RMAF system

Wayne1 · « **Reply #20 on:** 12 Oct 2006, 03:21 am »

The switch box is currently hooked up to the Cable Cooker.

I am letting each input have current flow through it for a few days.

I will hook it up the the amp tomorrow for a quick test run.

Wayne1 · « **Reply #21 on:** 12 Oct 2006, 03:33 pm »

Bill,

Hooked up the switch with the modified Transporter and a modded SB2. The Switch works great. No noise or hum.

At this point the Modded Transporter is slightly tilted up with an emphasis on the highs and a little light from the mid bass down.

Mids are VERY close. The BlackGates and Sonicap Platinums do need more time in the Transporter.

Overall, they both work very well with the Bella EXtreme 3205

Bill Baker · « **Reply #22 on:** 12 Oct 2006, 03:41 pm »

Thanks for the update Wayne. I would say the Platinums in the amp could definitely use more hours on them as well. We both know how long those Teflons take to open up.

bprice2 · « **Reply #23 on:** 12 Oct 2006, 04:09 pm »

Hi Wayne,

One of Dr. Lloyd's LR 1's was left on my front porch yesterday and is currently in my system. After looking at the picture of your custom job, I am curious - what are the two outputs doing with no switch to toggle between them?
May I assume that both outs are hot? Is this for bi-amping?

Assuming the answer to the previous questions is yes, then would it be possible to direct the signal of a Bolder modified SB3, or any other source into your custom LR 1 and then out to two separate active amplifiers? I ask because I'm trying to resolve the issue of how best to power some outdoor speakers while simultaneously powering my main speakers inside. The easy answer would be to apply a speaker selector, but I am reluctant to do that. I guess I could buy another SB, but I don't want to do that either.

Sorry if my questions are inane.

Thanks again, Wayne.

Brett

mgalusha · « **Reply #24 on:** 12 Oct 2006, 04:10 pm »

If you need some help putting more hours on the amp before the show Wayne let me know.

Wayne1 · « **Reply #25 on:** 12 Oct 2006, 04:57 pm »

Brett,

The two outputs ARE constantly hot. This is so each input can feed an amp and a powered subwoofer. It can also be used for passive bi-amping or to feed two separate amps for two systems. As long as the input impedance of both amps combined is not near 5K ohm, even the modded SB2 or 3 will not have trouble driving it.

Mike,

If you want to come over tonight, you can borrow the Bella EXtreme 3205 over the weekend. I am sure Bill would like a report of how it does on the Meadowlark Blue Heron 2s.

I was going to bring the Bella EXtreme over to Tyson's on Tuesday, but his 6 month pregnant wife just got back from visiting her parents in Germany, about an hour before I arrived. The listening session was VERY short.

The Super Max RM-30s and powered sub should show up on Monday. Mr. Cheney has pretty much pre-tuned the passives. It will be fun to hook up the Bella EXtreme to those.

Bill Baker · « **Reply #26 on:** 12 Oct 2006, 05:08 pm »

Quote

Mike,

If you want to come over tonight, you can borrow the Bella EXtreme 3205 over the weekend. I am sure Bill would like a report of how it does on the Meadowlark Blue Heron 2s.

Absolutely. I would love to see how this amp would match up with such a highly regarded speakers as the Meadowlark's Herons 2. The amp should have no problem driving them. They have a fairly easy 4 ohm load and high sensitivity that the Bella would [should] handle with ease.

Mike, what are you currently driving them with? What preamp would you be using? I enjoy feedback on how our amps work in conjunction with other components.

mgalusha · « **Reply #27 on:** 12 Oct 2006, 05:18 pm »

Quote from: Response Audio on 12 Oct 2006, 05:08 pm

Mike, what are you currently driving them with? What preamp would you be using? I enjoy feedback on how our amps work in conjunction with other components.

Bill,

Most of the time I don't have a preamp in the system, just the modded SB2 driving my amps. When I spin up the TT (Teres with solid cocobolo platter, Scheu/Benz cartridge) I use a Hagerman Cornet and a DIY preamp that I built. Per my agreement with the designer I'm not allowed to publicly disclose who designed the circuit but it uses a single 6SN7 for gain with a pair of 6AH4's for cathode followers. When I built the pre I used what I thought were the best available parts for the various parts of the circuit. It has Mills and Audio Note resistors, Cerafine caps on the power supply and Jensen copper foil in oil for the coupling caps bypassed with Sonicap Platinums. I used a TKD attenuator and a Greyhill selector switch. I currently have a 1943 vintage 5Y3GT rectifier and a 1953 (I think) Sylvania 6SN7 and a I can't remember which 6AH4's I have on the outputs.

