...since i only have 24" speaker stands we did actually kneel down/sit on the floor to bring our ears to below the height of the tweeter...a bit better but not much. hopefully the others who attended will chime in as well.

while the Crits are nice speakers, i'd really recommend trying to audition the Refs. they are some of the most amazing speakers i've come across to this date. truly awesome.

[Jon L]

Thanks for hosting.  Nice to meet all of you in my first outing.

I just looked up the specs on the CSS ARG2 ribbon tweeters.  It is spec'd at sensitivity of 95 dB/w/m into 8ohms! It also costs $319 Canadian each? Since the GR Crit is 85 db/w/m, the poor ribbon tweeter is padded down a LOT to match the Eton woofer.  When I was playing around with Esg 2 and Esg3 ribbon tweeters, they were very sensitive to crossover components and wires.  The smaller Esg2 could sound too soft and dark if padded down too much or used with "warm" solid core copper wire.  I had to use minimal number of high-quality X-over parts with silver wire in X-over to get great clarity and detail while retaining the ribbon smoothness.  

Ribbon tweeters are a tricky business, and I'm sure the CSS ribbons would have sounded better matched to something like Focal 7K2 midrange (95 db sensitive).  

Having said that, I did like the vifa ring tweeter in your Onyx ref 1.  It seemed to have most/all? of detail of Focal inverted Titanium tweeter with less of that ringing brightness.  

Anyhow, you will invite us back when you get the Rogue, won't you?

[brad b]

I own the Diluceo, and find the differences you suggest and what I hear to be quite different.  Danny had talked about crossing over the tweeter at a lower point in the newer Criterions, but don't know how he is currently designing these.  

Frankly I find the ribbon tweeter in the Diluceo to be very similar sounding to the VMPS new ribbon, which I also find to be very detailed without harshness.

Hopefully Danny can shed some light on the crossover point, and let us know if these were his originals, or updated design.
thx for the honest review.
b

[shokunin]

great review Mad Dog, hopefully bioforce can chime in on the differences between the crit's ribbon tweeter and the FST tweeter from VMPS.  Too bad I could not make it, hopefully later this month when the AVA stuff comes rolling in..

[Tyson]

Haven't heard the Criterions, but the Dilucio's I heard at Brads are very different from what you describe here.  I wonder if it's the dual woofers allowing the tweeter to not be padded down as much.

[Sa-dono]

Too bad I could not make it, hopefully later this month when the AVA stuff comes rolling in..

You were missed.. But yeah..hopefully you can make it next time..as I would love to hear the AVA gear. Which ones are you buying? You can PM me if you'd like.

[Sa-dono]

Haven't heard the Criterions, but the Dilucio's I heard at Brads are very different from what you describe here.  I wonder if it's the dual woofers allowing the tweeter to not be padded down as much.

Well we can just hope that Danny will chime in here.

[Mad DOg]

Haven't heard the Criterions, but the Dilucio's I heard at Brads are very different from what you describe here.  I wonder if it's the dual woofers allowing the tweeter to not be padded down as much.

i definitely wasn't expecting this either. that's why i questioned that there could've been something wrong with the speakers i heard. that's always a possibility...

Danny should definitely get w/ Mike to discuss what we heard.

[cryotweaks]

He is going to check them for damage when they get back to his shop.

I myself have owned, used or still own the Paradox, the AV1, and two custom designed models from GR-Research and can say with certainty that the Criterion's we auditioned did not posses the characteristic "sound" of a GR Research speaker.  

Perhaps another audition of them will be in order.  That may be the only way to get to the bottom of this.

[randytsuch]

Hi guys,
I heard this pair of speakers before you did, and my impressions did not match yours at all.  

I agree with the low end, they were not as good their as my tylers, but that's due to the size of these monitors, and the size of their drivers.

I did not think they were dark, or lacking in detail, in fact I thought they had better high freq detail then my tylers.  

I will post my review shortly too, I wanted to measure where they were, in my room, and then my review will be finished.

Right now, I am just wondering how much the room and system affected the speakers, I have my system in a larger room with high ceilings.

I know it will make a difference, but it does not seem like it should make THAT much difference.  I also must admit I did not have a lot of time to spend with the Crits, but I listened enough so I should have spotted if something was obviously wrong with them.

Strange.

Randy

[shokunin]

Hi Sa-dono,

Ahh.. I meant to say, when Mad Dog gets the Biros from AVA in.  Too much gear to want to listen to, and not enough time.  Well, not enough time that I can pry myself away from my daughter.  I'll probably be itching to listen to some tunes as my RM40's get fixed  

[Sa-dono]

I was wondering the same thing Randy, since you had mentioned to me that they had better detail than your Tylers. All of us there heard the same thing though. One person even heard it within the minute of just walking in the door, and us saying nothing to him (in regards to the speaker)

[Sa-dono]

Hi Sa-dono,

Ahh.. I meant to say, when Mad Dog gets the Biros from AVA in.  Too much gear to want to listen to, and not enough time.  Well, not enough time that I can pry myself away from my daughter.  I'll probably be itching to listen to some tunes as my RM40's get fixed  

Oh okay..was wondering there The next session will be fun for sure..and you MUST make it. Heck..bring your daughter along if you have to..as long as MD or either of the wifes don't mind. I'll even baby sit

[Danny Richie]

I just exchanged e-mails with Mike.

