why so little interest in computer based audio?

RooX · « **on:** 7 Aug 2005, 02:41 pm »

With all the new ptions out there and the ability to have some real quality at relativly low costs, why are more audiophiles not talking about/looking into server based/streaming audio technologies to hook into their 2-channel/home theater rigs?
I currently am looking into a squeezebox2 as a transport option, it wouldnt be to hard for me to rip my collection, and i have a few dacs to play with, i cant imagine why a system such as this wouldnt turn a few heaeds with its quality. There is nothing that a datastream straight from the computer could possibly screw up compared to reading a cd on the fly.

anyone else have any thoughts on why this now not so relativly new technology isnt seeing the acceptance of more audio nuts?

zybar · « **Reply #1 on:** 7 Aug 2005, 02:51 pm »

Couple of reasons...

First, change is always difficult. You are asking people to go from something they have been using for the past 20 years to a new way. Believe it or not, many people still aren't that computer savy! Which leads into point number two...

Using computer based audio is more time consuming (ripping hundreds or thousands of cd's isn't exactly fun) and not as user friendly.

That being said, as more products such the SB2 come to market, this segment will take off and gain in popularity.

I know that I have been sitting on the fence for the past 6-12 months, but with the SB2 (and modifier market) I will be finally taking the plunge.

George

CSMR · « **Reply #2 on:** 7 Aug 2005, 02:55 pm »

There are difficulties in computer based audio: eliminating noise and ripping CDs the main ones.

maxwalrath · « **Reply #3 on:** 7 Aug 2005, 03:46 pm »

maxwalrath · « **Reply #4 on:** 7 Aug 2005, 03:47 pm »

dup posts....

maxwalrath · « **Reply #5 on:** 7 Aug 2005, 03:48 pm »

There are so many threads here about what steps to take to get a good PC based audio set-up. The problem is that they're all over the place. There's no step by step approach anywhere, and if you can find one, there's a ton of different opinions about what approach is best.

I'm not the most computer savvy, and I'm not up for digging through hours of threads when my current source sounds great. So for me, it's just a lack of easy access to the needed information slowing me down...

I imagined that ripping all my CD's would be a huge obsticle, but my collection is only about 300 or so. I can get them all ripped for about $350 with shipping. This is expensive, but I'm just not up for spending my time doing something so tedious.

....Roox, I'm also thinking about the sqeezebox as a source.

Marbles · « **Reply #6 on:** 7 Aug 2005, 04:04 pm »

Ripping my CD's is the least of my worries with a computer based system.

Heck, it only takes 3-4 minutes right now with EAC per disc.

I can do 15 per hour watching TV etc... No big deal, really.

I already have EAC (to rip) and Foobar (to play) and the computer is in the right room, but the last time I tried it using the sound card output, it was noisy.

I hope to get the USB based Empirical Audio off ramp to try soon and see how it goes.

maxwalrath · « **Reply #7 on:** 7 Aug 2005, 04:18 pm »

Hey Marbles, is that time including indexing the music with artist, album, track title, year etc.? Just wondering...for me that's an appealing part of having a vendor do it.

Marbles · « **Reply #8 on:** 7 Aug 2005, 04:31 pm »

Quote from: maxwalrath

Hey Marbles, is that time including indexing the music with artist, album, track title, year etc.? Just wondering...for me that's an appealing part of having a vendor do it.

Hell no!!! That's just the rip!

You might have a point on that appealing thing.....$1 a CD did you say???

zybar · « **Reply #9 on:** 7 Aug 2005, 04:45 pm »

If you check out http://www.slimdevices.com/pi_ripping.html they offer a ripping service:

Highlights

* The highest quality rips and MP3 encoding using LAME V3.96
* Quick turnarounds—orders processed in four days or less once CD's have been received
* Every track includes the latest ID3 tagging of Artist, Album, Song, Genre, and Year information so you can quickly find favorite tunes and build custom playlists quickly
* Default format set at 224kbps MP3 for superior sound compared to standard 128kbps (128-320kbps MP3, WMA, or AAC available at no extra charge)
* Digital libraries returned on a DVD for easy loading onto your computer
* Consistent and accurate tags through checks against multiple databases ensures consistent and accurate labeling—looks great on your Squeezebox!