Wayne,

I'll give you a call. I was bummed I couldn't make it to Tyson's the other night, I ended up working until 8:00PM

, but it sounds like I didn't miss much.

Mike

mgalusha · « **Reply #28 on:** 13 Oct 2006, 03:47 am »

I was able to pick up the amp from Wayne this afternoon and had a little time to listen to it this evening before dinner and it was sounding very nice. I don't even think it had time to fully warm up but I have all weekend for that.

Sorry Bill, I didn't say what amps I'm using with the BH2's. I have a pair of Dan Banquer's RE Designs LNPA-150's (info here). These are 75W@8R, 150W@4R SS amps that I'm very fond of. In my short time with the Bella so far they sound more alike than different. I'm not really surprised as the LNPA's don't have the sterile sound of many SS amps.

Thanks Bill & Wayne for the opportunity to enjoy this amp in my system for a few days. Much appreciated!

Mike

Bill Baker · « **Reply #29 on:** 13 Oct 2006, 12:53 pm »

No problem on my end Mike and I'm sure Wayne appreciates the hours on the amp as well. It will be interesting to see how the less expensive Bella compares with more expensive pieces and how well it drives the Blue Herons.
The LNPA's look very intriguing as does the rest of your 2-channel and HT system. Do keep us updated.

Wayne1 · « **Reply #30 on:** 16 Oct 2006, 05:37 pm »

The RM-30s arrived while I was away this past weekend.

I guess I will be spending most of my day getting them off the pallet, unboxed and set-up for some quick listening. If I get the chance, I will post a picture or two.

I think Brian sent me a surprise as to the finish of the cabinets.

I also just received a call that many boxes of room treatment will be delivered today. The racks from Adona are already here.

Now I just need a small semi to get all this gear over to the hotel

Wayne1 · « **Reply #31 on:** 16 Oct 2006, 09:23 pm »

I have uncrated and set-up the demo speakers for this weekend fest. I think all who come by will be very impressed withthe sound AND the finish of the speakers.

Brian sent out a pair of PIANO EBONY RM-30M SUPERMAX OXO.

The fit and finish is spectacular. It is really hard to get a good picture because of the highly reflective finish. I will try again later.

They have all BOLDER Cable wiring, TRT caps, external crossover and matching Piano Ebony wave guides.

My first impression is one of smoothness. Great vertical dispersion. I have them hooked up to my modded SA-XR70 in the HT system. They sound VERY GOOD. I will have to get the tube amp back from Mike, now.

John Casler · « **Reply #32 on:** 16 Oct 2006, 09:30 pm »

Hi Wayne,

Good to hear your initial impressions, and am looking forward to what you think of the OXO.

Wish I could make it to the Show.

Brian Cheney · « **Reply #33 on:** 16 Oct 2006, 10:27 pm »

Be sure to remove the tape over the tweeter. The tape is necessary to prevent air movement from stretching the diaphragm.

You'll like them even more with the powered LSW hooked up. In my soundroom I placed the woofer in the center between the speakers, about 2ft behind them.

Wayne1 · « **Reply #34 on:** 16 Oct 2006, 10:45 pm »

The tape was removed as soon as the speakers were in place.

I am using the SuperMAX RM-30s with my old Larger Sub powered by a few thousand watts of QSC amplifier.

I took a little time to just sit down and listen. JimR's (Ribbonspeakers) comment about the speakers disappearing is very true.

It is very hard to place where the speakers are located. The image is suspended on it's own. There is no left, right or center image. All the instruments and voices are completely independent of the speakers.

I thought the tweeter was a little hot. I then realised I still had an old power supply for the SqueezeBox in the system. I replaced it with my prototype Ultimate PS. Oh My! The balance between the tweeter and mid panels is excellent.

This IS the best image and depth playback I have EVER heard. I believe the folks coming into Room 1009 will be in for a rare treat.

Brian Cheney · « **Reply #35 on:** 16 Oct 2006, 11:18 pm »

The level controls (variable Lpads) on the OXO--that's newspeak for Outboard Crossover--are easily disturbed due to the large pointer knobs. Start with the mid around 12 o'clock and the treble around 12:30.

