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Well said. As you probably know, Vinnie Rossi has a ton of real experience in the battery powered audio marketplace, likely with more production battery powered units sold than anyone out there. After a long run, he moved on to the super capacitor powered LIO, very successful as well. I owned both. Now, he has gone back to traditional AC line powered gear, where you are, with solid engineering, great sound, reliable and easy gear to live with. The new L2 range is already receiving great reviews. If it were me I'd stay the course, which seems to be working very well for you. Do what you do best.
I have two thoughts to share. First, if you read through the various reviews of cherry amps and forum comments by owners, given that buyers and reviewers saying great things about his amps are spread across the country and therefore using power from different grids and probably using different cables as well, I suspect that de facto....Tommy’s statement that he has designed his amps not to need special power, cables, etc., are well supported and focusing his time on a battery option has a low prospect for an actual payback.
Second, my personal experience... I tried different power cords and different cables and to my great surprise could hear no difference... which as I noted above is not a unique experience.
To be blunt, I’m skeptical of any system that’s sensitive to minute differences in cables, assuming they are low enough resistance to realize the full potential of the amps (speaker cables, power cords), or of decent quality (interconnects) to get the signal to them. This is a sign that something’s wrong, such as improper grounding, impedance too low at the destination, impedance too high at the source, inadequate shielding, bad connectors, etc.
If I choose to build some battery powered Cherry Amps, I want to hear them myself first. I want to measure them as well.
I don’t believe tremendous available current is necessary. It’s not as simple as just hooking up batteries, in the case there’s no DC/DC between them and the amp, but not rocket science either.
Anyway, I’m still wondering if it’s worth the trouble because the Maraschino, for example, is a very high performance amp as-is, and we’ve tested (including lots of listening, of course) with several different power supplies already.
So, if only 2 people will ever buy a battery based power supply, it doesn’t make sense to spend the time/money to develop what will be yet another option, thus complicating the product line.
We went through something similar with a linear power supply for Maraschino amps. We sold a few, but interest was light, and it wound up fading away. It was a good power supply, and super heavy for its size, but resulted in lower power output. Other specifications were the same, and so was the sound, except when large peaks while driving difficult speakers (Mags) were too much to handle. Meanwhile our standard 60V 1kW switching supply powered though the same tracks without a sweat!
FYI, I have had some of Tommy's earlier amps over here some time ago. And I found them to be just as susceptible to changes in power cables and conditioners as any other piece of gear that I'd had over here. In fact this type of amplifier has been more susceptible to what is on the AC line than any other type of gear.
If your system is affected by power cords or conditioners despite tight regulation/decoupling, floating ground, super high PSRR, and proper signal handling, then there may be other issues at hand.
Danny... I don’t get it. You are kind of like a dog with a bone that can’t let go... and it’s not your company, or your product... and not even some outrageous claim by Tommy that his customers and reviewers disagree with.
Otherwise... it seems like you are trolling him which is out of character with your posts on other topics.
Tommy sent me a message asking me to join in on a thread in his forum where it was being asked about installing tube connectors (one of our products) on his amps. And in that thread I asked him about a battery powered version of his amps. So he started a new thread on it and linked to it so that the topic would have its own thread. Not trolling. I've been trying to put something together with Tommy for a while. I invited him down for LSAF and to come here to GR Research for a visit several times since last summer. He hasn't been able to make it.
Danny... I don’t get it. You are kind of like a dog with a bone that can’t let go... and it’s not your company, or your product... and not even some outrageous claim by Tommy that his customers and reviewers disagree with. I understand you are passionate about this issue... so a great idea would be for you to buy one of Tommy’s amps, improve it and then see if he is interested in buying your improvements...Otherwise... it seems like you are trolling him which is out of character with your posts on other topics. I will say it again... Tommy makes great sounding amps which people all over the country... on different power grids and with different wires are very happy with.
