Ouch! 4B-SST drew the first blood....

95bcwh · « **on:** 10 Jun 2006, 04:52 am »

All,
I just bought a 4B-SST, today I unpacked it and connected the power cord to a receptacle, I switch the breaker at the back to "ON" possition, then I lightly press the "ON/OFF" switch on the front panel, then all of a sudden, my electricity circuit tripped!!!

I went to check my circuit breaker, and it says "15 amp" is the limit. Hence my question to all knowledgeable Bryston owners is:

How much current is this 4B-SST drawing when it's turned on?

Thanks.
barry

alpsy · « **Reply #1 on:** 10 Jun 2006, 07:23 am »

really depends what else you have on the circuit.

we run a 4b and a 6b off a dedicated 20amp circuit with the rest of our audio gear off another dedicated 20amp circuit. works a treat

on its own, a 4b should be fine on either a 10amp or 15amp circuit.

julie

95bcwh · « **Reply #2 on:** 10 Jun 2006, 01:29 pm »

But I have nothing else on the circuit when I turned on the Bryston..something is fishy..

Dedicated circuit may not be possible for me because i'm on a rented apartment. I can't let the electrician tear down the walls to fish the wire all the way from the breaker to my listening room..

The only thing I can do is probably changing out the breaker to something larger than 15 amp...

If that still doesn't work..I have to find another amp that's not as "current-hungry" as 4B-SST. Now I know why people call this unit a "beast"..

Jason Nugent · « **Reply #3 on:** 10 Jun 2006, 01:43 pm »

I run my 4B SST on a dedicated 15 amp circuit, without problems, and I can turn it on and off without it tripping a breaker. When I'm using it, I can push my AB2S monitors pretty hard and it still won't trip the breaker. If memory serves, the 4B even has a soft start feature to slowly ramp up the current draw to prevent circuits from tripping.

You're sure there's nothing else on the circuit? How old is the breaker in your panel? Maybe it's time to replace it - I think they wear out over time.

95bcwh · « **Reply #4 on:** 10 Jun 2006, 03:08 pm »

Quote from: Jason Nugent

I run my 4B SST on a dedicated 15 amp circuit, without problems, and I can turn it on and off without it tripping a breaker. When I'm using it, I can push my AB2S monitors pretty hard and it still won't trip the breaker. If memory serves, the 4B even has a soft start feature to slowly ramp up the current draw to prevent circuits from tripping.

You're sure there's nothing else on the circuit? How old is the breaker in your panel? Maybe it's time to replace it - I think they wear out over time.

Jason, thanks, it's good to know that you get that work on a 15amp circuit. I just called up an electrician, he told me he can installed a dedicated circuit for only $185!! Which seems to me a small price to pay.. now I have to talk to my landlord to see if they would agree to it..

govcon · « **Reply #5 on:** 10 Jun 2006, 04:58 pm »

I've run a 6B-ST on a 15 amp circuit with other devices on it without any problems. Turning the unit on has presented zero problems. I now have the system in my dedicated sound room on a dedicated 20 A circuit by itself being fed by a Equi=tech 1.5BQ.

Anyways, I advise against adding a dedicated circuit as the fix for this problem. I think there is something wrong with the amp to cause a power draw big enough to trip a 15 amp breaker; especially if there are no other loads on the same circuit. My opinion is to get the amp checked out first.

95bcwh · « **Reply #6 on:** 10 Jun 2006, 09:44 pm »

Quote from: tvad4

You're going to call Bryston and discuss your problem with them before you do anything, right?

Of course you are.

This unit is bought brand new, I still have the sheet which it said the last check was done in January 2006!! It's hard to imagine Bryston can be so careless. I suspect it's the problem with the breaker.

But you are correct, I should give Bryston a call to see what they say about this.

