New bad to the bone open baffle design, availability!

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Danny Richie

Sorry for the delay guys. My recent shipment of M-130's has taken longer than normal to get here and it has delayed me releasing this.

Just to recap: This is in regards to the open baffle design mentioned here in our forum in this thread: http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=21620

The development of these as a commercial loudspeaker line is discussed here:  http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=21999

Here is a pic from the RMAF of one of the speakers:



I will allow you guys here at AC to build a pair of these and I will provide the kit including all parts, drivers, plans, etc, minus a plate amp to power the lower subs, and make these available for about a month. I'll say through the month of January.

After that, they will not be made available. Later next year they can only be purchased fully assembled and through dealers.

I was also toying with the idea of letting the kits go for $1,200. I changed my mind. I am going to make the deal even sweeter and let them go for $995.

Availability starts Monday the 26th of Dec. At least that is when I will begin to ship them out. They can be ordered now.

A couple of smaller models based on this design will be made available for a short time as well. I am still working on those.

klh

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New bad to the bone open baffle design, availability!
« Reply #1 on: 21 Dec 2005, 09:01 pm »
Great NEWS! Do you have prices for the WWMTM and WMTMW (center)? And if someone wants to do a WWMTMWW (sans subwoofer), would the price of the original be reduced? These things are going to sell like hotcakes!

mgalusha

New bad to the bone open baffle design, availability!
« Reply #2 on: 21 Dec 2005, 09:02 pm »
That is a sweet deal Danny. I thought these sounded very nice at RMAF. Now if I could just sell the idea of yet another set of speakers to my wife... Yeah, right.

Out of curiousity, what do you think they will be retailing for once they are retail only?

mike

Danny Richie

New bad to the bone open baffle design, availability!
« Reply #3 on: 21 Dec 2005, 09:31 pm »
Quote
Great NEWS! Do you have prices for the WWMTM and WMTMW (center)?


I am going to shoot for releasing those in the $600. a pair range, or $300. for a single WMTMW kit.

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And if someone wants to do a WWMTMWW (sans subwoofer), would the price of the original be reduced?


Yep, no sided loaded 12's, $200. off.

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Out of curiousity, what do you think they will be retailing for once they are retail only?


I really can't say yet for sure.

gprro

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New bad to the bone open baffle design, availability!
« Reply #4 on: 21 Dec 2005, 09:47 pm »
Whats would the average shipping cost for be for the big ones minus subs? I'm in 27613, but an approx. cost is good enough.

Nick V

New bad to the bone open baffle design, availability!
« Reply #5 on: 21 Dec 2005, 09:50 pm »
Does anybody have any experience having speakers built by a cabinetmaker or professional woodworker? I don't have the tools or experience to build the enclosures and am just wondering what kind of ballpark I'd be looking at to have these built?

Guessing somewhere in the $700-1000 range including all materials and veneer?

klh

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New bad to the bone open baffle design, availability!
« Reply #6 on: 21 Dec 2005, 10:26 pm »
Sweat deals!!!!!! Two more questions... would someone who buys these kits now be able drop in the XBL drivers when they become available? If so, how would you structure the deal?

mnapuran

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New bad to the bone open baffle design, availability!
« Reply #7 on: 22 Dec 2005, 02:23 am »
Few questions...

1) Will the smaller (non sub) version be available for a limited time through you directly as well?  If so, when?

2) How do you compare this design to the LS-6/LS-9?  Any timing on those models?

Thanks!

danm

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New bad to the bone open baffle design, availability!
« Reply #8 on: 22 Dec 2005, 03:45 am »
Excellent news, hopefully I can make it happen.

tjt123

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New bad to the bone open baffle design, availability!
« Reply #9 on: 22 Dec 2005, 04:45 am »
Is the center that was mentioned a "standard" horizontal center channel than can be put on the floor (under my projection screen)?  

Does the center also have the open sides (open top/bottom if it's horizontal)?  If so, how much space is needed above / below to allow it to “breathe”?  Same question for the mains...how far away from the side wall do they need to be placed for optimal performance.

Would a couple of the A/V-1RS go well as a surround channels with these for the mains?

        -TIM

eric the red

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New bad to the bone open baffle design, availability!
« Reply #10 on: 22 Dec 2005, 10:41 am »
Quote from: Nick V
Does anybody have any experience having speakers built by a cabinetmaker or professional woodworker? I don't have the tools or experience to build the enclosures and am just wondering what kind of ballpark I'd be looking at to have these built?