Included In Your Order

* Digital Library—Labels on all songs, albums and artists in the Capitalized format including a printed index for each DVD.
* DVD containing your Digital Music Library
* Instructions to load your music onto your computer, computer's jukebox software, and your personal digital player.
* Music Library Report detailing information about your library including songs or CDs that were and were not ripped.

Pricing

$129 to convert up to 100 CDs into an MP3, WMA, Ogg Vorbis, or AAC library.

$179 to convert up to 150 CDs into an MP3, WMA, Ogg Vorbis, or AAC library.

$229 to convert up to 200 CDs into an MP3, WMA, Ogg Vorbis, or AAC library.

20% surcharge to convert to FLAC, or WMA Lossless formats.

30% surcharge for two sets of digital files (lossless and lossy files) archived on DVD.

Discounts available for quantities greater than 200 CDs. See order form for details.

George

kmcdonou4eq5 · « **Reply #10 on:** 7 Aug 2005, 04:46 pm »

People make computer audio so complicated and/or expensive. They advocate specially built machines that are uber silent. It's just not necessary. I have an IBM Thinkpad, an older one with 700 mhz and 192 MB of RAM, and a Squeezebox 2. The Thinkpad is pretty quiet, although a fan does come on every now and then, but it is pretty darn quiet. The external hard drive has a fan, but it is very quiet too. You don't need a totally silent system to enjoy music.

That said, the easiest way to get a pretty quiet system is to buy an Apple laptop. I think they are fanless. An external drive probably can be located without a fan, but I think it is unnecessary. The Squeezebox 2 is pretty easy to set up, but not totally mindless. You might have to read the instructions.

Overall, once you turn towards computer audio, you never will look back.

zybar · « **Reply #11 on:** 7 Aug 2005, 05:01 pm »

Just saw this as well for ripping:

http://www.audioholics.com/productreviews/avsoftware/cd_other/ReadytoPlayCDripping.php

George

ScottMayo · « **Reply #12 on:** 7 Aug 2005, 07:14 pm »

Quote from: kmcdonou4eq5

You don't need a totally silent system to enjoy music....Overall, once you turn towards computer audio, you never will look back.

A good sound card can sound as good as a good CD player - it's the same technology, after all. But I can count on one finger the times that I heard a computer system play with the clarity of an audiophile rig. Most sound cards are junk.

As for not needing a totally silent system to enjoy music, heck, you can enjoy some kinds of music with a boom box on a crowded, noisy beach. But if you want to get into the music, if you want that immersive experience, then external noise is a distraction. Fan noise approximates white noise and that's one of the most annoying, fatiguing sounds there is. If you're listening to a brush on a cymbal on a good speaker with a low noise stereo in a quiet room, fan noise is just about the last thing you want.

I've messed around for years, with both computer music and audiophile rigs. I've priced out silent computers and decent sound cards. I've yet to add computer gear to my sound system - the technology is simply not there yet. It's convenient, but it's not the answer to all music everywhere.

zybar · « **Reply #13 on:** 7 Aug 2005, 07:19 pm »

Quote from: ScottMayo

A good sound card can sound as good as a good CD player - it's the same technology, after all. But I can count on one finger the times that I heard a computer system play with the clarity of an audiophile rig. Most sound cards are junk.

As for not needing a totally silent system to enjoy music, heck, you can enjoy some kinds of music with a boom box on a crowded, noisy beach. But if you want to get into the music, if you want that immersive experience, then external noise is a distraction. Fan noise app ...

Scott,

The technology is there when you use the pc as a transport and not as your cd player. From everything I have read, using programs such EAC and running off a hard drive will be superior to reading a cd in real time off a cd drive.

