LFM SE Limited Special Edition Powered Subwoofers!

Mike Dzurko · « **on:** 29 Aug 2006, 05:08 pm »

We have a handful of remaining LFM cabinets and have decided to release the LFM as a Special Edition run. Very limited availability . . . . limited to cabinets and wood panels on hand.

If you've ever wanted a set of beautiful stereo subs that are flat to 20Hz at a VERY good price, check these out ASAP.

http://www.audioc.com/speakers1/jaglfm/lfmse.htm

Zero · « **Reply #1 on:** 29 Aug 2006, 05:10 pm »

Damn. Sucks to be broke.

Mike Dzurko · « **Reply #2 on:** 29 Aug 2006, 06:09 pm »

Quote from: A6M-ZERO on 29 Aug 2006, 05:10 pm

Damn. Sucks to be broke.

Charge cards . . . the American way

Zero · « **Reply #3 on:** 29 Aug 2006, 07:35 pm »

Mike,

If I had a CC... I'd be in some SERIOUS trouble

Eric · « **Reply #4 on:** 29 Aug 2006, 08:12 pm »

The LFM's are indeed very special. I highly recommend them

jimmyb · « **Reply #5 on:** 29 Aug 2006, 09:53 pm »

mike, or any one out there, I currently run a stacked pair of force subs, how would this compare? seems the same amplificatiuon but double the speaker area, what would oyu say the differences would be?

any thing close to a single or pair of Maestros?

rave959 · « **Reply #6 on:** 29 Aug 2006, 10:29 pm »

Hello,

Just a couple of questions: How would these subs be installed with Jaguar 2000? (

)

This is probably a dumb question, but I'll ask it anyway - I've experienced using monitors with subs through line outs and high pass filters, and while sounding more full-range, the clarity somewhat suffers (less open). How can this be fixed?

Thanks and Cheers!

Ian

opnly bafld · « **Reply #7 on:** 29 Aug 2006, 10:35 pm »

rave959,
Plug the ports of the Jaguars and run them fullrange.
Dial in the subs to match the rolloff of the mains.

Lin

Mike Dzurko · « **Reply #8 on:** 30 Aug 2006, 12:37 am »

Quote from: A6M-ZERO on 29 Aug 2006, 07:35 pm

Mike,

If I had a CC... I'd be in some SERIOUS trouble

You might be the wisest man in America . . . .

Mike Dzurko · « **Reply #9 on:** 30 Aug 2006, 12:40 am »

Quote from: jimmyb on 29 Aug 2006, 09:53 pm

mike, or any one out there, I currently run a stacked pair of force subs, how would this compare? seems the same amplificatiuon but double the speaker area, what would oyu say the differences would be?

any thing close to a single or pair of Maestros?

Stacked Force is a cool way to go. The short take is this will more than double the output potential of what you now have . . . the bottom will be lower, the slam will be harder, the room will seem bigger

Mike Dzurko · « **Reply #10 on:** 30 Aug 2006, 12:42 am »

Quote from: rave959 on 29 Aug 2006, 10:29 pm

Hello,

Just a couple of questions: How would these subs be installed with Jaguar 2000? ( )

This is probably a dumb question, but I'll ask it anyway - I've experienced using monitors with subs through line outs and high pass filters, and while sounding more full-range, the clarity somewhat suffers (less open). How can this be fixed?

Thanks and Cheers!
Ian

Ian:

I think Lin has the right idea . . . I'd set the 2000s on top and let it rip . . . you will be floored . . .

rave959 · « **Reply #11 on:** 30 Aug 2006, 01:37 am »

Mike,

Isn't the Jaguar 2000 structurally different from the one that Eric H's (latest version) has? The 2000 really tapers towards the bottom. From the pictures, the LFM seems that it's perfectly flat on top, which will provide minimum surface area for the 2000's to serve as stands. Currently, the 2000's are screwed on its dedicated stand. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Lin,

I currently have the original ACI Titans, and I did have the jaguar 2000's ports plugged and have used the high pass filters. I have also set the crossover to about 80-85Hz, where the 2000's roll off with the filters. It sounded HUGE. However, I have compared the 2000's by itself and with all the additional equipments and accessories mentioned above. It seems that the jags by itself is better still - more open. I hope this makes sense.

