Announcing The Bryston BR-20 Preamp/DAC/Streamer

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Sasha

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Re: Announcing The Bryston BR-20 Preamp/DAC/Streamer
« Reply #40 on: 9 Oct 2020, 02:53 pm »
James,

Will there be an option for external PSU MPS-2 on BR-20, to take its performance even further?

Sasha 

rbbert

Re: Announcing The Bryston BR-20 Preamp/DAC/Streamer
« Reply #41 on: 9 Oct 2020, 03:03 pm »
Are the HDMI inputs pictured on the back usable without the HDMI card?

James Tanner

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Re: Announcing The Bryston BR-20 Preamp/DAC/Streamer
« Reply #42 on: 9 Oct 2020, 03:11 pm »
James,

Will there be an option for external PSU MPS-2 on BR-20, to take its performance even further?

Sasha

Hi Sasha

No plans on that front.

james

James Tanner

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Re: Announcing The Bryston BR-20 Preamp/DAC/Streamer
« Reply #43 on: 9 Oct 2020, 03:12 pm »
Are the HDMI inputs pictured on the back usable without the HDMI card?

Hi

No the HDMI card includes the connections.  There is a panel that replaces the HDMI if not ordered as an option.

james

NorthMac

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Re: Announcing The Bryston BR-20 Preamp/DAC/Streamer
« Reply #44 on: 9 Oct 2020, 08:18 pm »
Hi Zoom

How come you always put me on the spot!!! :lol:

I think the main difference between designing products these days vs days of yore is the ability to use surface mount components. In days passed circuit parts typically were what we call hole-through and parts utilized were large in size and took up a fair amount of geography. So placing lets say a phono stage in the same box as a discrete Class A preamplifier circuit used up a lot of real-estate and you had to be very careful about proximity of circuit paths to prevent electronic bleed-through, hum etc.

Today with surface mount technology you can place circuits and power supplies reasonably close together and still maintain excellent electronic separation. So the ability to design and build products that rival the performance of separates is a much easier task. So I think the BR-20 represents our first effort at providing our customers with a product that approaches the lofty goals of separates. It is also the first preamp we have designed that offers a fully balanced circuit path from input to output which does have some advantages performance wise.

So I guess my advice would be choose the product based on the feature set you feel meets todays and tomorrows needs.  For example, if you already have a great streamer or DAC then the BP-20 would be the wrong choice and the BP17 or the BP26 would be the better choice. Same if you have a great preamp already the BDA-3DAC or the BDP3.14 streamer/DAC would be the best option. If you look at the BDP-3 Digital Player for example vs the Pi built into the 3.14 or the BR-20 the BDP-3 is a far more powerful process and far more capable of handling large libraries, offers much fasted load times, has more features like internal hard drive, possible ROON server (fingers crossed) etc.

Wow great answer to a tough question.... as I understand James' summary, we are at the point where "combined" vs "separates" is no longer really a question of SQ, at least for a great number of owners.  Just the elimination of the vagaries of cabling alone must provide gains to combined designs, in addition to the electronic issues James mentions.

So if it is not really an SQ issue, then what else do separates get you?  To many it will simply be the ultimate flexibility to tinker and swap out any piece of the audio chain, that provides for many much of the fun in following audio.  This is certainly lost with all in one designs.  With this, is perhaps the sense of risk that you are committing more in dollars and as a big chunk of your gear, with a combined design, and if you end up unhappy with it, more is lost. 

My long time interest in "less boxes" comes from a home reality perspective, where I never did love the look of a wall of components sitting in the main room we live in and enjoy music in, and one of the reasons for going digital was to lose the wall of CDs.  So if I can have a simpler, smaller footprint system that gives up almost nothing in musical enjoyment, I will accept the commitment to keeping it for a long time.  And, others, might not... :wink:

zoom25

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Re: Announcing The Bryston BR-20 Preamp/DAC/Streamer
« Reply #45 on: 9 Oct 2020, 11:24 pm »
Hi Zoom

How come you always put me on the spot!!! :lol:


If you look at the BDP-3 Digital Player for example vs the Pi built into the 3.14 or the BR-20 the BDP-3 is a far more powerful process and far more capable of handling large libraries, offers much fasted load times, has more features like internal hard drive, possible ROON server (fingers crossed) etc.


I can just feel the love from all the way here. I can only imagine the joy the guys at Bryston must feel when they see a post from me pop up.  :rules:

Fair point about the disparity between the processors and how well they can handle larger libraries. Also looking forward to seeing Roon-in-a-box in the future. I suppose that would put it into the same market as Roon's Nucleus(+) with some more capability.

I won't push more about the BR-20. :green: I'm interested to see user reviews on that. That combination of DAC+BDP+BP was something I myself had been recommending since the last 5 years, so it's great to see that dream request finally happen. I agree with NorthMac, that less boxes can be a great thing. For gaming and media, I myself have gone digital and enjoy that simplicity. Looking forward to see how Bryston continues to progress with their all-in-one designs.

Gary did speak about the modular nature of the BR-20 and that is something I hope that Bryston does take seriously through the product's product life. Pushing the performance of the BR-20 by replacement of the pre amp section or DAC board is always welcome and cherry on top of already great performance. However, if it's possible in the future to replace the Pi4 with Pi5 or another faster processor, you can give the product a new life. It may be able to handle bigger libraries in he future, or even function as Roon server. For example, I have a BDP-1 and I'm still fine with the audio circuitry of digital out portion, but if I was able to only upgrade the processor so it could be faster or hold bigger libraries, without having to upgrade to a new product altogether such as the BDP-3, that'd have been very nice.