I have found a solution to my problem though, I have a washroom located very close to my listening room and it has receptacles on a 20Amp circuit, I just plugged my 4B-SST on it, switched it on, no problem whatsoever! So I think I'm just going to buy a long extension receptacle and use this circuit for my amp only.

jethro · « **Reply #7 on:** 11 Jun 2006, 01:36 am »

I run an 8B-ST and a 4B-ST off the same dedicated 15 amp circuit so it's surprising that you are tripping the breaker. I would take it back to the dealer to check it out. If you are surging over 15 amps then I would be very careful about using an extension cord from your bathroom.

95bcwh · « **Reply #8 on:** 11 Jun 2006, 04:30 am »

Quote from: jethro

I run an 8B-ST and a 4B-ST off the same dedicated 15 amp circuit so it's surprising that you are tripping the breaker. I would take it back to the dealer to check it out. If you are surging over 15 amps then I would be very careful about using an extension cord from your bathroom.

Jethro, I shall heed your advice, tomorrow I will bring it the unit to test in my neighbour home which has exactly the same circuit wiring. If it still causes tripping on his 15amp breaker.. then I am in trouble.

Thanks to all who'd kindly responded..!!

95bcwh · « **Reply #9 on:** 11 Jun 2006, 04:40 pm »

Ok, I have tested it on another 15amp circuit, still causing a trip. But I'm still not convinced it's the problem with the amp. This thing is so heavy for me, I'm sufferrig from back pain lifting it. I am still reluctant to send it back to Bryston before doing another check.

Does anyone know if there exists a device that I can measure how much current is drawned by the amp? I'm thinking of something that can be connected between the source outlet and the amp, so I can measure how much current is flowing through..?

Thank for helping.

rosconey · « **Reply #10 on:** 11 Jun 2006, 05:13 pm »

hellooooooooo mcfly-
2 different outlets tripped-umm send it in for repair or try on a third-

just send it in-you might cause more than just a popped breaker

bubba966 · « **Reply #11 on:** 11 Jun 2006, 06:28 pm »

This should work over the power cord

http://us.fluke.com/usen/products/LH41.htm?catalog_name=FlukeUnitedStates&Category=CLMP(FlukeProducts)

But those things aren't cheap.

Are you absolutely sure that there's absolutely nothing being used on these circuits that you're tripping other than the Bryston?

How old is the wiring in the apartment? Breakers can trip easier than they should when they're old. One easy way to check is how easily the breaker is shut off. If there's some resistance to the breaker when you try to shut it off it's probably fine. But if you just barely touch the handle on the breaker and it flips off it could probably use replacing.

Are you plugging the amp into a GFCI or AFCI protected circuit? If it's GFCI protected the GFCI can be weak and trip the breaker. If it's an AFCI circuit the first AFCI's didn't work right And were recalled and should have been replaced. Also AFCI's trip incredibly easily So that might be your problem.

jethro · « **Reply #12 on:** 11 Jun 2006, 10:45 pm »

Quote from: bubba966

This should work over the power cord

http://us.fluke.com/usen/products/LH41.htm?catalog_name=FlukeUnitedStates&Category=CLMP(FlukeProducts)

But those things aren't cheap.

...

You will likely have to make a short "extension cord" with separate conductors to use this meter, otherwise you will register 0 current if you
clamp onto the power cord.

My fluke current meter cost about $200 CDN. Throw in the extension cord
and you have your shipping cost back to Bryston.

Can you try it at a friend's house ? All you would need is the amp.

bubba966 · « **Reply #13 on:** 11 Jun 2006, 10:54 pm »

Quote from: jethro

Quote from: bubba966
This should work over the power cord

http://us.fluke.com/usen/products/LH41.htm?catalog_name=FlukeUnitedStates&Category=CLMP(FlukeProducts)

But those things aren't cheap.

...

You will likely have to make a short "extension cord" with separate conductors to use this meter, otherwise you will register 0 current if you
clamp onto the power cord.

My fluke current meter cost about $200 CDN. Throw in the extension cord
and you have your shipping cost back to Bryston.