Thank you both for the quick response.

Ian

BradJudy · « **Reply #12 on:** 30 Aug 2006, 02:10 am »

Mmmmm...very nice. I bet a pair would also be killer in a multichannel system if one had an Outlaw ICBM set to stereo sub mode. Not in my budget, but I bet it would be fun.

opnly bafld · « **Reply #13 on:** 30 Aug 2006, 03:13 am »

Ian,
I am confused.

Did you use the Jaguars fullrange, direct from your amp, with no hi-pass?
How did you have your subs positioned?

Lin

rave959 · « **Reply #14 on:** 31 Aug 2006, 05:30 am »

Hi Lin,

Sorry for the confusion. Yes, I used the Jaguars full-range, direct from the amp, without the high pass. This sounds better to me (more open) than with the high pass at 85Hz, and subwoofer also at 85Hz, where the monitors would roll off. This is just one man's opinion, though. It may have something to do with the preamp/amp having to process (resistance) more components? Thanks for taking the time, Lin.

Ian

DSK · « **Reply #15 on:** 31 Aug 2006, 09:19 am »

Quote from: rave959 on 31 Aug 2006, 05:30 am

Hi Lin,

Sorry for the confusion. Yes, I used the Jaguars full-range, direct from the amp, without the high pass. This sounds better to me (more open) than with the high pass at 85Hz, and subwoofer also at 85Hz, where the monitors would roll off. This is just one man's opinion, though. It may have something to do with the preamp/amp having to process (resistance) more components? Thanks for taking the time, Lin.

Ian

Ian, did you set up the sub by ear or measurement software/equipment? It sounds like the sub's LP filter and/or gain level may have been set a little too high and caused the congestion (lack of openness) you mention. Does the problem persist if you reduce the sub's LP filter frequency a little?

rave959 · « **Reply #16 on:** 2 Sep 2006, 01:52 am »

DSK,

I did it by ear. Do you mean software as in room correction, mic, etc? or just the bass management?

Anyway, I don't think I've set the sub too high because I'm not a bass freak. In fact, the Jaguar's are really great with bass, better than some reputable floorstanders I've heard and at higher prices. The reason why I asked about the sub and all is to protect the jag's from over-excursion, because I plan to keep these for a very, very, long time. It's just that whenever I connect a sub, the clarity seems to suffer a bit.

Here are my settings:

Setting one:

I have the sub on the lowest setting @ 50Hz, and the 2000's port unplugged. This is the second best setting compared to just running the Jag 2000's running by itself, which is almost full-range.

Setting two:

Jag 2000's with ports plugged, high-pass filters at 85Hz installed. Sub configured at 80-85Hz. Soundstage is huge and in full-range, but sacrificing a bit of clarity.

Now, don't get me wrong, I've owned other high end speakers as well, and these are the ones that I still use and own for the longest. These speakers are special, really. I just wanted to have the last octave of bass without its clarity being altered.

I hope this makes sense.

Thanks,
ian

DSK · « **Reply #17 on:** 2 Sep 2006, 04:50 am »

Hi Ian,
If I understand what you have tried so far, your favourites are:
1) 2000's (ports unplugged & no HPF), no sub. ... best clarity.
2) 2000's (ports unplugged & no HPF), sub LPF @ 50hz. ... reduced clarity.
3) 2000's (ports plugged, 85hz HPF), sub LPF @ 80-85hz. ... reduced clarity.

I found it quite time consuming and frustrating to get an optimal sub/mains integration by ear. Trying all the different combinations of LPF, gain and phase on the sub (as well as sub location) is very tedious. I ended up buying the ETF5 software and used my RS meter (with calibration file) to get a flat response. It still takes a little work but you are less likely to start second guessing yourself and results are easily repeatable.

How do you know what LPF frequency you have the sub set at without measurement? Are they marked on the sub's xo dial or are you using tones and an RS meter, or just going by ear? Markings may not exactly match the response in your room, going by ear is unlikely to be accurate enough, an RS meter and tones is better than nothing but not as highly resolving as say ETF5.