It definitely sounds like there is something wrong here.

Mike said,

"I don't know, but I did notice that the woofer cones looked as if they could have been damaged. I would check those Criterions for damage when they get back to you."

I got there a little later than most, and didn't get to spend much time listening to them. Not nearly as much time as Mad dOg.  They did sound alot darker than the Onix speakers.  Not characteristic of your speakers at all.  I have heard the AV1s, the Paradox, the PHL with the Vifa that you made as my center/surround, and my PHL/Revs.  They all sounded way more expensive than they were priced.  I seriously think there was either a speaker cable mismatch, or the Criterions were damaged.  I wouldn't stress Danny,  these guys really respect you, and were agonizing over how to write up the review.  Perhaps you could send them the Diluceos."

MadDOgs comments...

Crits sounded very dark, VERY laid back and generally unengaging at lower volumes. At lower listening levels, music from the Crits sounded like they were beaming out of 2 spots.

definitely says to me something is wrong.

The Criterion's are anything but what he just described.

And tweeters lacking detail?

There are no higher detailed tweeters on that market that I know of.

I have some Vifa XT's here now. I even built Mike Garner (he was there with you guys) a custom center channel with the XT tweeter. It sounds great but has no where near the detail of the G2.

Another group of guys in the D.C. area auditioned a group of speakers this weekend too, including the Criterion. Tweeters used in some were Vifa XT and Hiquphon tweeters.

Respected audiophile and speaker designer Dennis Murphy had this to say. "The G2 is a clear winner...   The G2 just has a more spacious, relaxed--yet detailed--sound than even the best dome."

At another listened party that took place in Dallas a few weeks ago we compared three pairs of speakers that all used the same woofer but all had different tweeters.

One was a Focus Audio clone using the Eton 5" woofer and the Scan Speak 9500 tweeter.

One was a DMG-1 using the Eton 5" woofer and the Usher 9950 tweeter.

And one was the Criterion using the 5" Eton and the G2 ribbon.

Hands down the G2 blew away the other two in the detail department. It was clear to all and quickly obvious, and the Criterion wasn't even crossed as low as the other two speakers.

So for the G2 to be said to lack detail says something was not right.

The Criterion uses a series network. If one component becomes disconnected both drivers still play but the response is out of whack.

This has happened a few times already from shipping damage. I suspect that as one possibility.

It is also possible that the Ref 1's have a more tipped up response on the top end giving them the impression of greater detail. I have not seen a response curve of them. Have any of you?

Woofer break-up at high volumes does not make sense either.

The Eton has a super stiff cone and they can be driven to ear splitting levels with no break-up. I have heard them driven to 100db levels on large 200 watt tube amps, clean as a whistle.

The sensitivity is low on the Criterion's. It may be more likely that the amp being used was giving out and causing the break-up than the Eton woofer.

And these woofers will play down to a -3db of 55hz.

I also sent out a pair of Diluceo's to a guy that also order the Ref 1's, and told him I would be glad to accept the Diluceo's back if he decided to keep the Ref 1's.

His comparisons sounded nothing like what you guys described, and he did not keep the Ref 1's. He kept the Diluceo's, and they have about the same overall sound that the Criterion's have with just higher sensitivity and twice the move mass (two woofers).

You guys should definitely send those back to GR Research so they can be checked out.

Feel free to cut and paste my responses to the other forums you guys will undoubtedly be posting this to.

[doug s.]

well, since these are the same pair i reviewed , i was also wondering about the lack of detail, & wondered if something was amiss.  also, i had to tilt them *up*, as well as have 'em on 28" stands, for them to give decent imaging.  bass wasn't an issue, as they blended seamlessly w/my vmps larger subs, crossed over at 60hz.  they *were* a bit lighter in the mid-bass, compared to my speakers, which have the 7" iteration of the same eton driver...  

while i really *did* enjoy the criterions, & thought they offered walue for $$$, i was hoping they would offere so much, that i'd wanna order the diluceo's on the spot, w/o even hearing them!     this dint happen...  while the diluceos may in fact improve on the areas that i found wanting w/the smaller criterions, compared to my present speakers, i'd be hesistant to buy w/o having a listen 1st...

so, i, too, will be anxious for an evaluation of this pair, from danny.  also, i would like to know what results he had from changing the x-over point to the lower 2.5khz walue of the diluceos...

doug s.

[TheeeChosenOne]

Even if they sounder darker or lacked detail (damaged or not), the bass was still markedly weaker in the comparo right?....