Guessing somewhere in the $700-1000 range including all materials and veneer?


My uncle is a professional cabinet builder-wood shop owner and his son (my cousin) is a fellow audio geek, both located in Minneapolis. They built (over built) me a pair of GR Research Paradox 3s and, depending on veneer, probably would be in your price range of $700-$1000 for cabinets. Marbles also knows a good cabinet builder in his neck of the woods. PM me if this sounds interesting to you and I'll give my uncle a call. :mrgreen:

ctviggen

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New bad to the bone open baffle design, availability!
« Reply #11 on: 22 Dec 2005, 10:50 am »
Does this deal include the BH5 (or other damping materials)?  (I assume not, as BH5 alone could cost 100-200 per speaker.)

RAW

New bad to the bone open baffle design, availability!
« Reply #12 on: 22 Dec 2005, 07:59 pm »
Great deal Danny for sure.
To those who have asked for quote for cabinets.All depends on veneer.
As well do not be fooled the nice black side panels this area is open!
This requires a few things.
-Thought put into making this area more ridged as the front and back are only 3/4" thick and if while shipping these get a good bang from UPS(not that they ever do any damage to speaker cabinets :nono:  :nono: ) the cabinets will spilt in 2 pieces.
-Making the grills for both sides 4 grills per pair
-the sub box shape on the bottom can change for your own look this is not set in stone.Just the internal volume.

Really if you can get a deal on them for $500.00 each I would say jump on it.Just be carefull of the mid area construction as I said if not done with thought of the shipping I see these arriving split in to to people.
And that is not a good thing to have happen.

Believe me after boxing RA8 in custom double wall boxs lined with 1.5" of solid white foam then the cabinets wrapped in a poly foam UPS managed to destroy a few of them.And that was with $200.00 in packing materials.


Now to crates 2-3 hrs to build the pair complete ready to ship.
1/4" plywood with a 2" X 2" frame screws used.
Lined with solid foam
-cabinets wrapped in a poly
-shrink wrap
-cut the foam
-wrap the cabinets

The average cost for a pair of crates as they are made one at a time not a stock shipping card board box.
$375.00 for the pair larger crates and cabinets extra.

And shipping is not even in the picture yet.

The kits are a great price I just want those who are asking for prices to know a little of what goes into just shipping them let alone build cabinets.



Here is a close up of the mid area.
The person who built these should give up his day job 8) Well done!


These show the cates that we built for the GR sub array!

gprro

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New bad to the bone open baffle design, availability!
« Reply #13 on: 22 Dec 2005, 09:47 pm »
To RAW,

What do you think just the mtm section of a baffle would cost, raw mdf. The only part that worries me is countersinking the tweeter and centering all the holes. It could be just a 20 x 9 (or whatever the correct width is piece of mdf, so not to expensive to ship. It would require using double front baffle, but I'd do that anyway. I might even paint the center section, and wrap the top and bottom in veneer to make it easier.

Carl V

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New bad to the bone open baffle design, availability!
« Reply #14 on: 23 Dec 2005, 03:51 am »
Why not build this in sections.(3)  
Dali has done this as has other mfg's with their large array speakers.  Top section holds the two Mid-woffers, center section is your open baffle section and the bottom is the midwoofer & sub secton.  Sorta like three AV-2s per side.

This will ensure structural rigidity, # drivers flexibilty.....as in full size or 2/3 size.

Just a thought......

jphaggar

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Danny's new open baffle
« Reply #15 on: 23 Dec 2005, 11:15 am »
Hi Danny
I've been waiting for your new line array LS 9, but I can see that things are getting delayed . But meanwhile I discovered your new open baffle design with a subwoofer included at the bottom , and it seems to me very interresting , and I understand that this design is only available for a limited period as a kit , I would like to order a pair in kit form , What should I do ? how much does it cost and what is the price of freight to Montreal .
Thanks Danny

goskers

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New bad to the bone open baffle design, availability!
« Reply #16 on: 23 Dec 2005, 11:55 am »
JP,

Please refer to page one for the cost of 995$US for the kit.  Shipping you can estimate using Texas as origin and Montreal as destination.  I would think 100lbs or so would be a safe guesstimate for weight.