What has been lacking is any easy interface to use the pc as a transport.

The Squeezebox is a big step towards making it easy and user friendly.

By using the Squeezebox, you can have your "noisy" pc in another room and eliminate that issue alltogether while still having a more traditional display and remote.

George

John Ashman · « **Reply #14 on:** 7 Aug 2005, 07:39 pm »

FWIW, I'm 100% HD based (with backups in CD, CD-R and/or HDs), except for customer demonstrations. I have 6000+ songs in Apple Lossless on my Firewire drive attached to a wireless Mac Mini feeding a Sherbourn 2/75 amp and a pair of NHT iC4 inceilings for work and 1500+ songs in AAC on my iBook (wirelessly feeding an Airport Express) and duplicated on my iPod for the house.

And we just started selling Sonos instead of any kind of CD changer.

Maybe no one's talking about it because we don't want to take the steely barbs of the "serious" audiophile crowd?

lonewolfny42 · « **Reply #15 on:** 7 Aug 2005, 07:47 pm »

John,

Chris[/list:u]

JoshK · « **Reply #16 on:** 7 Aug 2005, 08:35 pm »

I think the easiest current solution for computer based audio is to put a file server (cheap is ok) in another room and use something like Airport, Squeezebox, OffRamp, etc to port the music into your room. This is what I am building myself.

In my case I bought a SB2 and am putting the file server in the basement. No worries about soundcard quality, fan noise, etc. Eventually I plan to rip my vinyl collection too for ease of playback.

Vinnie R. · « **Reply #17 on:** 7 Aug 2005, 08:58 pm »

Quote from: JoshK

I think the easiest current solution for computer based audio is to put a file server (cheap is ok) in another room and use something like Airport, Squeezebox, OffRamp, etc to port the music into your room. This is what I am building myself.

In my case I bought a SB2 and am putting the file server in the basement. No worries about soundcard quality, fan noise, etc. Eventually I plan to rip my vinyl collection too for ease of playback.

Hi Josh,

You got it! With the SB2, you can use the screen and locate any album, any artist, or any playlist you make, and just let it rip!

The SB2 is small, wireless, priced very reasonably, and fun to use.

IMO, they are already taking off and I'm sure there will be MANY new SB2 owners by the end of the year.

Have fun,

Papajin · « **Reply #18 on:** 7 Aug 2005, 09:21 pm »

I've got a RAID 5 on a remote server freshly built, and just waiting to be filled up. I'm still just trying to figure out the best way to proceed to get music from my PC to my pre-amp right now. Do I go with a sound card with decent DACs and analog out? Something like the USB Off-Ramp/Freeway or USB Select and an outboard DAC? Or do I go with something like the SB2?

It seems to me that the SB2 may be the best bet, as straight out of the box, it's not too much more expensive than a sound-card solution, and I'm going to guess sound-quality will likely be quite a bit better. My only question though, is how flexible will it be? Can you run other forms of PC audio through the SB2, or are you limited to specific audio files only?

I have a feeling I'm going to end up with a hybrid soundcard/SB2 solution, as I do intend to have a PC in my rack for video scaling and other duties, and it seems likely that that would give me the most flexibility without being outrageously expensive. With an SB2 in there for a majority of the music playback, I'm hoping to avoid the need for an outboard DAC which can get pretty expensive quick. It doesn't seem like I'd need a super high-end DAC while listening to a web-cast or other sound source, as the only other sources of music I can think of tend to be comprimised in sound quality somewhat to begin with.

Any thoughts?

Underdog · « **Reply #19 on:** 7 Aug 2005, 09:21 pm »

The convenience of a completetly searchable database that can hold hundreds of albums at a pretty cheap price to boot...

Match that up with the SB2 and amp/speakers that you already have (and meet your individual requirements) and you've got a package that cd jukeboxes just can't beat, IMHO

My current project: Fit a laptop screen into a 12x12 record frame and have it show the album art of whatever I'm listening too. Will look real nice with all my old vinyl up there too..