What you are hearing (imaging) is a byproduct of Constant Directivity with Frequency full-range. On axis and off axis response are the same and very linear, so reflected off axis energy has the same good spectral balance as the first arrivals. This is much more like how live instruments disperse their sound and makes their reproduction much more realistic.

James Romeyn · « **Reply #36 on:** 17 Oct 2006, 12:33 am »

Music, Physics, & Engineering by Dr. Harry F. Olson, "Directional Characteristics of Musical Instruments", pg 232, displays the polar response pattern of the violin in the plane normal to the strings.

Just analyzing the output of a note w/ a fundamental frequency of 1k Hz is telling. dB figures are estimated by viewing a polar graph w/ magnifying glass:

0 degrees, on axis: -5 dB
L 45 degrees: -7 dB
L 90 degrees: -11 dB
R 45 degrees: 0
R 90 degrees: -10

Interesting that the L-45 degree output is 7 dB below the R-45 degree output

The above unique & irregular polar response mixes w/ the irregular & uneven response of a typical speaker. The irregular polar response of the speaker tends to distort the original sound by imprinting the speaker's own unique & permanent mask off-axis.

Sure, the room adds its own problems. But it appears, the more linear is the speaker in its polar response, the more linear will be the boundary reflections, & the more likely will be the reproduced sound to the original instrument being played in the room.

My 2c.

Bill Baker · « **Reply #37 on:** 17 Oct 2006, 01:40 am »

Any word from Mike on how the amp worked with the BH's? Wayne, let em know when yo get the amp back and get a chance to drive the speakers with it. I know we're running low on time now but hopefully you will get the chance to at least spend a few hours with the setup.

mgalusha · « **Reply #38 on:** 17 Oct 2006, 03:37 am »

Bill,

The amp drives the BH-2's with ease, as I suspected given their sensitivity and my small space. I listened to it pretty much all day Saturday and Sunday and have thoroughly enjoyed my time with the amp. It gives up some dynamics and is a bit less controlled in the bass than the LNPA's but vocals and stringed instruments are oh so sweet and the highs are very clear and extended, not rolled off and syrupy as some tube amps are. Truly an excellent amp and a bargain at your asking price.

A friend gave me three of his direct to disk LP's on Saturday night and we fired up the vinyl rig as he hadn't heard these in over 20 years. I have to say that with vinyl the Bella EXtreme really came on song as the British say. We were having a small party and while the system had been playing all evening with the Squeezebox no one paid it the least attention. Spinning up "Sonic Fireworks" volume 1 brought people into the listening room. Until they entered the room they did not know it was a record but apparently the purity of an all vacuum tube, analog sound awoke their inner muse. One thing I found very interesting was that it drew just about every child that was in the house, they ranged in age from 2 to 13 and all of a sudden there were 6 or 7 children in the room listening to classical music. The Bella had no trouble with the dynamic range of the DTD records and believe me, there are some very dynamic passages on this disk and also some very low pipe organ notes.

I talked to Wayne today and it sounds like he's got his hands full but if he can sneak in the time before the show I'll get the amp to him. I was hoping to compare it to a friends Mac 275, which I have in for repair but I won't have the last of the parts until tomorrow. If the Bella is still here tomorrow night, I'll see how it compares to the Mac. From what I remember about the Mac it will do very well and is about 1/3 the price, very nice.

Thanks again for the opportunity to audition this in my home. I'm sure the folks who hear it at the show will find as lovely as I did.

Mike

Bill Baker · « **Reply #39 on:** 17 Oct 2006, 02:15 pm »

Hello Mike,
Thank you for taking the time to post your impressions as well as your kind words. Your findings seem to be on par with everyone else who has or has heard this particular design. For those who do want the more romantic, full bodied presentation would normally go with Jensen or AN oil capacitors. Even AuriCaps such as in the Signature version. The amps can also run EL34/KT77 output tubes which would also provide a bit more of that nostalgic sound.
I have not heard a Mac 275 in many years and could not even start to go on sonic memory so your impressions would be appreciated. I do not expect it to compete with such a classic design but at less than 1/3 the cost, maybe it would be an intersting comparison.
Keep us posted on your schedule with Wayne on things. Thanks again and happy listening.