Brucemck

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New bad to the bone open baffle design, availability!
« Reply #17 on: 23 Dec 2005, 05:05 pm »
Danny,

Loved the sound of these new units at RMAF.  They're pretty special.

Is the horizontal center a very close sonic match to the vertical units?

I've currently got a horizontal center and vertical towers across the front of a home theater, with same drivers and crossovers (Tyler Acoustic Linbrook SuperTowers), but still find it "distracting" when music pans and I hear the different "spectrum" across the units.  (Suspect part of it is a height issue, as the center line of the Center, at 32" off the floor,  is about a foot lower than the center line of the towers.)

Alternative is to get three identical fronts and give up on the "big" sound I so like from towers and line arrays.

Danny Richie

New bad to the bone open baffle design, availability!
« Reply #18 on: 23 Dec 2005, 05:57 pm »
Quote
Whats would the average shipping cost for be for the big ones minus subs? I'm in 27613, but an approx. cost is good enough.


Guessing on the weight, but I think I am close. Looks like about $32.00

Quote
Two more questions... would someone who buys these kits now be able drop in the XBL drivers when they become available? If so, how would you structure the deal?


I am still not sure if the new XBL drivers will be drop in replacements. It's my hope but may not be likely. This design keeps any of the drivers from being worked very hard at all. So in this application I think the XBL motor will not yield the advantages of other designs. As is these things are too good to mess with.

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1) Will the smaller (non sub) version be available for a limited time through you directly as well? If so, when?


It will also be made available for a limited time. I can't say yet when.

Quote
2) How do you compare this design to the LS-6/LS-9? Any timing on those models?


That's a tough one to call at this point. I have finished the open baffle design. I have not completed the LS series models or listened to them yet.

Quote
Is the center that was mentioned a "standard" horizontal center channel than can be put on the floor (under my projection screen)?


The center will be primarily designed for system using projectors. It will be on its side and stand mounted.

Quote
Does the center also have the open sides (open top/bottom if it's horizontal)?


It will have an open top and bottom with a single woofer on each side.

Quote
If so, how much space is needed above / below to allow it to “breathe”?


The appropriate stand will allow for that. I am even thinking of aiming the port to fire down towards the floor so that distance from the rear wall will be less of an issue. The stand will allow the whole bottom end to be open and to breath nicely.

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Same question for the mains...how far away from the side wall do they need to be placed for optimal performance.


That will really depend on the room size.

Quote
Would a couple of the A/V-1RS go well as a surround channels with these for the mains?


Yes they would. In fact, a A/V-1RS type design using the Neo 3 pdr tweeter is in the works for the commercial line.

Quote
Does this deal include the BH5 (or other damping materials)? (I assume not, as BH5 alone could cost 100-200 per speaker.)


It does not. What I'd recommend is No Rez at only $38. a sheet. 4 sheets might do it for you.

Regarding Al's views on shipping.... Finished enclosures are too heavy to be shipped via UPS and I'd be afraid to use them with these too. They will need to be well packed in a nice create to protect them and there is some cost involved in that.

Carl, These could be built as separate enclosures but I really don't see the need. The front and back baffles run the full length of the enclosure and if you look closely at some of the pics of the open baffle area you will see that there is an addition strip of MDF that runs the full length of the open baffle area. This gives it added strength.

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I would like to order a pair in kit form , What should I do ?


Call to order them. I can send the kit in two separate boxes using USPS. The shipping won't be that bad to Canada. Figure it to be one box of about 48lbs and one at 36lbs. That should get it close.

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Is the horizontal center a very close sonic match to the vertical units?


It will be exactly the same. The center section will be identical but it will have one less woofer on each end.

Quote
I've currently got a horizontal center and vertical towers across the front of a home theater, with same drivers and crossovers (Tyler Acoustic Linbrook SuperTowers), but still find it "distracting" when music pans and I hear the different "spectrum" across the units. (Suspect part of it is a height issue, as the center line of the Center, at 32" off the floor, is about a foot lower than the center line of the towers.)


It sounds like much of that can be the difference in height of the units. This will be a little less of an issue with open baffle speakers. They get away from the "this speaker is right here, and the other speaker is right there" type of sound.

Leaving out for Christmas now and can't really respond until Monday. Have a great holiday everyone.

wshuff

New bad to the bone open baffle design, availability!
« Reply #19 on: 23 Dec 2005, 06:08 pm »
Merry Christmas Danny.  I look forward to what the New Year has in store.