Looks like a battery project isn't in the cards at this time. There are so many other products I'd like to design, and I've been sidetracked before for various reasons. One reason is technical interest. Sometimes the lure of a new circuit design is tempting. There are hidden issues with any project, and something as seemingly simple as running amplifiers from batteries is no exception, especially if they were originally designed for AC power.I have an expanding product line, and must be careful not to complicate it unnecessarily. There's also a lot going on behind the scenes. I'm the kind of guy who works around the clock.Expectation Bias: It's a real problem. That's why I bring up double blind testing and measurement so often. This is why I kept asking for resistance measurements of Danny's binding posts. I don't believe in magic.I rely on my education and experience. My methodical, scientific approach is the reason that Cherry products are respected.Doing stuff like swapping XLR cables iteratively and listening for a difference is a waste of time. Learning engineering principles, the math behind it, and making measurements is time well spent. Once you understand the science behind it, there's no need to test if water is wet. Instead, you know what makes a difference. If you don't understand the science, it's like working in the dark. You might get lucky, but it's unlikely. Those with a strong engineering background and education hardly ever fall for snake oil. There's so much BS going on in cables, too, and it's been that way for decades. Only now, the internet has made it easier to argue. The people with crazy pseudo-scientific justifications for non-issues are con artists. As someone who designs and produces legitimate hardware, I find all the misinformation out there disturbing.I can write about this stuff all day, but it's late on a Friday night here, and at some point I need to get off the computer. No, I'm not sitting on it. I'm almost sleeping on it, though (:
Agree with this assessment. My recommendation would be for you to look into making a product that has the DAC and volume control (plus the power amp) in a single unit . The concept of having the DAC and volume control in a single unit makes a lot sense to me. The interface to the power amp can be simple, and of high quality. I think there is a big market for this approach, (a la Devialet), especially if it could come in at a lower price point.
Again, your amps were effected by those changes here as well. We have also found that A/C power conditioning and filtering to be pretty tricky. Too much can cause as much of an issue as not enough. I've tried power cables with a high level of filtering of RFI and EMI plugged straight into the wall on a piece of gear and got fairly good results. But plugged into the balanced power supply it was too much and sucked the upper detail, spacial ques, and life right out of the music. But a power cable with much less filtering characteristics worked great with the balanced power supply...
Question: how much PSRR have your class-D amps? Numbers.Maraschinohttps://www.cherryamp.com/maraschinoI cant not see the specs.MEGAschino MK2https://www.cherryamp.com/dac-home
It's rather sad and maddening that in 2019, the record companies don't seem to understand that the poor sound quality of these recordings are likely hurting sales and driving music fans away from artists and their music in general. Despite hi-fi technology improving over the years, the technical qualities of mainstream music have as a whole diminished...
Looks like a battery project isn't in the cards at this time.
Expectation Bias: It's a real problem. That's why I bring up double blind testing and measurement so often. This is why I kept asking for resistance measurements of Danny's binding posts. I don't believe in magic.I rely on my education and experience. My methodical, scientific approach is the reason that Cherry products are respected.Doing stuff like swapping XLR cables iteratively and listening for a difference is a waste of time. Learning engineering principles, the math behind it, and making measurements is time well spent. Once you understand the science behind it, there's no need to test if water is wet. Instead, you know what makes a difference. If you don't understand the science, it's like working in the dark. You might get lucky, but it's unlikely. Those with a strong engineering background and education hardly ever fall for snake oil. There's so much BS going on in cables, too, and it's been that way for decades. Only now, the internet has made it easier to argue. The people with crazy pseudo-scientific justifications for non-issues are con artists. As someone who designs and produces legitimate hardware, I find all the misinformation out there disturbing.
In the end this is all about listening to music. Some of us in the industry are driven to improve how things sound. If listening or listening comparisons are a waste of time for you then that might explain why requests to see any pictures of your listening room and your audio system have gone unanswered. I don't expect that you would change your views on that stuff because some guy on the Internet told you something different. Unless you come down for a visit and get placed in front of a system that will allow you to hear differences in all of the things that you have sworn can't possibly matter then nothing will ever change for you. And unless that happens there really isn't any way that I can help you. But I will extend to you an open invitation if you ever change your mind.
Have you tried the Rane PI14 processor in your system?