Cheering for you guys :thumb:

Alphonse

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Re: Announcing The Bryston BR-20 Preamp/DAC/Streamer
« Reply #46 on: 11 Oct 2020, 05:55 pm »
Another great product, but I would like to see more flexibility with the modular design. How about making all input types optional? Start with a basic platform with outputs and let the customer choose input options as needed. For example I would choose only an HDMI input board to start. I have not had analogue sources for a long time nor do I have digital sources with other input types. If that changes add input boards in the future as needed. Also I have no interest in the streaming option via the Pi4. Make that optional as well. Just food for thought.  Thanks,  Al

gdbalp

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Re: Announcing The Bryston BR-20 Preamp/DAC/Streamer
« Reply #47 on: 14 Oct 2020, 01:43 am »
Good point!

In fact one of the discussions I had with Gary was he felt it should be an Analog preamp first (due to it's new analog circuit design) and I felt it should be considered a Digital product - but maybe your right - its both!

Hey James,

Sounds like another great product from Bryston and a fitting tribute to Brain Russell... :thumb:

If we consider the cubic amplifiers, they use the Salomie circuit design to reduce the input noise levels.

And now, I ask if there are any new technologies that are being utilized in this new Pre-Amp design that allows it to achieve such low distortion/noise numbers?

Luigi


James Tanner

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Re: Announcing The Bryston BR-20 Preamp/DAC/Streamer
« Reply #48 on: 14 Oct 2020, 10:39 am »
Good point!

In fact one of the discussions I had with Gary was he felt it should be an Analog preamp first (due to it's new analog circuit design) and I felt it should be considered a Digital product - but maybe your right - its both!

Hey James,

Sounds like another great product from Bryston and a fitting tribute to Brain Russell... :thumb:

If we consider the cubic amplifiers, they use the Salomie circuit design to reduce the input noise levels.

And now, I ask if there are any new technologies that are being utilized in this new Pre-Amp design that allows it to achieve such low distortion/noise numbers?

Luigi


Hi Luigi

Yes the BR-20 is a new circuit design.

james

Alphonse

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Re: Announcing The Bryston BR-20 Preamp/DAC/Streamer
« Reply #49 on: 14 Oct 2020, 09:05 pm »
James, what is the price of the optional HDMI board in US dollars?  Thanks,  Al

James Tanner

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Re: Announcing The Bryston BR-20 Preamp/DAC/Streamer
« Reply #50 on: 14 Oct 2020, 09:58 pm »
James, what is the price of the optional HDMI board in US dollars?  Thanks,  Al

I believe it is $1200 retail.

james

Ilkatze

Re: Announcing The Bryston BR-20 Preamp/DAC/Streamer
« Reply #51 on: 15 Oct 2020, 04:13 am »
This is an interesting product.  I have separate boxes now--BP-26, MPS-2, BDA-3, and BDP-3.

A couple of questions for James now.  It seems like I could replace all of them with a BR-20, is that right?

More importantly, my BDP-3 has the built-in Wi-Fi option (with external antennas)--very, very nice to have that.  Might that be an option or possibility with the BR-20?

Having fewer boxes on the rack would be nice, and an built-in/internal Wi-Fi option, such as what the BDP-3 has, could be what would take me toward a BR-20 direction.

Ilkatze




James Tanner

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Re: Announcing The Bryston BR-20 Preamp/DAC/Streamer
« Reply #52 on: 15 Oct 2020, 10:38 am »
This is an interesting product.  I have separate boxes now--BP-26, MPS-2, BDA-3, and BDP-3.

A couple of questions for James now.  It seems like I could replace all of them with a BR-20, is that right?

More importantly, my BDP-3 has the built-in Wi-Fi option (with external antennas)--very, very nice to have that.  Might that be an option or possibility with the BR-20?

Having fewer boxes on the rack would be nice, and an built-in/internal Wi-Fi option, such as what the BDP-3 has, could be what would take me toward a BR-20 direction.

Ilkatze

Hi Ilkatze

The BR-20 does combine a lot of features but the separates still have options that the BR-20 does not.  So on the BDP-3 for example the wireless option and the internal drive option is available whereas on the BR-20 it is not.  On the BDP-3 you have a much more capable computer for library management and streaming etc. while the BR-20 uses a Pi computer so less powerful.

james

NorthMac

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Re: Announcing The Bryston BR-20 Preamp/DAC/Streamer
« Reply #53 on: 16 Oct 2020, 12:06 am »
Re. Ilkatze's post, did the Bryston wifi dongle get discontinued? 

James Tanner

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Re: Announcing The Bryston BR-20 Preamp/DAC/Streamer
« Reply #54 on: 16 Oct 2020, 12:59 am »
Re. Ilkatze's post, did the Bryston wifi dongle get discontinued?

I believe that is still available not sure if it will work with the Pi - that's a Chris question.

james

bokko

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Re: Announcing The Bryston BR-20 Preamp/DAC/Streamer
« Reply #55 on: 16 Oct 2020, 04:27 pm »
The Pi-4 has built in WiFi/ Bluetooth might just require external antennaes.
sure the BR-20 case is well shielded so might be an inexpensive work around.
There is a YouTube video on how to add antennas to the Pi PIO bus sure I don't need to provide.

Jerry

R. Daneel

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Re: Announcing The Bryston BR-20 Preamp/DAC/Streamer
« Reply #56 on: 17 Oct 2020, 05:53 am »
Dear James,

this is a great hommage to a great man. I am shocked to learn about this and I am truly sorry for your loss. My thoughts are with his family and all of you at Bryston. We always ask the question "why" but we may not get the answer. What is important though is that we remember him as a person and as the driving force of one of the world's finest audio companies.

Sincerely,
Antun