Without the benefit of ETF5, I would suggest repeating setups 2 & 3 above, with the sub's LPF set a little lower ... say 10hz lower ... to see whether the clarity improves. I would also try the 2000's full range with ports plugged and the sub's LPF set lower than you tried previously.

With setup truly optimised, a good sub should add weight and enhance dimensionality of the soundstage, without reducing clarity. The improved bass performance will tend to reduce your subconscious desire to crank up the volume in an attempt to 'feel' the performance (no, I'm not talking about bass-head levels). This in turn will reduce the strain on your main speakers, even without using an HPF.

Unfortunately, I can't yet comment on the ACI HPF's. I bought a pair of the 65hz and 85hz HPF's a little while ago from Mike, but haven't used them yet as I'm currently building some new speakers that I'll try them on ...hopefully in approx 3 or 4 weeks from now.

Good luck with it!

PS. Pls forgive me if I'm teaching Grandma to suck eggs here. I don't know your experience/expertise so I'm just trying to help.

Mike Dzurko · « **Reply #18 on:** 6 Sep 2006, 05:50 pm »

Black LFMs are now sold out . . .
Black oak is also sold out

Limited quantities of silver remain and I believe we have oak and maple for wood yet available.

rave959 · « **Reply #19 on:** 6 Sep 2006, 10:12 pm »

Quote

Hi Ian,
If I understand what you have tried so far, your favourites are:
1) 2000's (ports unplugged & no HPF), no sub. ... best clarity.
2) 2000's (ports unplugged & no HPF), sub LPF @ 50Hz. ... reduced clarity.
3) 2000's (ports plugged, 85Hz HPF), sub LPF @ 80-85Hz. ... reduced clarity.

I found it quite time consuming and frustrating to get an optimal sub/mains integration by ear. Trying all the different combinations of LPF, gain and phase on the sub (as well as sub location) is very tedious. I ended up buying the ETF5 software and used my RS meter (with calibration file) to get a flat response. It still takes a little work but you are less likely to start second guessing yourself and results are easily repeatable.

How do you know what LPF frequency you have the sub set at without measurement? Are they marked on the sub's xo dial or are you using tones and an RS meter, or just going by ear? Markings may not exactly match the response in your room, going by ear is unlikely to be accurate enough, an RS meter and tones is better than nothing but not as highly resolving as say ETF5.

Without the benefit of ETF5, I would suggest repeating setups 2 & 3 above, with the sub's LPF set a little lower ... say 10Hz lower ... to see whether the clarity improves. I would also try the 2000's full range with ports plugged and the sub's LPF set lower than you tried previously.

With setup truly optimised, a good sub should add weight and enhance dimensionality of the soundstage, without reducing clarity. The improved bass performance will tend to reduce your subconscious desire to crank up the volume in an attempt to 'feel' the performance (no, I'm not talking about bass-head levels). This in turn will reduce the strain on your main speakers, even without using an HPF.

Unfortunately, I can't yet comment on the ACI HPF's. I bought a pair of the 65Hz and 85Hz HPF's a little while ago from Mike, but haven't used them yet as I'm currently building some new speakers that I'll try them on ...hopefully in approx 3 or 4 weeks from now.

Good luck with it!

PS. Pls forgive me if I'm teaching Grandma to suck eggs here. I don't know your experience/expertise so I'm just trying to help. Very Happy

Hello DSK,

Thank you for trying to help. I appreciate it. Sorry I did not respond any sooner due to the long weekend and work. Anyway, just a quick correction:

2) 2000's (ports unplugged & HPF @85Hz), sub LPF @ 65-75hz. ... reduced clarity.

The sub has the freq. meters marked on them. I also forgot to mention that I did try running the 2000's full range with the ports plugged and the sub's freq. at 50Hz (which is the lowest, I believe). This sounded best as far as having the sub connected, but this does not protect the 2000's since it's still running in full range and without the filter. I don't have the ET5, either. But heck, it's alright. I can live with it. I just thought I'd ask for a quick solution if it was possible. Once again, thank you.

Ian