Can you try it at a friend's house ? All you would need is the amp.

Why do you figure you need to make some sort of "extension cord" to use that model Fluke?

You clamp the meter around the amp's power cable and turn the amp on. The Fluke will read the current draw through the power cable as the amp is being turned on. That is it will read it if it's fast enough to read anything before the breaker trips. I don't have that particular model, nor have I had a chance to play with one.

jethro · « **Reply #14 on:** 11 Jun 2006, 11:04 pm »

I can't seem to download the manual for that particular meter, but any clamp on current meter that I've used has to be clamped onto an individual conductor. The "extension cord" that you make up has separate conductors so you can clamp onto only one conductor (hot).

The current meter measures the magnetic field created by the current in the conductor. If you clamp onto the Bryston power cord, then the magnetic fields from the hot and neutral will cancel out and 0 amps will register.

My terminology may not be 100%, but that's the basic idea.

beemer · « **Reply #15 on:** 11 Jun 2006, 11:08 pm »

No doubt about it, there's something wrong with the amp.
Regardless of yhow your back feels, you're going to have to ship it for service, or take it back to the dealer and let it become their problem.

Best,

Paul

95bcwh · « **Reply #16 on:** 12 Jun 2006, 01:20 am »

Quote from: jethro

...

Can you try it at a friend's house ? All you would need is the amp.[/quote]

Jet et al,
I have tried on two different circuits rated at 15amp.. my friend's home is exactly the same apartment as mine, so I don't think it will make any difference, I can probably try it at another friend's home which is a house and not an apartment

I still don't believe this can happen, I'm tempted to just run the unit off a 20amp circuit, but I will call Bryston tomorrow to seek their opinion.

Thank you all.
barry

jethro · « **Reply #17 on:** 12 Jun 2006, 03:03 pm »

Since I am stuck at home on my day off waiting for UPS I decided to play with my current meter.

My 8B-ST PRO draws 11.6 amps for a very brief moment at startup, draws 0.60 amps at idle, and draws 0.2 amps in standby mode.

My 4B-ST PRO draws 4.84 amps at startup, 0.60 at idle, 0.1 amps in standby.

The startup surge is very brief and hard to see on the meter. It took several tries, letting the amp bleed down between tries.

I don't have an SST amp, but I assume it would be similar to the 4B-ST. It looks like the 8B--ST doesn't have a soft startup.

DeadFish · « **Reply #18 on:** 12 Jun 2006, 03:44 pm »

Quote from: 95bcwh

Quote from: jethro

.
Jet et al,
I have tried on two different circuits rated at 15amp.. my friend's home is exactly the same apartment as mine, so I don't think it will make any difference, I can probably try it at another friend's home which is a house and not an apartment

I still don't believe this can happen, I'm tempted to just run the unit off a 20amp circuit, but I will call Bryston tomorrow to seek their opinion.

Thank you all.
barry

Been reading your thread (in sympathy) and am certainly curious to the outcome, if it is other than the amp needs more than 15 amps to crank up.
Was thinking, when speaking about a friend's 'same apartment' as yours... if built at the same time, the breakers might be essentially the same age. Breakers DO wear, and your neighbors might be just as worn. As an active device (like a GFCI outlet), parts wear, tolerances change..
It might be tripping at somewhere between 10-15amps and you wouldn't generally know it...
If you find out that the amp should run on a 15 amp circuit, you might try a new breaker in its place, and by all means ONLY with another 15 amp breaker. ( Hope I don't need to tell you not to put a 20 amp in its place.)

Good luck,
DeadFish

James Tanner · « **Reply #19 on:** 12 Jun 2006, 04:18 pm »

Toriod power supplies will have huge in-rush current for a short time (less than a second) The 4B has a Soft-Start circuit to limit in-rush current to under 15 amps.

When running maximum current draw of a 4B SST at 8 ohms at full power is 8 amps. At 4 ohms 16 amps.

james